[CLTMDA]

While battery life and replacement may be a factor, the bigger issue is the charging network, or lack thereof, thereby upsetting supply and demand. While having the NACS charger is a plus with respect to the Tesla Supercharger network, the entire network is not being opened up by Tesla. It is getting better, but the main reason I got rid of my Lucid was not the car, it was the lack of a charging network in the southeast. The car was better than the M5 it replaced, IMO.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by jmack123

I think you are vastly overestimating the number of “enthusiasts” buying cars. The VAST majority of buyers are commuters, not enthusiasts. They will drive sales. As you may (not apparently) have noticed, most new EVs can travel 300+ miles. In 5 years, most EVs will travel 400+ miles. In 10 years, most will travel 400-450+ miles and charge at 350kw+. The charging infrastructure (particularly Tesla V4 Superchargers) will be far more mature. This will essentially be the parity point (from a convenience standpoint) with ICE vehicles.

Sorry, but the idea that PHEV is the way forward is a pipe-dream. If anything, EREV will be more prevalent.

I don't think that most people are enthusiasts at all. I'm just aware that people making choices with their own money aren't willing to put their money down on an EV as their primary car unless they have ICE cars for a backup. 300 miles of range sounds like enough until you realize it's really only 60% of that on a road trip because you're not gonna charge to 100% or drive down to 0%, then you have environmental factors, the reality that their range drops on all highway use, etc. and then you're talking about having to stop for 15-30 minutes to charge every 2.5 hours or so. Not a great solution. Add in people who can't charge at home, and you're dealing with a lot of people who aren't going to convert.

If there was a fullsize SUV that was an ER EV, I would consider one for my wife. She doesn't need more than like 5060 miles of range for most days, but we also take it on longer trips where it's current 450 mile range is a big bonus

EREVs are definitely the right way to do an EV, but I think PHEVs are the logical stepping stone for people.

[JMD]

Originally Posted by AshwinLB

I think having this dedicated platform plus the fact it will have the NACS connector (formerly Tesla connector), it will have a real fighting chance to compete with Tesla. The only benefit Tesla had was its charging network and now everyone can pretty much use it with the introduction of NACS

Manufacturers really need to brainstorm some things regarding some common connectivity,...and charging issues FIRST! This way, they don't have to 'Adapt" and overcome minor concerns that cause major issues.

For instance, Apple wanted to be different for many years,...and many generations with their "Charging" cables, only to be given an ultimatum that forced them to USB-C,...like everyone and their brother was already using,...for years!

Now, look at the mess the late comers to EVs and BEVs have caused,...with the NACS port and J1772 port,...only to conform years later to NACS!

I tell you, if these DAIs (dumb-@ss-issues) didn't happen in real time, no one would believe them.

Also, one day, every New Home will have at least one Level II charging port in the garage,...and every new housing subdivision,...and apartment complex will have an onsite charging pad! And lastly, there will be Charging Stations at every Gas Station/Convenience Store!

Now, imagine that!

[jmack123]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

I don't think that most people are enthusiasts at all. I'm just aware that people making choices with their own money aren't willing to put their money down on an EV as their primary car unless they have ICE cars for a backup. 300 miles of range sounds like enough until you realize it's really only 60% of that on a road trip because you're not gonna charge to 100% or drive down to 0%, then you have environmental factors, the reality that their range drops on all highway use, etc. and then you're talking about having to stop for 15-30 minutes to charge every 2.5 hours or so. Not a great solution. Add in people who can't charge at home, and you're dealing with a lot of people who aren't going to convert.

If there was a fullsize SUV that was an ER EV, I would consider one for my wife. She doesn't need more than like 5060 miles of range for most days, but we also take it on longer trips where it's current 450 mile range is a big bonus

EREVs are definitely the right way to do an EV, but I think PHEVs are the logical stepping stone for people.

I’d agree, home level 2 (slow) charging is a challenge that needs to be addressed, however when range is 450+, how often does one need to charge? In that case, fast charging once a week for 15-20 mins isn’t a showstopper.

In the context of a roadtrip, 450+ miles which can be replenished completely in 20-25 mins means one can feasibly drive 800+ miles on a 20-25 min stop. Again, not a showstopper.

There are already vehicles (e.g. Li Auto Mega) which can drive 300-350 miles and FULLY recharge (0-100%) in 23 mins total:
https://evkx.net/models/li_auto/mega...chargingcurve/
Obviously the charging infra will have to support that, but I am bullish on Tesla in particular making that happen.

[CLTMDA]

All of those numbers are based on ideal conditions, almost never reality. My Lucid would show 500+ miles of range, but that was not reality due to temperature, diving conditions, driving style, etc. It would charge 200+ miles in less than 20 minutes, again under ideal conditions. Most chargers out there do not reach the level possible. Some share power between chargers at the same location, some simply are not that efficient, much will depend on the level you are at when you start charging.

I am not even addressing the possibility that chargers are out of service, some or all at a planned location. I am not addressing the demand at said chargers. Waiting for a charger is not like waiting at a gas station. Many people plug in and leave their vehicles to eat or shop, meaning that many chargers end up with cars parked and the chargers not used/inaccessible.

Again, not even addressing the lack of chargers in certain geographic areas. I did not take my Lucid on a trip from Charlotte to Laurel, MS to New Orleans to Seaside, FL and back to Charlotte because of the charging environment. Sure, it could have been done, but not without some serious anxiety.

EV's are fine for local use when you have a Level 2 charger at home, which I do, but the infrastructure just isn't there in some cases. I sold my Lucid due to that lack of infrastructure, not because I didn't love the car.

[mlanes01]

Originally Posted by JMD

Manufacturers really need to brainstorm some things regarding some common connectivity,...and charging issues FIRST! This way, they don't have to 'Adapt" and overcome minor concerns that cause major issues.

For instance, Apple wanted to be different for many years,...and many generations with their "Charging" cables, only to be given an ultimatum that forced them to USB-C,...like everyone and their brother was already using,...for years!

Now, look at the mess the late comers to EVs and BEVs have caused,...with the NACS port and J1772 port,...only to conform years later to NACS!

I tell you, if these DAIs (dumb-@ss-issues) didn't happen in real time, no one would believe them.

Also, one day, every New Home will have at least one Level II charging port in the garage,...and every new housing subdivision,...and apartment complex will have an onsite charging pad! And lastly, there will be Charging Stations at every Gas Station/Convenience Store!

Now, imagine that!

Yes why aren't there chargers at gas stations. Why do Tesla and EA put fast chargers at shopping malls.... Gas stations are in convenient locations for a reason... Put level 2 at malls and shopping centers... DC at gas stations right off the highway