[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by BMW DIY Guy

Maciej said take out the filters on the mids? The plugin inline from addon? Now isn't THAT interesting, and something I will do immediately if so!

Yep it was Maciej - cool guy.

Yes, rip 'em out of there. I'll be shocked if you don't notice a difference.

Leave the passive cross-over that goes between the midrange and the tweeter, though, obviously. Make sure you remove the correct one.

[BMW DIY Guy]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

Yep it was Maciej - cool guy.

Yes, rip 'em out of there. I'll be shocked if you don't notice a difference.

Leave the passive cross-over that goes between the midrange and the tweeter, though, obviously. Make sure you remove the correct one.

PM'd you to chat direct about this, but I am positively boggled if we are talking about the same thing. I shot a message off to Maciej too to get additional info, as I have not only my car, but two more installs coming up soon.

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by BMW DIY Guy

PM'd you to chat direct about this, but I am positively boggled if we are talking about the same thing. I shot a message off to Maciej too to get additional info, as I have not only my car, but two more installs coming up soon.

Replied!

[BroDoze]

Ditch the red filter, keep the green filter.

[///MoT]

BroDoze is this the delay you were talking about, to fix the pop sound?:

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by ///MoT

BroDoze is this the delay you were talking about, to fix the pop sound?:

Yessir! If you click the drop down, you’ll see 0.2sec has ‘default’ in parentheses next to it.

[///MoT]

Great, I'm going to go change it right now! I've been having the pop for the last month now, been driving me nuts! Amp didn't do it for the first week or so after I put it in, but that setting must have somehow gotten changed during all the tweaking, changing profiles, etc.

Thanks man! I'll update the thread with my results.


-Tom

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by ///MoT

Great, I'm going to go change it right now! I've been having the pop for the last month now, been driving me nuts! Amp didn't do it for the first week or so after I put it in, but that setting must have somehow gotten changed during all the tweaking, changing profiles, etc.

Thanks man! I'll update the thread with my results.


-Tom

Mac said 0.2sec should be enough but sometimes it takes a little more.

[///MoT]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

Mac said 0.2sec should be enough but sometimes it takes a little more.

Yeah, I set it to 0.2, and pop was still there when opening the door.

I noticed the Turn Off Time Default was 1.5, so I tried the same setting for the Turn On Time, and that did the trick! Might be able to go lower, but it's working at 1.5 so I'm just gonna keep it there.


-Tom

[AdonisP91]

I would just like to caution everyone. If you haven't already bought speaker upgrades, like the Alpha One speakers, or their future line, be very mindful. Simply buying more expensive speakers will not solve the big problem with the sound system.

If you want the system to sound good, you will need to be strategic. Let's explore why. I'm taking an arbitrary Target curve to illustrate my point. I chose one with a slight boost in the low end and then it is flat. It looks like this:



Now we ask, how does our HK system sound in the BMW's? I ran measurements on a stock 230i and inside a stock M2, they looked the same. Here is the M2:



That dip between 80 hz and 160hz, it is a massive problem. The dip is not only -10db, but more importantly it is an entire Octave wide. Having a 80hz wide dip at 4k is far less detrimental then losing it in the lower range.

Ok you say, let's buy more expensive speakers!!! Here is the measurement (pink) of an X5 with the Bowers & Wilkins upgrade, stock configuration:



Same massive destructive interference problem.

There are many ways to try to get around the problem which we can talk about more, but for now I just wanted to make my point.

For those who had tuning sessions with BimmerTech, what does your frequency response look like when you play Pink Noise and run an RTA on the system post tuning? Did they sort out the massive interference problem?

[IanH]

Originally Posted by AdonisP91

I would just like to caution everyone. If you haven't already bought speaker upgrades, like the Alpha One speakers, or their future line, be very mindful. Simply buying more expensive speakers will not solve the big problem with the sound system.

If you want the system to sound good, you will need to be strategic. Let's explore why. I'm taking an arbitrary Target curve to illustrate my point. I chose one with a slight boost in the low end and then it is flat. It looks like this:

Attachment 3657324

Now we ask, how does our HK system sound in the BMW's? I ran measurements on a stock 230i and inside a stock M2, they looked the same. Here is the M2:

Attachment 3657325

That dip between 80 hz and 160hz, it is a massive problem. The dip is not only -10db, but more importantly it is an entire Octave wide. Having a 80hz wide dip at 4k is far less detrimental then losing it in the lower range.

Ok you say, let's buy more expensive speakers!!! Here is the measurement (pink) of an X5 with the Bowers & Wilkins upgrade, stock configuration:

Attachment 3657327

Same massive destructive interference problem.

There are many ways to try to get around the problem which we can talk about more, but for now I just wanted to make my point.

For those who had tuning sessions with BimmerTech, what does your frequency response look like when you play Pink Noise and run an RTA on the system post tuning? Did they sort out the massive interference problem?

Amazing to see what my ears are telling me. That dip is absolutely massive and is why everything has almost no body to it.

[kenkamm]

Originally Posted by AdonisP91

Now we ask, how does our HK system sound in the BMW's? I ran measurements on a stock 230i and inside a stock M2, they looked the same. Here is the M2:

Attachment 3657325

That dip between 80 hz and 160hz, it is a massive problem. The dip is not only -10db, but more importantly it is an entire Octave wide. Having a 80hz wide dip at 4k is far less detrimental then losing it in the lower range.

I wonder if that huge dip is caused by the stock crossover points!

Originally Posted by AdonisP91

Here is where it gets interesting. The other forum user reports that all the input signals for the full range speakers look similar like this:


You immediately note there is a built in high pass filter. Similarly, the sub input signals are reported to look like this:

If you look at it, the mids start to roll off at 160 Hz, yet the sub isn't kicking in until 100 Hz. (Looking at the -3dB points roughly, the resolution there is poor.)

If that's the reason for the dip, it's even worse news. Because that's the stock HK electronic crossover and we have no control over that.

[BroDoze]

Yep - remember my “there’s a gap” mid-bass complaints? “Let’s make under-seat woofers mid-bass drivers”?
That dip is what I’ve heard since day 1.
And no, better speakers won’t solve the dip, but they help solve other things.

Resonix’s “fix the source” box is looking more and more betta by the day.

So again, if you bypass the under-seat woofer PC-Tools’s low-pass filter, you can hear a lot more audio freq coming through - all the way up to 250-300hz I’d say. Not full-range, but way more past the PC-Tool’s out of the box 80hz roll-off (or whatever it is.). <— I know that conflicts with the input curve image posted, but that’s what I’m hearing.

I’ve got my new Alpha-1 woofers running up to 125hz or so to help fill that gap. I may run them higher, but if I bypass their lo-pass altogether, they’re probably too high. I’d think they’d start to become directional if I left them wide open.

Time to RTA though. I wish I would’ve had Mac email the specific mic calibration file yesterday. Now it’s the weekend, he’s gone, but I have time to mess with EQ’ing the car. I may still give it a shot.

[kenkamm]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

I wish I would’ve had Mac email the specific mic calibration file yesterday. Now it’s the weekend, he’s gone, but I have time to mess with EQ’ing the car. I may still give it a shot.

What mic did you buy and did it not come with a calibration file?

[AdonisP91]

Originally Posted by kenkamm

I wonder if that huge dip is caused by the stock crossover points!

If you look at it, the mids start to roll off at 160 Hz, yet the sub isn't kicking in until 100 Hz. (Looking at the -3dB points roughly, the resolution there is poor.)

If that's the reason for the dip, it's even worse news. Because that's the stock HK electronic crossover and we have no control over that.

We will find out as soon as I get my car! I will test on digital signal with manual crossovers and test all the different crossover types linkwitz, bezel, butterworth, etc. I will also be able to move the crossovers around to different frequencies.

After all that I can try to fix the input signal from the factory amp. If not we might have to resort to other options, but we will know soon enough

[AdonisP91]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

Yep - remember my “there’s a gap” mid-bass complaints? “Let’s make under-seat woofers mid-bass drivers”?
That dip is what I’ve heard since day 1.
And no, better speakers won’t solve the dip, but they help solve other things.

Resonix’s “fix the source” box is looking more and more betta by the day.

So again, if you bypass the under-seat woofer PC-Tools’s low-pass filter, you can hear a lot more audio freq coming through - all the way up to 250-300hz I’d say. Not full-range, but way more past the PC-Tool’s out of the box 80hz roll-off (or whatever it is.). <— I know that conflicts with the input curve image posted, but that’s what I’m hearing.

I’ve got my new Alpha-1 woofers running up to 125hz or so to help fill that gap. I may run them higher, but if I bypass their lo-pass altogether, they’re probably too high. I’d think they’d start to become directional if I left them wide open.

Time to RTA though. I wish I would’ve had Mac email the specific mic calibration file yesterday. Now it’s the weekend, he’s gone, but I have time to mess with EQ’ing the car. I may still give it a shot.

No need for the Resonix box. We can achieve digital lossless audio for 20$. There are sacrifices, as always. If you connect a spdif usb to optical adapter to your phone and run an optical cable to the DSP, you now have digital sound but no more system sounds. I am fine with that. I see my blinkers on the dash and other warnings on the idrive display.

For short drives I will still use the analog connection but for long drives I’ll just go digital and play in lossless.

Yes the Resonix box is nice, it has digital and system sounds but it is quite pricey and there are more important upgrades for me first.

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by kenkamm

What mic did you buy and did it not come with a calibration file?

UMIK-1 no such file I’m aware of. Anybody have a calibration file they’re aware of?

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by AdonisP91

Yes the Resonix box is nice, it has digital and system sounds but it is quite pricey and there are more important upgrades for me first.

Group buy!!

[AdonisP91]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

UMIK-1 no such file I’m aware of. Anybody have a calibration file they’re aware of?

Each Umik-1 is individually calibrated. Go to this link scroll down to the Calibration section, input the serial number on your Umik1 and download the files.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/aco...urement/umik-1

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by AdonisP91

Each Umik-1 is individually calibrated. Go to this link scroll down to the Calibration section, input the serial number on your Umik1 and download the files.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/aco...urement/umik-1

THANK YOU!

[J-RO]

After reading all this I might just switch to AM radio!

[BroDoze]

^^ AM radio’s got some good stuff on it. Not much on FM worth listening to.