[TopG42]

Anybody have experience with this or jb4? Someone is willing to sell me the race chip gts black for the same car for 380(Negotiated down from 500) But I am unsure of how exactly these things work to make your car faster? Currently have AA catted downpipe installed, Dinan intake on the way(considering cancelling since I found out the stock box is already good).

[Littlecoupe]

I think the Race Chip is similar to JB4 for how it works. Essentially is a piggyback between your MAP/MAF sensor that spoofs the signal into showing lower boost to the ECU, which in turn increases the boost to compensate. Your car thinks is it pushing 10 PSI, when actually pushing 14, so it adds 4 PSI to meet the target parameter and adds fuel to meet the required air/fuel ratio.

Of course, JB4 is promoted for having better maps and the ability to fine-tune parameters since it can read from the OBD port.

Both of these can apparently be seen by the dealer even after they are removed, so there is risk to your warranty.

[TopG42]

Originally Posted by Littlecoupe

I think the Race Chip is similar to JB4 for how it works. Essentially is a piggyback between your MAP/MAF sensor that spoofs the signal into showing lower boost to the ECU, which in turn increases the boost to compensate. Your car thinks is it pushing 10 PSI, when actually pushing 14, so it adds 4 PSI to meet the target parameter and adds fuel to meet the required air/fuel ratio.

Of course, JB4 is promoted for having better maps and the ability to fine-tune parameters since it can read from the OBD port.

Both of these can apparently be seen by the dealer even after they are removed, so there is risk to your warranty.

But how can they see it? I thought the selling point of piggy backs was the whole "quick uninstall and no trace"

[Littlecoupe]

Originally Posted by TopG42

But how can they see it? I thought the selling point of piggy backs was the whole "quick uninstall and no trace"

Yes, but someone on these boards, I think with a G42, had a piggyback, took it off, and the dealer somehow "knew." I'm sure with some searching the thread could be found, but I remember this vividly.

I have theorized it could come down to logs on additive fuel. Why would a car dump way more fuel in normal parameters? That's only my hypothesis though.

Found it here:
https://g87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&highlight=log

[TopG42]

Originally Posted by Littlecoupe

Yes, but someone on these boards, I think with a G42, had a piggyback, took it off, and the dealer somehow "knew." I'm sure with some searching the thread could be found, but I remember this vividly.

I have theorized it could come down to logs on additive fuel. Why would a car dump way more fuel in normal parameters? That's only my hypothesis though.

Found it here:
https://g87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&highlight=log

Hmm that makes sense. Welp I already have a AA downpipe installed so that already voided it if that changed any log values. I already never planned on going to the dealership because I don't trust them. Thanks for that link though!

[PNTDG42]

I doubt the downpipe has enough of an impact to effect your warranty. It might be a wise idea to take it out before going to the dealer and asking for warranty work... but a downpipe isn't going to have much, if any, impact in the logged parameters. I would be pretty impressed if a dealer tech could tell there had previously been a downpipe installed via digital footprint only.

Since these cars have electronically controlled wastegates running in a feedback loop, you aren't going to see the big boost spikes and rapid spool improvement like you did with old vacuum actuated wastegates when switching to a high flow downpipe.

[TopG42]

Originally Posted by PNTDG42

I doubt the downpipe has enough of an impact to effect your warranty. It might be a wise idea to take it out before going to the dealer and asking for warranty work... but a downpipe isn't going to have much, if any, impact in the logged parameters. I would be pretty impressed if a dealer tech could tell there had previously been a downpipe installed via digital footprint only.

Since these cars have electronically controlled wastegates running in a feedback loop, you aren't going to see the big boost spikes and rapid spool improvement like you did with old vacuum actuated wastegates when switching to a high flow downpipe.

You seem knowledgeable on this subject. So going back to the first comment about the dealer tracing the race chip, do you think they can actually use the logs against me in a warranty claim if I present the car as stock? Just curious about how much digging they would do or if its something extremely obvious in the logs

[PNTDG42]

Originally Posted by TopG42

You seem knowledgeable on this subject. So going back to the first comment about the dealer tracing the race chip, do you think they can actually use the logs against me in a warranty claim if I present the car as stock? Just curious about how much digging they would do or if its something extremely obvious in the logs

I am only in the position to speculate. I have never personally encountered a source that I deemed authoritative on the matter. So I cannot confirm if/when BMW knows what you’ve done. But I can explain why it’s very easy for me to believe that they could.

I have plugged in my ECUTEK Connect to preview the available logging parameters in my new BMWs, and it’s out of this world. Theres stuff in there that wouldn’t even occur to most people might be a loggable parameter until witnessing it.

If we used that tool and we logged all available parameters while doing a pull at stock power, we could build a sort of baseline to see where all the parameter values roughly land on a stock car.

Do it again at higher power thanks to a fancy boost controller, and there are going to be countless parameters that can be used as a dead giveaway that things are hugely deviating from the expected values. You could write code that focuses and presents particular points of interest.

So the data to separate stock from modified cars is constantly being generated. What I cannot tell you, and don’t know who can: when and what is the car passively logging? And who can access it? Any dealer tech, or just an elite team of investigators sent out on a case by case?

Maybe it’s not logging anything. Maybe it’s logging everything. Maybe it’s logging peak-hold values of the most obvious parameters. Maybe the last hour of all parameters or a chosen set of them, and then constantly being overwritten. I honesty have no damn clue, so I cannot even promise you that BMW can in-fact detect one of those piggybacks after it’s been removed. But it’s hard to believe they wouldn’t take advantage of their cars making it easy to.

[TopG42]

Originally Posted by PNTDG42

I am only in the position to speculate. I have never personally encountered a source that I deemed authoritative on the matter. So I cannot confirm if/when BMW knows what you’ve done. But I can explain why it’s very easy for me to believe that they could.

I have plugged in my ECUTEK Connect to preview the available logging parameters in my new BMWs, and it’s out of this world. Theres stuff in there that wouldn’t even occur to most people might be a loggable parameter until witnessing it.

If we used that tool and we logged all available parameters while doing a pull at stock power, we could build a sort of baseline to see where all the parameter values roughly land on a stock car.

Do it again at higher power thanks to a fancy boost controller, and there are going to be countless parameters that can be used as a dead giveaway that things are hugely deviating from the expected values. You could write code that focuses and presents particular points of interest.

So the data to separate stock from modified cars is constantly being generated. What I cannot tell you, and don’t know who can: when and what is the car passively logging? And who can access it? Any dealer tech, or just an elite team of investigators sent out on a case by case?

Maybe it’s not logging anything. Maybe it’s logging everything. Maybe it’s logging peak-hold values of the most obvious parameters. Maybe the last hour of all parameters or a chosen set of them, and then constantly being overwritten. I honesty have no damn clue, so I cannot even promise you that BMW can in-fact detect one of those [...]

Well then Im convinced to sell mine now lol. Glad I didn't pay the full price but 380 is still a loss.