[e90335e36m3]

The dude that said TX property taxes are low needs to do some due diligence. They are some of the highest in the country. I know on a property of $450K, they were $12K last year.

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by thegump

Looks like we may be making a visit soon. I appreciate all the input

For those in the area or in the know, what areas surrounding Tesla are within a decent commute pre-covid (<45min) that we should check out?

Our wish list for home base:
Walkable/short drive to restaurants, boutiques and box stores
Near parks or trails
Prefer close proximity to Tesla to reduce commute times

Thoughts on Union City, East San Jose, Niles, Milpitas and Downtown Fremont?

Milpitas smells like a dump all summer (because of the actual dump/landfill). There are nice pockets everywhere, I live in San Ramon and I don't spend any time in the other places you mentioned.

Niles has a cool little downtown, I have never spent any time there.

If you want a nice downtown, walk to places Pleasanton is very nice (maybe a little farther then you want to go).

There is also pretty good mountain biking/hiking in the East Bay, Pleasanton Ridge, Las Trampas, Mt Diablo, etc

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by CT_M3

California is expensive for sure. I've had the luck to live in both CA and TX. The way I look at it, CA is a state where I would go when there is a major recession and prices are depressed. The cost of living is high when the boom times are on. People complain about it, but if you're in, you're not complaining much. We complain about housing, but if your house has increased by 200-400%, you're not really. This is pretty true for most of the West Coast, not just CA though, so my comments will apply to them as well.

It's a state that gets drunk on boom times, more so than other states, due to the wealth here.

Yes, the state taxes are high, the roads sometimes could be better and sometimes, I wonder if another state is a better alternative. There could be better states out there, but the state has 1) pretty darn good weather 2) the culture with its diversity and food, you will find no where else in the other states in the US. 3) the natural beauty here, even with the wildfires, is pretty amazing. Easy access to beautiful trails, vistas within 30 minutes drive or less.

Negatives:
1) Cost of living for sure: But for CA, if you don't dine out often, its manageable. The key is housing. Once you solve that, it's good.

Compared to other states:
I lived in TX for a while and I shudder at the stories of the hordes moving there. TX was decent when I was there, but now? It's jammed with folks, housing for miles (yes, if you like new homes that are replicated for miles, that works for you). Traffic was bad when I left and I can't imagine now (I'm talking Dallas, Austin). Weather? *Snorts*. If you like 90F-120F for most of the year, that works. Now, that's 90-120F for most of the day, not just the peak temps. I remember walking in the evening with temps in the mid 80s often. There is no reprieve.

2) Taxes: Yes, TX has no income tax. But how do they get you? RE tax, its adjusted every year to reflect market values (@~3%). So even though prices have taken off in TX, guess what? So have your taxes. Someone owning a $2M home in the Bay pays somewhat equivalent tax to a home in TX for $700-800K. CA has prop 13 for better or worse, but essentially, you are locked into the rate you pay @ the time of purchase for life, not so in TX. My neighbor's home is valued over $2M but they pay $2K in taxes, I kid you not.

Weather: The weather also in additional costs. Additional water costs, repair costs (in case of foundational settling) as well as A/C costs (an essential in TX) also factor in. Housing materials also wear down faster in TX, roofing tiles last only 20 vs 30 years for anywhere else.

TX weather has been getting worse (like most of the world). When I was there, snow fall during Christmas was like a fun event for 1 day. Now you have possibly 1 week of snow and the weather drops to near 30s in Dallas. Winter in the DFW area is miserable. I've always consider TX an indoor state lol.

vs. CA: I view the state taxes etc. as the cost of living in a state where natural beauty exists. One more thing that TX doesn't have much of (flat except for Austin hill country). The routes here for driving are just awesome.

TLDR:
There are trade-offs. I think as an individual, to make choices based on the flavor of the moment, tends to have the less then optimal outcome. I don't consider CA the best either; the state has flaws like others have mentioned. But, at the same time, every post above is based on personal experience and ultimately, it depends on what YOU value/are looking for.

Edit: For me/us, CA is better because it suits what we're looking for BUT our timing was exceptional and we had savings to deploy. The last big recession was actually an opportunity but it was so devastating that folks that were overleveraged were wiped out. People fled the state because of their losses. Not the silly 'buy the dip' social media wisdom, but clear, methodical analysis.

thegump DM me if you need tips. I live in the area and can provide some ideas.

As a millennial just entering the stride of my career, California's COL has definitely left most of us behind in the dust. Even being in say the top 2% of income earners in the U.S. it is difficult to justify staying here. To live a good life here I feel it takes at least $1/2 million+ household income. Gotta find a spouse in a similar field or in big tech I guess. And some of the politics here just seem hell-bent on punishing hard working people.

But I agree that California has so so many redeeming qualities. I've lived in major metropolitan areas of the upper Midwest and PNW before and they are woefully boring compared to here. Both SoCal and the Bay Area have their own vibe and qualities which are highly desirable. And for car enthusiasts, LA simply has the best canyon roads and car scene in the country. Texas one can own a proper home for a fraction of the cost sure, but it's mostly a land of endless suburban sprawl, no natural beauty, and lousy climate. Not my scene.

[CT_M3]

Sigh, yes there is that. What you said is true. The problem with the West Coast is that it gets very excessively expensive during expansions and gets excessively bad during recessions. I can sympathize as I see friends who are not in the 'in' industries struggle to keep up with the COL. You have to be patient here, the bull market is 12 years old and we're high overdue for a significant correction. Already, you're seeing major price damage in a lot of the tech names.

I lived in the MW for a while; loved the people and the simplicity and pace of life but overall as a package, it comes 2nd to the West Coast. I sort of believe that if you leave the West Coast, you're likely not coming back. The cost of entry, that initial adjustment, can be too much to bear.

Originally Posted by Germanauto

As a millennial just entering the stride of my career, California's COL has definitely left most of us behind in the dust. Even being in say the top 2% of income earners in the U.S. it is difficult to justify staying here. To live a good life here I feel it takes at least $1/2 million+ household income. Gotta find a spouse in a similar field or in big tech I guess. And some of the politics here just seem hell-bent on punishing hard working people.

But I agree that California has so so many redeeming qualities. I've lived in major metropolitan areas of the upper Midwest and PNW before and they are woefully boring compared to here. Both SoCal and the Bay Area have their own vibe and qualities which are highly desirable. And for car enthusiasts, LA simply has the best canyon roads and car scene in the country. Texas one can own a proper home for a fraction of the cost sure, but it's mostly a land of endless suburban sprawl, no natural beauty, and lousy climate. Not my scene.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by CT_M3

Sigh, yes there is that. What you said is true. The problem with the West Coast is that it gets very excessively expensive during expansions and gets excessively bad during recessions. I can sympathize as I see friends who are not in the 'in' industries struggle to keep up with the COL. You have to be patient here, the bull market is 12 years old and we're high overdue for a significant correction. Already, you're seeing major price damage in a lot of the tech names.

I lived in the MW for a while; loved the people and the simplicity and pace of life but overall as a package, it comes 2nd to the West Coast. I sort of believe that if you leave the West Coast, you're likely not coming back. The cost of entry, that initial adjustment, can be too much to bear.

Definitely way overdue but there is ultimately so much wealth in CA, high demand, limited land, and thanks to copious NIMBYism and endless red tape for new construction (and therefore lack of supply), home prices will just continue to get exponentially unaffordable. Great if you are already a homeowner, but bad if you're in your 20s or early 30s and just starting to save up after years of education and loans.

Any other major metropolis in the country I could live like a king, but in the immediate LA and Bay Areas it's very very difficult. If only I were born 10 years sooner lol.

On a side note, definitely agree the MW has an aura of simplicity to it and some charm especially as the seasons change. People are far less crazy than they are here. But at a certain point I had been there, done that.

[CT_M3]

Hang in there. I subscribe to mean reversion theory. I'm hazarding a guess that within this year, we'll have a significant pullback. The Fed has been putting the punchbowl out for far too long and we're paying the consequences of it. Now, they have no choice but the hike and hike fast.

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Definitely way overdue but there is ultimately so much wealth in CA, high demand, limited land, and thanks to copious NIMBYism and endless red tape for new construction (and therefore lack of supply), home prices will just continue to get exponentially unaffordable. Great if you are already a homeowner, but bad if you're in your 20s or early 30s and just starting to save up after years of education and loans.

Any other major metropolis in the country I could live like a king, but in the immediate LA and Bay Areas it's very very difficult. If only I were born 10 years sooner lol.

On a side note, definitely agree the MW has an aura of simplicity to it and some charm especially as the seasons change. People are far less crazy than they are here. But at a certain point I had been there, done that.

[e90335e36m3]

Originally Posted by CT_M3

Sigh, yes there is that. What you said is true. The problem with the West Coast is that it gets very excessively expensive during expansions and gets excessively bad during recessions. I can sympathize as I see friends who are not in the 'in' industries struggle to keep up with the COL. You have to be patient here, the bull market is 12 years old and we're high overdue for a significant correction. Already, you're seeing major price damage in a lot of the tech names.

I lived in the MW for a while; loved the people and the simplicity and pace of life but overall as a package, it comes 2nd to the West Coast. I sort of believe that if you leave the West Coast, you're likely not coming back. The cost of entry, that initial adjustment, can be too much to bear.

I personally know of three people, myself included, who moved to CA and WA in the last 2 years, only to move back to where we came from within 2 years, COL being the primary reason. One moved from Detroit to the Bay Area, leaving a job at GM to take one at Rivian. I moved from Charlotte to San Diego, albeit, I never sold my home in Charlotte, and was expecting to move back. That said, hoping to see a correction in the San Diego housing market in the next few years, if so, will buy a townhome and move back there.
Housing is the biggest impediment to living in CA. I am not throwing $2800 out of the window to live in an apartment, have to build equity in a home. However, I am not going to compete in today's housing market. They say you can't really time the market, and if a move to SD is not in the cards, then so be it.

[CT_M3]

Makes sense. It's crazy now. If I were in the market, I'd be cringing. The folks buying are tech folks who cashed out their stock or foreign investors. I would not be able to afford my place without being house poor.

It will correct; its just one of those places where it takes a little longer to correct because lots of people have their eye on it so any little drop, people buy in.

EDIT: the reason for this is fundamentally the Fed (going back to Yellen and Bernanke. It's not the administrations (though Trump did pressure Powell). Their support for the equity markets has partially led to this rise in prices of everything. "Transitory": Yeah right, Jerome. Now you have a fire on your hands.

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

I personally know of three people, myself included, who moved to CA and WA in the last 2 years, only to move back to where we came from within 2 years, COL being the primary reason. One moved from Detroit to the Bay Area, leaving a job at GM to take one at Rivian. I moved from Charlotte to San Diego, albeit, I never sold my home in Charlotte, and was expecting to move back. That said, hoping to see a correction in the San Diego housing market in the next few years, if so, will buy a townhome and move back there.
Housing is the biggest impediment to living in CA. I am not throwing $2800 out of the window to live in an apartment, have to build equity in a home. However, I am not going to compete in today's housing market. They say you can't really time the market, and if a move to SD is not in the cards, then so be it.