[M_Power Rob]

What apps are you using for calculating E85 mixes?

[Kevin_The_Clean1]

Originally Posted by M_Power Rob

What apps are you using for calculating E85 mixes?

I would like to know this very same thing Rob. Here in Northern CA all we have is craptane 91.

[BroDoze]

So, dumb question. Is a mix of 91oct and E85 a possible (preferred) alternative to just 91oct?

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

So, dumb question. Is a mix of 91oct and E85 a possible (preferred) alternative to just 91oct?

Unfortunately the app my tuner uses cannot be used on a Galaxy S22 (app is outdated for Galaxy software).

If you are tuned for blends, such as E30/E40/E50 and dont have access to Sunoco pumps for these values, then it helps to know how many gallons of each (93 & E85) to hit that number. I haven't looked into it if it works the same for using 91 octane.

Adding a fuelit kit also helps to know what your blend ultimately is.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

So, dumb question. Is a mix of 91oct and E85 a possible (preferred) alternative to just 91oct?

If one was after a higher octane of fuel (>91) it is possible a blend of 91 (ethanol free) and E85 could be an alternative to just plain old 91

However, there's this from the M2 owners manual:

Fill up using fuel with a maximum ethanol content of 10 %, e.g., E10.

And this makes the blending job more difficult. And to me not an easy job of making such a blend on the forecourt of a gas station.

But before you dash off to the gas station, there's more.

E85 can have an ethanol content between 51% and 83%. (Believe it varies depending upon the season: More ethanol in summer; less ethanol in winter.) Think the E85 octane rating varies from 100 to 105 (AKI).

So you would need to start with ethanol free 91 then add as much E85 as you can while avoiding raising the ethanol content of the blend to above 10%. And you would have to know the ethanol content of the E85.

Say the M2 fuel tank had 10 gallons of 91. Adding one gallon of E85 (with an ethanol content of 83% and an octane rating of 105) would create a hybrid tank of fuel with an octane rating of 92.2 and an overall ethanol content of 8.1%.

Thus you couldn't even add another full gallon of E85 to raise the octane to 94 because the ethanol content would 16% with 2 gallons of E85 (essentially 0.34 gallons of gasoline and 1.66 gallons of ethanol) mixed with 10 gallons of 91 ethanol free.

Then there is the problem of subsequent fill ups. You would have to know the ethanol content of the fuel remaining in the fuel tank plus you would have to know the ethanol content of E85 so you would avoid adding too much E85.

With a stock M2 engine missing the octane target is not a big deal. But if you produce a hybrid blend of 91 ethanol free with E85 that results in too much ethanol...Would the engine blow up? Probably not. But there is the concern the engine would not be fueled properly as the fueling is based on (among other things) having between 10% to 0% ethanol in the fuel tank.

[Geighty7]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

If one was after a higher octane of fuel (>91) it is possible a blend of 91 (ethanol free) and E85 could be an alternative to just plain old 91

However, there's this from the M2 owners manual:

Fill up using fuel with a maximum ethanol content of 10 %, e.g., E10.

And this makes the blending job more difficult. And to me not an easy job of making such a blend on the forecourt of a gas station.

But before you dash off to the gas station, there's more.

E85 can have an ethanol content between 51% and 83%. (Believe it varies depending upon the season: More ethanol in summer; less ethanol in winter.) Think the E85 octane rating varies from 100 to 105 (AKI).

So you would need to start with ethanol free 91 then add as much E85 as you can while avoiding raising the ethanol content of the blend to above 10%. And you would have to know the ethanol content of the E85.

Say the M2 fuel tank had 10 gallons of 91. Adding one gallon of E85 (with an ethanol content of 83% and an octane rating of 105) would create a hybrid tank of fuel with an octane rating of 92.2 and an overall ethanol content of 8.1%.

Thus you couldn't even add another full gallon of E85 to raise the octane to 94 because the ethanol content would 16% with 2 gallons of E85 (essentially 0.34 gallons of gasoline and 1.66 gallons of ethanol) mixed with 10 gallons of 91 ethanol free.

Then there is the problem of subsequent fill ups. You would have to know the ethanol content of the fuel remaining in the fuel tank plus you would have to know the ethanol content of E85 so you would avoid [...]

Great breakdown and reminding me this is way too much thinking if I want to just get gas if I tuned my car for E85 lol.

ACN91 over here and I hate it! Looking for better alternatives but not willing to go down E route.

I have a friend who mixes high octane 100 with his 91 and does the simple formula of simple weighted average between the 2. I think it comes to 77ish% of 91 and 23%ish of 100 will put you right around that 93 mark.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Geighty7

Great breakdown and reminding me this is way too much thinking if I want to just get gas if I tuned my car for E85 lol.

ACN91 over here and I hate it! Looking for better alternatives but not willing to go down E route.

I have a friend who mixes high octane 100 with his 91 and does the simple formula of simple weighted average between the 2. I think it comes to 77ish% of 91 and 23%ish of 100 will put you right around that 93 mark.

OH yeah, if you have access to lead free 100 octane (or higher, think there's a 110) gasoline (and with no more than 10% ethanol) you can blend the high octane gasoline with 91 pump gas to raise the octane rating.

A bit less number crunching and if you err on the side of too much octane only your wallet suffers.

Up to the driver of course but for a stock engine on the street probably not worth the trouble.

For a tuned engine... Could be almost a necessity.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by M_Power Rob

What apps are you using for calculating E85 mixes?

No app suggestions.

Don't know your exact situation but a hybrid blend of 91 E10 with some percentage of E85 may not be the only solution.

Boostane can be used to bring pump gas octane up. Boostane web site offers charts to show how much Boostane to use to bring up various pump gas octane levels to higher levels.

The benefit of Boostane is how much you add is based on how much pump gas you pump into the tank and how high you want to raise the octane level.

In your case Boostane might be worth looking into.

Start here:

https://boostane.com/

[Mark_17]

I can't speak specifically to the M2 computer as I have not had any first hand experience tuning them

BUT

When tuning LS engines we always use a sensor that calculates the % of E in the fuel mix and the computer will adjust the tune based on the E%.

In my experience of boosted LS engines the difference between E50 and E85 is negligible.

All pump gas (with exception to ethanol free and 100LL av gas) is an E/gas blend, whether it be E10 or E85. So yes, you can mix E85 with whatever gas to get your desired E%.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

No app suggestions.

Don't know your exact situation but a hybrid blend of 91 E10 with some percentage of E85 may not be the only solution.

Boostane can be used to bring pump gas octane up. Boostane web site offers charts to show how much Boostane to use to bring up various pump gas octane levels to higher levels.

The benefit of Boostane is how much you add is based on how much pump gas you pump into the tank and how high you want to raise the octane level.

In your case Boostane might be worth looking into.

Start here:

https://boostane.com/

Guess you don't understand. MynECU is tuned with maps for 93, E30 and E40. While there are a very small number if Sunoco stations in my general vicinity that have dedicated pumps for the E30 and E40, there will be times I need to blend E85 with 93 octane to hit these marks (or if I want to go to E50). There are apps which have already done the research to give you the amounts of 93 and E85 to hit any blend marks.

Understand, the car has been custom tuned with ~8 hours of data logging on these three maps (and trans being tuned at the same time).

You don't just add any garbage octane boosting additives.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by Mark_17

I can't speak specifically to the M2 computer as I have not had any first hand experience tuning them

BUT

When tuning LS engines we always use a sensor that calculates the % of E in the fuel mix and the computer will adjust the tune based on the E%.

In my experience of boosted LS engines the difference between E50 and E85 is negligible.

All pump gas (with exception to ethanol free and 100LL av gas) is an E/gas blend, whether it be E10 or E85. So yes, you can mix E85 with whatever gas to get your desired E%.

As stated above, and the reason for this thread, is the ecu was custom tuned to specific blends. Can it run if the blend is slightly off, yes. Could I run straight pump labeled E85, yes. In either case the ecu will adjust slightly but with the specific custom tuning parameters, it will run its best when I can hit the blend marks . This is also why the Feulit kit is important.


https://fuel-it.com/products/fuel-it...-g80-m3-g82-m4

[Mark_17]

Originally Posted by M_Power Rob

As stated above, and the reason for this thread, is the ecu was custom tuned to specific blends. Can it run if the blend is slightly off, yes. Could I run straight pump labeled E85, yes. In either case the ecu will adjust slightly but with the specific custom tuning parameters, it will run its best when I can hit the blend marks . This is also why the Feulit kit is important.


https://fuel-it.com/products/fuel-it...-g80-m3-g82-m4

Your rudeness paired with your arrogance is off putting. Why ask questions if you already know the answer you are looking for?

As stated previously, the actual blend at that E-whatever pump can and will vary greatly. SO just because you pump in E40, doesn't mean you land at exactly E40.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by Mark_17

Your rudeness paired with your arrogance is off putting. Why ask questions if you already know the answer you are looking for?

As stated previously, the actual blend at that E-whatever pump can and will vary greatly. SO just because you pump in E40, doesn't mean you land at exactly E40.

Then don't answer (oh, I hope I am not being too rude). Obviously some people don't read and instead like to hijack threads or at least take them off on a tangent...so far, not one response even comes close to addressing what I originally posted, just a bunch of jackass responses (again, hope I am not being too rude).

[BroDoze]

So to get my CO 91octane up to a solid 93/94 octane if I want to do JB4 Map 2, for instance, is this the good stuff? It's saying on 11 gallons, I only need like 1.5oz to bring 91oct up to 93. Are these nasty, leaky containers? Or are they something I can keep in the trunk (making sure they stay upright.)

[Geighty7]

Originally Posted by M_Power Rob

Then don't answer (oh, I hope I am not being too rude). Obviously some people don't read and instead like to hijack threads or at least take them off on a tangent...so far, not one response even comes close to addressing what I originally posted, just a bunch of jackass responses (again, hope I am not being too rude).

Ask your performance shop or call any performance shop and ask.

We’re all just owners like yourself, passing the time on social media pertaining to our cars. No need for hostility friend! I’ve seen you in other threads and you are a good guy.

I hope you find your answer!

[Baller]

I use the E calculator built into the Fuel-It or JB4 app.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by Geighty7

Ask your performance shop or call any performance shop and ask.

We’re all just owners like yourself, passing the time on social media pertaining to our cars. No need for hostility friend! I’ve seen you in other threads and you are a good guy.

I hope you find your answer!

Response wasn't directed at you.

Unfortunately, the app they want me to use can't be downloaded on an Android (or at least a Galaxy). Ironically, it works on an iPhone (or at least on my tuners and shop owner's iPhones). They were looking into others so thought I would also ask around. Guess I should have just waited...

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by M_Power Rob

Guess you don't understand. MynECU is tuned with maps for 93, E30 and E40. While there are a very small number if Sunoco stations in my general vicinity that have dedicated pumps for the E30 and E40, there will be times I need to blend E85 with 93 octane to hit these marks (or if I want to go to E50). There are apps which have already done the research to give you the amounts of 93 and E85 to hit any blend marks.

Understand, the car has been custom tuned with ~8 hours of data logging on these three maps (and trans being tuned at the same time).

You don't just add any garbage octane boosting additives.

You didn't detail the tune your engine has.

Kind of surprised that the tune still requires I gather precise ethanol percentages.

I'm still kind of stuck on how an app can know the ethanol content of E85 when it can vary from 51% to 83%.

As an aside, E10 ethanol content varies, too, ranging in the 7% to 8% range. I would expect then E30 and E40 to have somewhat less ethanol content than the amount suggested by their labeling.

But back to E85. I note you are in south Florida and maybe E85 ethanol content doesn't change compared to what it might in say Minneapolis.

At any rate I hope you find the app you want.

[RockCrusher]

Found two web sites which offer a blend app for using E85 to make a hybrid ethanol blend.

https://www.morepowertuning.com/emix

https://www.getmtuned.com/ethanol-fu...ure-calculator

Can't vouch for either as I have never used either.

[Dave07997S]

Keep in mind for us Cali guys our E85 is a true E85. It often tests out to E87. Cali requires it to be full E85 or it gets taxed like regular gasoline. The stock fuel system can't even handle an E20-E25? Coming out of a Gen 3 S550 you could run up to an E30 with the stock fuel system and it would trim properly. Then again it was DI and Port injection. I like to use E85 as a cheap octane boost. I normally would run 2.5 gallons of E85 to 91 gallons of 91 and it got me to 93 octane with a E21 blend. The car ran great. I was hoping doing the same thing with the M2.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

Keep in mind for us Cali guys our E85 is a true E85. It often tests out to E87. Cali requires it to be full E85 or it gets taxed like regular gasoline. The stock fuel system can't even handle an E20-E25? Coming out of a Gen 3 S550 you could run up to an E30 with the stock fuel system and it would trim properly. Then again it was DI and Port injection. I like to use E85 as a cheap octane boost. I normally would run 2.5 gallons of E85 to 91 gallons of 91 and it got me to 93 octane with a E21 blend. The car ran great. I was hoping doing the same thing with the M2.

At least one California E85 retailer states the E85 content in CA is 51% to 83%, but claims its E85 contains the maximum ethanol content of 83%.

The specification for E85 in California is 51% – 83% ethanol content. Pearson Fuels blends to the maximum allowance of 83% ethanol combined with 17% unleaded gasoline or renewable naphtha creating up to an 80% lower carbon intensity fuel compared to unleaded gasoline.

Link:

https://pearsonfuels.com/e85-gas-and-flex-fuel-faq/

Based on my 2023 M2's owners manual E10 is the limit for ethanol content.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

At least one California E85 retailer states the E85 content in CA is 51% to 83%, but claims its E85 contains the maximum ethanol content of 83%.

The specification for E85 in California is 51% – 83% ethanol content. Pearson Fuels blends to the maximum allowance of 83% ethanol combined with 17% unleaded gasoline or renewable naphtha creating up to an 80% lower carbon intensity fuel compared to unleaded gasoline.

Link:

https://pearsonfuels.com/e85-gas-and-flex-fuel-faq/

Based on my 2023 M2's owners manual E10 is the limit for ethanol content.

I understand, however practice shows different. I have yet to see a station in which E85 is offered to test under E85. With the Mustang Ford said don't go beyond E15 yet the Gen3 Coyotes could trim properly easily to E30 without a tune.