[Legit]

I'd like to do a poll with current owners and those with cars on order. What transmission do you have?

[Emily172013]

I'm 77yrs old. Have had my life fill with clutch replacement, clutch shutter, and the overall pain of living with them in traffic. To me with autos being faster and more efficient, manuals today are suitable mainly for farm equipment. Even semi trucks are now automatic. Only a few diehards will disagree with me and manufactures, and that's fine. So, let's now hear from them.

[baron95]

I wanted the manual. Current sports car is a manual. But..... BMW is making it very hard to choose the manual:

- No remote start
- No digital key
- Ridiculous way to wireless charge the phone (pocket in center console, which takes over 1/3 of the console space, vs neat tray ahead of the cup holders.
- Shifter is a bit rubbery, but I was fine with it.

So if the manufacturer is treating it as a second class option, I don't want it.

So ordered the A8. I hope I don't regret it too much.

[Bumpinjeep]

This is the last BMW that you can order with a manual, with the exceptions of the Supra/Z4 & G8X. You can buy literally every other car on planet Earth with a boring old automatic transmission.

[2SG5]

I didnt have a choice, picked mine up off the lot after the original buyer backed out. So mine is Auto. Id like to think if I had the chance maybe id go manual, but the gearing is a bit too long for me. Ive been fairly happy with the auto.

[El SID]

Mark my words. Starting next year, BMW will focus on Competition and CS variants of the M2. These models will likely be equipped with the A8. BMW’s statement that manual transmissions will be offered throughout the model run, may be inaccurate. 😢

[DeadlyDrop]

no question for me, wanted 6 mt and it was non negotiable lol. Bit wanted to be like Will Smith rocking Chuck Taylor and riding gas powered motorcycle in I Robot LOL

[KevinC]

Originally Posted by Emily172013

.. manuals today are suitable mainly for farm equipment.

[GregW / Oregon]

Originally Posted by Emily172013

I'm 77yrs old. Have had my life fill with clutch replacement, clutch shutter, and the overall pain of living with them in traffic. To me with autos being faster and more efficient, manuals today are suitable mainly for farm equipment. Even semi trucks are now automatic. Only a few diehards will disagree with me and manufactures, and that's fine. So, let's now hear from them.

I'm 75 and never had to replace a clutch. My first new BMW was a 2002 in 1973. Autos are technically superior, and my SUVs have all been that, but IMO you loose a lot of the fun in a sports machine. Same for BEVs. For a commuter or work vehicle I'd say yes, auto.

[MG20i]

Originally Posted by M2siast

I'm not 77 yet, but I never had to replace a clutch in my life... And I normally drive my cars to 200,000+Km.

If I had to replace clutches regularly, I, too, would move on to something that changed the gears for me.

How on Earth have you driven a performance vehicle nearly 125,000 miles and not had to replace a worn out clutch....Is it all highway?

[MG20i]

Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon

I'm 75 and never had to replace a clutch. My first new BMW was a 2002 in 1973. Autos are technically superior, and my SUVs have all been that, but IMO you loose a lot of the fun in a sports machine. Same for BEVs. For a commuter or work vehicle I'd say yes, auto.

Unreal that you guys have NEVER replaced a worn out clutch. Especially if one vehicle was owned and driven any amount of time and distance. If you always changed vehicles every 2 or 3 years it might make sense.

[Albator_IIII]

Originally Posted by MG20i

How on Earth have you driven a performance vehicle nearly 125,000 miles and not had to replace a worn out clutch....Is it all highway?

Originally Posted by MG20i

Unreal that you guys have NEVER replaced a worn out clutch. Especially if one vehicle was owned and driven any amount of time and distance. If you always changed vehicles every 2 or 3 years it might make sense.

My current daily is a 2008 E90 335i 6MT that I own since new and still original clutch. No sign of need of replacement. I don't get out much though. Current read on the odo is only 139,000km.

[GregW / Oregon]

Originally Posted by MG20i

Unreal that you guys have NEVER replaced a worn out clutch. Especially if one vehicle was owned and driven any amount of time and distance. If you always changed vehicles every 2 or 3 years it might make sense.

I have kept my Ms the full seven year model cycle. Most of my driving is urban/suburban, used to be 9k/yr but now more like 6-7k since I retired. But I don't do burnouts and know how to drive. I did have a clutch disc replaced in my F82 under warranty for some light chatter on takeup.

[a358970751]

both are good choices . I donot track , not driving fast . just wish to have a M car for weekend driving . That’s why I did not pick CF roof , CF trim , even HUD . And I am living at nyc area , automatic + ACC are perfect for traffic jam

[menikmati]

Originally Posted by a358970751

both are good choices . I donot track , not driving fast . just wish to have a M car for weekend driving . That’s why I did not pick CF roof , CF trim , even HUD . And I am living at nyc area , automatic + ACC are perfect for traffic jam

Looks like the perfect comfort build for your driving situation

[DSTR]

I will never forget this article in 2015. Its a clean explanation of putting the power down and how the manual is not optimal for that. Sure they are'fun'. I dont miss them and my M2 is Auto as was my 17M2. My first sportcar not manual but with DCT in 2017.
Never looked back.......ever. Some here might not like it and others may. It is by an expert and worth your time to read. You might learn something maybe not as well. I have always like this US - Auto magazine - Road and Track.

Lamborghini R&D Chief Explains Why Manual Transmissions are Dead

Maurizio Reggiani, head of R&D at Lamborghini, loves a true manual transmission. But in an interview with R&T, he explains why you'll never see one again in a new Lamborghini.

Lamborghinis are supposed to be about raw emotion: the scream of a V12 engine, the thrill of mile-wide tires scrambling for grip, the joy of driving something built without a single care thrown toward convenience, practicality, or the rigors of everyday humdrum life.

You'd think a manual transmission would fit the formula perfectly.

But at the Frankfurt Auto Show last week, R&T sat down with Maurizio Reggiani, Director of Research and Development at Lamborghini. And while the Lamborghini news at the show was the introduction of the Huracán LP 610-4 Spyder, we couldn't help asking Mr. Reggiani a question that's been weighing on our minds: Is the dream of a manual-transmission Lamborghini dead?

"Unfortunately I must say yes," he told us. "All the systems that are integrated in the car need to have a dialog with one another. The clutch is one of the fuses of the system, whether you're engaging or disengaging the torque. This creates a hole in the communication between what the engine is able to provide and how the car reacts to the power of the engine. For this reason, unfortunately, I must say I am sure that in a premium supersports car like the Huracán, we will only do a semiautomatic.

"Unfortunately, it's the demand of the control of the chassis," he continued. "If you want to control the chassis, you must control the power. If you want to control the power, the clutch must be under the control of the brain of the car, not your brain."

This decision wasn't easy, and Mr. Reggiani understands the yearning among traditionalists for a three-pedal Lamborghini. But he brings up a very good point about modern manual transmissions, one that doesn't get discussed very often among three-pedal evangelists: Today's manual transmissions aren't the pure, directly-connected driver's experience you think they are.

It all comes down to the mechanics of what happens when you push the clutch pedal. "Remember, when you put a servo system between your feet and the clutch, you have already put a filter in there. For me, the most pure expression of the manual transmission is when with your foot you push all the load that is necessary to disengage the clutch."

So when people pining for manual transmissions hold up today's three-pedal sports cars as standard bearers of purity, it puzzles Mr. Reggiani. "In all the latest manual transmissions, there is a servo that reduces the load [of the clutch pedal]," he explains. "If we want to talk about the purist [experience], we must go back 20 years, not 10 years, because already these filters were in place.

Then there's the practical side. "I've been working for Lamborghini for 20 years. I started at the time of the Diablo, [which had] a clutch without a servo. You needed 40 kilograms of force to disengage the clutch. At that time, we were making 450 N m of torque. Now we are at 690. It's a problem to manage the closing point of the clutch. If you have hesitation, with this torque you'll burn the clutch immediately.

"And unfortunately not everybody can be a super expert, but everybody wants to buy the car and nobody wants to appear stupid. For this, you must put the servo in there, and if you put the servo in there you disengage the really mechanical feeling between you and the engine."

In other words, if you want a Lamborghini with power like the 740-hp Aventador LP750-4 SV, you're gonna have to settle for a transmission that's smarter than you. As for Mr. Reggiani? When he wants to get that purist mechanical feel, he hops in his 1966 Alfa Romeo Duetto, with a manual transmission and no servos in sight.


https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ions-are-dead/

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by MG20i

How on Earth have you driven a performance vehicle nearly 125,000 miles and not had to replace a worn out clutch....Is it all highway?

All rev matched downshifts and no significant clutch slipping with either a clutch dump to spin the tyres or full power not applied until the clutch is fully engaged.

Of the 10 or so manual cars I've had that have had 200,000km on them, none have needed a replacement clutch and all have been driven fairly hard with typical 50,000km (30,000 miles) brake and rotor change interval and tyres every 20,000km (12,000 miles) or so.

Even my Caterham that I'm currently rebuilding the engine on due to valve spring fatigue failure that has done 10,000km hard track use, at least a hundred autocross rapid starts and 30,000km of spirited road use and is now on about it's 8th set of tyres, is only having a new clutch put in due to the engine being out, it is only about halfway through it's life.

[DSTR]

Originally Posted by aerobod

All rev matched downshifts and no significant clutch slipping with either a clutch dump to spin the tyres or full power not applied until the clutch is fully engaged.

Of the 10 or so manual cars I've had that have had 200,000km on them, none have needed a replacement clutch and all have been driven fairly hard with typical 50,000km (30,000 miles) brake and rotor change interval and tyres every 20,000km (12,000 miles) or so.

Even my Caterham that I'm currently rebuilding the engine on due to valve spring fatigue failure that has done 10,000km hard track use, at least a hundred autocross rapid starts and 30,000km of spirited road use and is now on about it's 8th set of tyres, is only having a new clutch put in due to the engine being out, it is only about halfway through it's life.

I had 3 Lotus Esprit Turbo's - 83, 86 HCi, 94S4. Never a replacement and many mid engine exotics seem to have premature clutch issues etc. Its a skill and living within the means/capability of the clutch you have. My Ferrari friends during this long period of my Lotus ownership were astounded. I simply told them to learn to drive lol Clearly my advice is not needed given your skill level

[menikmati]

I'm nearing 170k on an original clutch, as aerobod stated, it's the way it's driven.

[a358970751]

Originally Posted by menikmati

Looks like the perfect comfort build for your driving situation

Yes , without CF roof and CF trim and HUD . I can save about $4500+8.875%tax

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Legit

I'd like to do a poll with current owners and those with cars on order. What transmission do you have?

Both my 2023 M2 and 2023 JCW are manuals.

Not because I'm a luddite or one who believes a manual is a must for street cred but because a manual is a much simpler transmission to service and if necessary less expensive to repair or replace than an automatic.

The M2 manual is a good transmission. So too is the 6-speed in my 2023 MINI JCW.

[menikmati]

Originally Posted by a358970751

Yes , without CF roof and CF trim and HUD . I can save about $4500+8.875%tax

More for you to spend on gas, tires and FUN.