[Bimmerfun82]

Originally Posted by aerobod

Their source is shown to be calculated, not based on dyno results with no info shown on how they calculated it. The torque figures also don’t match the BMW a statements about max torque from There are some difference in tuning across the S58 iterations, but BMW consistently quotes max torque not being reached from all versions until 2600RPM, no matter which version of the S58B30 that it is (T0 or otherwise).

Here is the original training material link: https://www.bimmerpost.com/goodiesfo...S58-Engine.pdf

I’m sorry but this must be the wrong instance unless I’m losing my mind. This says the s58 has 442 ft-lb but we know it only has 406…

[ronin13013]

Not really. You know he wanted a GT4 lol! These forums are priceless.

Originally Posted by CodeSlinger

Woah buddy, calm down. We're all happy that you have a car you like.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by DO444

Porsche Cayman enters the chat.

Why?

[DailyDownshift]

Did anyone post this yet??? Turn on auto translate captions for those of you who don't speak German. This dude can flat out DRIVE. He pulls off some mega drifts and power slides in manual while driving cliff side. At 12:30 in the video, he mentions that in 3rd gear, you start to feel the boost come on later.. Probably a lot slower than on the M3. At 12:40 he steps on it in 3rd gear while driving 35mph and the pickup is very slow, I must say. Seems like TH were definitely onto something with the slow pickup/torque in lower rev ranges with stick. If any German speakers can provide a direct translation, that would be nice! *Worth pointing out that even with this, he recommends picking the manual towards the end of the video*

[zero21]

No idea who this is but epic footage.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by moodyhank82

Who in their right mind will be cross-shopping a base M2 with a 718 GTS 4.0? This is like someone posting on the 718 forum saying "I don't regret buying my 296 GTB". If you can afford a GTS 4.0 and don't need the back seats, 100% of the time you buy the 718. What did you think the base M2 was going to be like to better a N/A flat 6 mid-engine Porsche?

Yeah, its a thing here that people (claim to?) cross shop/walk away from the M2 (and bash it "on the way out") for any various models of 911/718. Is it true or are people trying to show off/BS, who knows...

[T_U_D]

A reminder, when any of the German M engineers, M managers in Arizona were asked if they were getting the G87, which many of them answered that they were and soon. They also stated that they were getting it with the manual. I believe that speaks volumes in comparison to any reviews we have watched.

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by zero21

No idea who this is but epic footage.

Looks completely unfun and unusable to me.

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by Bimmerfun82

I’m sorry but this must be the wrong instance unless I’m losing my mind. This says the s58 has 442 ft-lb but we know it only has 406…

The S58 characteristics are still going to be fundamentally the same, as has been experienced by G8x and F9x S58 implementations with perceived low output at low revs cmpared with S55 predecessors (masked in the auto versions that comprise most S58 vehicle iterations). Same turbos and control systems, just different boost pressures that will affect the top-end output. The ratios of torque built at a given RPM are going to be similar for the 550Nm, 600Nm, 620Nm or 650Nm iterations.

There isn't going to be a major change in how the torque is built at low RPM without a significantly different design. The design philosophy for the S55 vs S58 is also detailed in the doc link I posted. The S58 is not going to be making anything close to maximum torque at 1900RPM without a change in compression ratio, control philosophy and turbo sizing.

[Bimmerfun82]

Originally Posted by ronin13013

At least get that GT4.

GT4 is weak sauce, he should be sad he didn’t get the GT4RS with the Weissach package. That’s the only true 718 that matters

[CodeSlinger]

Originally Posted by Bimmerfun82

GT4 is weak sauce, he should be sad he didn’t get the GT4RS with the Weissach package. That’s the only true 718 that matters

718? You mean a poor mans 918?

[DailyDownshift]

Originally Posted by zero21

No idea who this is but epic footage.

Sickkkk, can't wait!

[YKIGI]

Originally Posted by DO444

Nah, they are apparently getting back into racing and while the designs are questionable the performance is not.

You’re oversimplifying things.
Are they making mistakes?
Definitely.

Overpriced plastic garbage?
lol.

Maybe I was extreme. But I’ll stand by it.

Only reason they are racing is to test EV tech btw.

[10"]

Originally Posted by EXE46

BMW hasn’t built a skunkworks car since the 1M.

Totally true.

[rk95]

As someone who could not wait to get behind the wheel of this as a manual, I truly think the auto will do the car better justice based on the powerband reviews. I think I am switching to auto

[hoyasaxa]

Originally Posted by moodyhank82

Who in their right mind will be cross-shopping a base M2 with a 718 GTS 4.0? This is like someone posting on the 718 forum saying "I don't regret buying my 296 GTB". If you can afford a GTS 4.0 and don't need the back seats, 100% of the time you buy the 718. What did you think the base M2 was going to be like to better a N/A flat 6 mid-engine Porsche?

I wanted a sports car. BMW doesn’t make them anymore. It cost me a lot more money. It’s a shame. I loved my F87.

Also interesting mods deleted the post you replied to so apparently contrary opinions, even from owners, aren’t welcome here. And evidently the car is so weak it can’t withstand debate.

[CodeSlinger]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

I wanted a sports car. BMW doesn’t make them anymore. It cost me a lot more money. It’s a shame. I loved my F87.

Also interesting mods deleted the post you replied to so apparently contrary opinions, even from owners, aren’t welcome here. And evidently the car is so weak it can’t withstand debate.

Ah yes, the g87 that has more traction, more power and is faster both in a straight line and on a track. If only it was half the sports car that the f87 is.

The reviews were generally super positive with the only caveat being it isn't quite as tail happy as the f87 but has more traction and is dynamically "better". Not sure how you think that makes it weak.

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by CodeSlinger

Yeah, its the auto transmission tuning for the DCT when you put it in sport plus. It's super aggressive but honestly it makes me want to rev match down to 1st in the m2 cause it's been loads of fun. (The Macan GTS is pretty new to me so it's been a learning experience)

We have the lesser 2021 Macan S, it does the aggressive 1st gear downshift when needed, definitely not the norm from most manufacturers. I do find the transmission tuning quite dim-witted in other scenarios, though, often requiring a manual shift to put it in the right gear.

The most inituitive transmission tuning I've ever come across was on a Mercedes CLA200 rental car with DCT that I had in the UK last year, always seemed to select the right gear with lots of selection of 1st gear where necessary. Actually performed a lot better than the 163bhp would have indicated, mainly due to the aggressive transmission downshifting.

[hoyasaxa]

Originally Posted by CodeSlinger

Ah yes, the g87 that has more traction, more power and is faster both in a straight line and on a track. If only it was half the sports car that the f87 is.

The reviews were generally super positive with the only caveat being it isn't quite as tail happy as the f87 but has more traction and is dynamically "better". Not sure how you think that makes it weak.

There’s more to being a sports car than the numbers. BMW has cheapened materials, made design decisions that are wrong (iPad kickstand dash, ugly exterior, cheap plastics), and they have removed a measure of joy from the car. Not all. But a measure. And it’s the way all their cars are headed.

The word “weak” was used in the context of mods squelching debate.

[CodeSlinger]

Originally Posted by aerobod

We have the lesser 2021 Macan S, it does the aggressive 1st gear downshift when needed, definitely not the norm from most manufacturers. I do find the transmission tuning quite dim-witted in other scenarios, though, often requiring a manual shift to put it in the right gear.

The most inituitive transmission tuning I've ever come across was on a Mercedes CLA200 rental car with DCT that I had in the UK last year, always seemed to select the right gear with lots of selection of 1st gear where necessary. Actually performed a lot better than the 163bhp would have indicated, mainly due to the aggressive transmission downshifting.

If I'm driving super aggressively sport plus is great, but yeah it's not the best for causal driving. It really keeps you in a low gear. Haven't had any issues with sport or comfort in casual driving though.

[CodeSlinger]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

There’s more to being a sports car than the numbers. BMW has cheapened materials, made design decisions that are wrong (iPad kickstand dash, ugly exterior, cheap plastics), and they have removed a measure of joy from the car. Not all. But a measure. And it’s the way all their cars are headed.

The word “weak” was used in the context of mods squelching debate.

Well when you can properly define what makes an f87 a sports car and a g87 not a sports car let me know.

Overall the reviews speak glowingly of the interior materials and, while subjective, the guage screen is super high resolution and provides tons more information that other guage clusters I've used. It was fantastic on the i4 that I drove. I also happen to like the exterior, ultimately its subjective but you coming in here and bragging about your much more expensive car being better is just not the move. The m2 is a hell of a deal for a mid $60k luxury sports car.

[Ravenseal]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

There’s more to being a sports car than the numbers. BMW has cheapened materials, made design decisions that are wrong (iPad kickstand dash, ugly exterior, cheap plastics), and they have removed a measure of joy from the car. Not all. But a measure. And it’s the way all their cars are headed.

The word “weak” was used in the context of mods squelching debate.

Go back to the Porsche forums then, lol. You have your $100,000+ GT4 order. Why are you here shitting on the parade?