[Glashutte]

Fellow BMW lovers,

Over the last few days, I've been through a bit of a tough spot. I recently totaled my 2030 330i with a lot of mods on it. I loved this car, and it was a source of pride and enjoyment in my life. I spent days modding this car, cleaning this car, and taking her to meets. I met some great people because of this car. To say that I was devastated is an understatement.

However, a lot of that grief has turned into acceptance, and a potential for growth. I realized that I spent a lot of money on this car, and an even greater amount of time and effort. Part of me started to ask "what could I have done if I hadn't spent time on cars". I could have learned a new language. Worked out some more. Put that money into a down payment for a house. At that point, I asked "How much is too much to spend". Money is one thing, but time is another, and that's arguably a lot more valuable.

As BMW fans, and car enthusiasts, we know more than others how much this hobby can cost. Being a part of the car scene can quickly get very expensive without clearly defined boundaries. Gas, mods, maintenance can quickly add up, and thats not even mentioning that a 50k car is nothing to scoff at. For the average Joe, that means forgoing a lot of other things. It could mean a few hobbies, or even something more important like a house purchase.

Despite the costs, I still love cars. I walked away from an awful accident nearly unscathed. Well, except for a few screws loose But it made me realize that hobbies aren't worth it if they block serious life milestones. And if they block off several other hobbies, it may not be worth it depending on what you value. With cars being so damn expensive and time consuming, this is often the case unless you have very deep pockets and a lot of time.

At the time of writing this, I'm looking at the wreck of my car. I'm thinking - goddamn, that 50 grand would have been really nice for a down payment. Maybe I could have put 40k towards the house fund and use the last 10k for a trip to Japan. Or, Deutschland with a fun rental

So, for all the 20 something year olds out there. Don't let cars get in the way of life. Buy a house. Travel. Meet someone. Learn a language. Maybe meet someone abroad. Maybe buy a house abroad. Maybe learn how to swim. Take a bicycle trip. You remember experiences more than things. Things are a means to experiences, after all. And maybe the BMW experience isn't the end all, be all of life.

Signed,
A younghead

[Joebie]

Sorry about your car.

I personally bought a house first and then the nice car about 5 years later. I never owned a car worth more than about $9k until i was ~31 years old when i bought the M2. This approach has worked for me.

Saving money is good, but only to a certain degree. Whats the point of life? To have fun before you kick the bucket, right? Who cares if you have $5mill when youre 80. I'm 30-something and want to have fun NOW, the best years of my life, even if it means I'm poorer when im older.

Tomorrow isnt guaranteed, you gotta spend some of your money on yourself now, to a responsible degree of course. If you save everything and then die a week from today you just worked your entire life for nothing.

So yeah, i agree with you that 20 is too young for a $50k car unless you are born into wealth or have some other means to afford that + much more for other things as such a young age. But you gotta spend your hard earned money on yourself at some point. Cars are a healthy way to do that in my opinion especially if you youre spending responsibly, meeting people, and learning new skills along the way.

So how much is too much for a car? I think you should be able to pay cash without seriously interfering with other things like a house purchase, travel, wedding, kids, etc like you said. I financed my M2 so that the dealer would give me a better deal but paid it off in a month.

[XutvJet]

IMO, you can have a "nice car" and all those other things. It's pretty simple really. Instead of starting off with a new car, buy a nice used one, mod it, and learn to wrench yourself. I didn't have my first new car until I was 39. All of my prior cars were bought used and 3 to 5 years old and purchased at or near half their original MSRP. I didn't have a German car (my 2016 M235) until I was 43. At 48, I bought my 2011 Cayman base as a fun car. That 30K, mid 13 second car gets endless compliments as people assume it's a six figure, ultra fast Porsche. LOL.

My wife and I have never made a ton of money, especially compared to most of our other friends and families, but we've always been smart with our money and never lived beyond our means. We bought mid level, holder and smaller homes and used cars for the longest time. At 45, we paid off the home we live in and I could retire now at 50 if I really wanted to. Most of my friends and acquaintances live in much larger and fancier homes, have the really nice cars, the boat, perhaps a vacation home/condo, travel a ton, etc. and they have no substantial savings or investments. They stress about money. I don't.

[///MPhatic]

“Some people can read War and Peace and come away thinking it's a simple adventure story. Others can read the ingredients on a chewing gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe.”

In other words; whatever it is you're doing, investing, playing with toys, being part of relationships, they're all experiences that take you on a journey (and hopefully you learn from), and that's the important bit.

It's not the finishing, it's the doing.
The journey IS the destination.
Having a cool car is just a bonus really, it's really about what you learn and the people you meet along the way.

No amount is too much if it gives you peace.

[mjj]

Focus on your career first. Money usually follows. Prioritize how it gets allocated.

If that allows for a nice car, then enjoy it.

As for experiences, I get more from tracking a car or ripping through the twisty backroads than I do attending the latest (music star) concert.

Although I will say seeing Pink Floyd live 2 times ranked right up there.

[dgoldenz]

Too much is never enough. Just buy a 911 and drive it for free.

[zx10guy]

It's all about balance. While I didn't buy a BMW in my 20s, I did get into a project car which I spent money on mods and a ton of time on. It was my main hobby at the time and I don't regret one minute of it. I learned a ton about what makes a car work and go fast both from the engine and suspension. Made a lot of mistakes which didn't sting as bad as if I did buy an expensive car; ie two blown motors from nitrous mishaps. All of this lead to getting involved in organized racing...SCCA Solo II. While all of this was grabbing a ton of my attention, I still made time to workout, play competitive volleyball, volunteer as a first responder/EMT, and go clubbing.

I didn't get a "nice" car till I was in my early 40's with my 135i bought new. All of my previous cars were econoboxes. I do agree that saving money early is a very good thing where the earlier you start the less per month you have to put away. The whole time and compounding. Don't necessarily agree that one should buy a home. Buy a home if it really makes sense to do so not because it's what society tells you should do. Most important thing is to start investing early.

Someone mentioned an analogy about having millions but being 80 and not being able to enjoy it. I agree with the sentiment that tomorrow is not promised and things happen in life. I'm a poster child of that. No one would ever think I would have to deal with two cancers, an aortic aneurysm along with a nasty divorce. These life changing situations made me shift focus a bit. I saved and saved for years to see that I was near death twice and live with what can be considered a ticking time bomb with my heart. My divorce showed that a chunk of my money that I worked so hard for can disappear in an instant. So I've done some uncharacteristic things such as buying a sailing boat. Having three motorcycles. I'm not fiscally irresponsible as I'm not in debt except the mortgages on my two homes. I still save money in my retirement and investment accounts. It's just that I won't hold back as much with spending money if it means I enjoy life a bit more.

[pbonsalb]

I always wanted a 911 Turbo, but could not afford one. For all the money I spent modifying lesser cars, I could have bought one. But I never had all that money at once back then. I agree there should be more important things like permanent housing and a retirement plan, but I also think it is important to have some fun along the way. Fun does not have to be a $1500 per month car payment. Today I could buy a 911 Turbo, but have not and am not sure I will. As others have noted, things like travel, taking care of friends and family in need, and helping people you don’t know — perhaps through a nonprofit — are important and maybe more so.

[baege]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Too much is never enough. Just buy a 911 and drive it for free.

good point, if you buy the right car, even if it's expensive, you can avoid the depreciation cost

of course when you start thinking about what else you could do with the money then it gets more complicated and subjective

I bought my first "expensive" car in my early 30's, a 2003 350Z for 50K cdn on the road. I paid cash for it.

I bought a property soon after. I could have bought a bigger property I suppose if I had a 10K car and put that extra 40K down. But I liked the place I bought and it met my needs.

In the end it's all about what you value and finding that balance.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Too much is never enough. Just buy a 911 and drive it for free.

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

I always wanted a 911 Turbo, but could not afford one.

I don't get this 911 thing at all, and I've tried, the list is LONG, but unless it's a very modern car (and absolutely stupidly priced) then they just don't trip my trigger.

My Exige is much more engaging, has vastly better steering, and quite a bit faster in the corners for a third of the money, and I'll get it all back (and then some) in the end.

Exige > 911 IMO

Speed Kills IV by Andrew Thompson, on Flickr

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

I don't get this 911 thing at all, and I've tried, the list is LONG, but unless it's a very modern car (and absolutely stupidly priced) then they just don't trip my trigger.

My Exige is much more engaging, has vastly better steering, and quite a bit faster in the corners for a third of the money, and I'll get it all back (and then some) in the end.

Exige > 911 IMO

Speed Kills IV by Andrew Thompson, on Flickr

911 guys remind me of gold-chained Corvette guys, just a bit more snobby.

[David70]

Decide on what your short, medium and long term goals are and put them in order and figure out how you will get there.

In my 20's a $50k car wasn't in the cards for accomplishing the above.

My order was emergency savings, reasonably priced car, house, some amount of retirement savings, travel, then move on to the car.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by David70

Decide on what your short, medium and long term goals are and put them in order and figure out how you will get there.

In my 20's a $50k car wasn't in the cards for accomplishing the above.

My order was emergency savings, reasonably priced car, house, some amount of retirement savings, travel, then move on to the car.

This is the smart play, but I was too enamored with cars to let it go that way. And here in Missouri a vehicle is basically identity, so I did the stupid thing and got an expensive car while I still basically lived at home. You live, you learn.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by Glashutte

Fellow BMW lovers,

Over the last few days, I've been through a bit of a tough spot. I recently totaled my 2030 330i with a lot of mods on it. I loved this car, and it was a source of pride and enjoyment in my life. I spent days modding this car, cleaning this car, and taking her to meets. I met some great people because of this car. To say that I was devastated is an understatement.

However, a lot of that grief has turned into acceptance, and a potential for growth. I realized that I spent a lot of money on this car, and an even greater amount of time and effort. Part of me started to ask "what could I have done if I hadn't spent time on cars". I could have learned a new language. Worked out some more. Put that money into a down payment for a house. At that point, I asked "How much is too much to spend". Money is one thing, but time is another, and that's arguably a lot more valuable.

As BMW fans, and car enthusiasts, we know more than others how much this hobby can cost. Being a part of the car scene can quickly get very expensive without clearly defined boundaries. Gas, mods, maintenance can quickly add up, and thats not even mentioning that a 50k car is nothing to scoff at. For the average Joe, that means forgoing a lot of other things. It could mean a few hobbies, or even something more important like a house purchase.

Despite the costs, I still love cars. I walked away from an awful accident nearly unscathed. Well, except for a few screws loose But it made me realize that hobbies aren't worth it if they block serious life milestones. And if they block off several other hobbies, it may not be worth it depending on what you value. With cars being so damn expensive and time consuming, this is often the case unless you have very deep pockets and a lot of time.

At the time of writing this, I'm looking at the wreck of my car. I'm thinking - goddamn, that 50 grand would have been really nice for a down payment. Maybe I could have put 40k towards the house fund and use the last 10k for a trip to Japan. Or, Deutschland with a fun rental

So, for all the 20 something year olds out there. Don't let cars get in the way of life. Buy a house. Travel. Meet someone. Learn a language. Maybe meet someone abroad. Maybe buy a house abroad. Maybe learn how to swim. Take a bicycle trip. You remember experiences more than things. Things are a means to experiences, after all. And maybe the BMW experience isn't the end all, be all of life.

Signed,
A younghead

This - buy a cheaper car to mod and enjoy, and actually use the bulk of the money for new and different experiences.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

Exige > 911 IMO

$30K 2011 987 Cayman 6MT/LSD Base model has entered the chat

[David70]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

This is the smart play, but I was too enamored with cars to let it go that way. And here in Missouri a vehicle is basically identity, so I did the stupid thing and got an expensive car while I still basically lived at home. You live, you learn.

I should modify my list as the first thing I decided was after college I wasn't going to live at home no matter what. I waited tables, lived with my girlfriend and another guy, had a pretty crappy car and got by.

Mother didn't say anything about my lifestyle as I was out of the house and paying my way. I'm amazed at the number of people that go the nice car/living at home route as I really didn't like living at home.

[erickonphoenix]

I kind of violate the 15% rule and spend 30% of my annual income on my vehicles. But, I put a lot of hours behind the wheel so I figure the use/expense metric makes a more quality investment worth it. I also enjoy commuting more if the vehicle is rewarding to drive.

I also never buy new. Once I determine the series I want, I shop for low mileage samples and buy based on mechanical condition not colors or options.

To date our 328xi touring has cost me a little under $1,000 a year to maintain. Our 2018 Honda Accord Sport with similar mileage was doing better until about two years ago. Now the Honda is averaging out at around $1300/yr.

Take a wild guess which of the two cars I prefer driving?

[dgoldenz]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

I don't get this 911 thing at all, and I've tried, the list is LONG, but unless it's a very modern car (and absolutely stupidly priced) then they just don't trip my trigger.

My Exige is much more engaging, has vastly better steering, and quite a bit faster in the corners for a third of the money, and I'll get it all back (and then some) in the end.

Exige > 911 IMO

Speed Kills IV by Andrew Thompson, on Flickr

You’ll figure it out one day, and there’s no way I’m shoe-horning myself into a Lotus every day. 911’s are the best overall sports cars ever made in a class of their own. The fact that you can go from a base car all the way to a GT2RS all based on the same platform is incredible, and they all have their own feel to them in each generation and trim level.

I’m currently on my 8th 911 and have made good money over the years buying and selling them, and I haven’t even started down the path of air cooled cars (yet). Have never had one major issue with any of them and sold almost all of them for more than I paid. It’s just where you’re allocating your money. Yes there is opportunity cost having money tied up in a car but I really don’t care at this point.

Selling a 911 is incredibly easy. Selling an Exige is not and is an extremely niche market. They are cool cars though, just not for me.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

$30K 2011 987 Cayman 6MT/LSD Base model has entered the chat

2011 Cayman = 3,000 lbs
2006 Lotus Exige = 1,950 lbs.

Cayman has left the chat.

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

911’s are the best overall sports cars ever made in a class of their own.

Few 911's meet the criteria to be called a Sports Car, and "best" is a subjective term, not an objective term, so I categorically disagree on them being the best.

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Selling a 911 is incredibly easy. Selling an Exige is not and is an extremely niche market.

I'd put money on the sale of my car being as fast or faster than the sale of a 911. Niche, yes, but one that most every real enthusiast is keen to be in.

If you're too big you're too big, so be it, but that doesn't change the fact that a standard 911 isn't going to produce the experience of a 1,900 lb Lotus, and shame on you for judging it without properly driving it. And dollar for dollar the Exige kills every 911 ever dreamed of.

Porsche's have their place, but they don't take every place, and certainly not the place of a purist driver's car like an Exige.

[dgoldenz]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

2011 Cayman = 3,000 lbs
2006 Lotus Exige = 1,950 lbs.

Cayman has left the chat.



Few 911's meet the criteria to be called a Sports Car, and "best" is a subjective term, not an objective term, so I categorically disagree on them being the best.



I'd put money on the sale of my car being as fast or faster than the sale of a 911. Niche, yes, but one that most every real enthusiast is keen to be in.

If you're too big you're too big, so be it, but that doesn't change the fact that a standard 911 isn't going to produce the experience of a 1,900 lb Lotus, and shame on you for judging it without properly driving it. And dollar for dollar the Exige kills every 911 ever dreamed of.

Porsche's have their place, but they don't take every place, and certainly not the place of a purist driver's car like an Exige.

I didn’t judge anything, I’m sure it’s a ton of fun to drive. Just an incredibly niche market that makes it hard to sell. Ask any dealer, they will lowball the hell out of you on a Lotus trade because they often sit for a long time unsold. An Exige is kind of a weird comparison for a 911 anyway, they are completely different cars. The interior is still a Lotus and not that of a luxury sports car. Apples and oranges.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Just an incredibly niche market that makes it hard to sell.

It's not hard to sell at all, to the right people. If you're saying that the right people are niche people, then I'll take that as a compliment.

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Ask any dealer...

Let me stop you right there. Trading a 911 or a Lotus means the person is pretty clueless, or has more money than brains.

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

An Exige is kind of a weird comparison for a 911 anyway, they are completely different cars. The interior is still a Lotus and not that of a luxury sports car. Apples and oranges.

Finally something we can agree on, and I'll take my Lotus interior 10/10 over that of a "luxury sports car."


Nice place to be. by Andrew Thompson, on Flickr

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

It's not hard to sell at all, to the right people. If you're saying that the right people are niche people, then I'll take that as a compliment.



Let me stop you right there. Trading a 911 or a Lotus means the person is pretty clueless, or has more money than brains.



Finally something we can agree on, and I'll take my Lotus interior 10/10 over that of a "luxury sports car."



Nice place to be. by Andrew Thompson, on Flickr

Wait... ROLL-UP windows? Whaaaatttt....?