[Seminole]

What's holding you back is your GPA. There is no bones about it.

I don't mean to be too personal, but what is your GPA? The Big 4 won't even take a second look usually unless you have AT LEAST a 3.0 Accounting GPA. Keep in mind at a job fair recruiters talk to hundreds of recruits and read just as many resumes. They spend about 15 seconds scanning over it, and the first thing they look for is the GPA. If you don't have what they want you go into one pile, and you better have one hell of a personality to get you out of it and into the right one. The first thing a recruiter thinks when the see a low GPA is A) You didn't care and were lazy and slacked off. What does this say about your work ethic, and B) You just don't know your stuff. Your school really doesn't mean anything to them either. I attended a Big 4's Summer Leadership Program a few months ago and there were students from FSU, UF, UMiami, FIU, FAU, UCF, etc. On the application for the Summer Leadership Program it said the minimum GPA was a 3.4. That was just for the SLP!

Like I said, your school doesn't matter. So what if USC is a Top 20 school. FSU's undgrad Accounting program is ranked 25th among public institutions. FSU Accounting graduates also rank among the nation's best in passing the CPA examinations, and specifically are ranked fourth in passing the Financial Accounting and Reporting section and sixth in the Auditing section of the CPA exam. I'm not trying to shit on USC, but I'm trying to point out to you that just because you went to a top 20 school it doesn't guarantee you a job. Hell you could graduate from UPenn and you aren't guaranteed a job. Once you get within the top 50 the level of education is pretty much the same. Accounting is accounting, you can't change procedures. GPA's are what helps you stand out.

I'm looking at the info for each of the Big 4's and Grant Thorntons interviews on FSU's internal career site and the GPA requirements for AN INTERVIEW are as follows:

1) Grant Thornton- 3.0
2) PricewaterhouseCoopers- 3.2
3) Ernst&Young- 3.2
4) Deloitte- 3.2
5) KPMG- 3.2

Grades are not everything though, but they are what gets you in the door. Once you get the interviews the whole process is about finding out whether or not you are a fit for the company and if they are a fit for you.

Another thing, that is not so big is getting the 150. One of the questions I got asked by most of the firms was how I was planning on getting my 150. I'm planning on doing the Masters of Accounting program, and when I tell them this you can definitely tell they approve of this over the standard 150.

Also, when did you start to go to job fairs and talk with the firms? Regardless of your GPA you should start talking to them your sophomore year. Also getting involved in a group like Beta Alpha Psi is a great idea. The earlier and more often they see your faces the better. If your GPA isn't that hot, this is even more important. I know the recruiters from all the firms, and it really makes a difference when I walk into a job fair and they know me on a first name basis.

I'm sure it sucks, but maybe you shouldn't have slacked off as you admitted. The best thing to do if you have your heart set on a Big 4 and are unable to get a job with them is to go for a smaller local firm. Get some experience in there and then try to move on up to the larger firms. I've met people at all of the Big 4 who have gone that route.

Don't get discouraged. Apply to as many companies as you can and take the best offer you get.

[aznshrek88]

Originally Posted by Seminole

What's holding you back is your GPA. There is no bones about it.

I don't mean to be too personal, but what is your GPA? The Big 4 won't even take a second look usually unless you have AT LEAST a 3.0 Accounting GPA. Keep in mind at a job fair recruiters talk to hundreds of recruits and read just as many resumes. They spend about 15 seconds scanning over it, and the first thing they look for is the GPA. If you don't have what they want you go into one pile, and you better have one hell of a personality to get you out of it and into the right one. The first thing a recruiter thinks when the see a low GPA is A) You didn't care and were lazy and slacked off. What does this say about your work ethic, and B) You just don't know your stuff. Your school really doesn't mean anything to them either. I attended a Big 4's Summer Leadership Program a few months ago and there were students from FSU, UF, UMiami, FIU, FAU, UCF, etc. On the application for the Summer Leadership Program it said the minimum GPA was a 3.4. That was just for the SLP!

Like I said, your school doesn't matter. So what if USC is a Top 20 school. FSU's undgrad Accounting program is ranked 25th among public institutions. FSU Accounting graduates also rank among the nation's best in passing the CPA examinations, and specifically are ranked fourth in passing the Financial Accounting and Reporting section and sixth in the Auditing section of the CPA exam. I'm not trying to shit on USC, but I'm trying to point out to you that just because you went to a top 20 school it doesn't guarantee you a job. Hell you could graduate from UPenn and you aren't guaranteed a job. Once you get within the top 50 the level of education is pretty much the same. Accounting is accounting, you can't change procedures. GPA's are what helps you stand out.

I'm looking at the info for each of the Big 4's and Grant Thorntons interviews on FSU's internal career site and the GPA requirements for AN INTERVIEW are as follows:

1) Grant Thornton- 3.0
2) PricewaterhouseCoopers- 3.2
3) Ernst&Young- 3.2
4) Deloitte- 3.2
5) KPMG- 3.2

Grades are not everything though, but they are what gets you in the door. Once you get the interviews the whole process is about finding out whether or not you are a fit for the company and if they are a fit for you.

Another thing, that is not so big is getting the 150. One of the questions I got asked by most of the firms was how I was planning on getting my 150. I'm planning on doing the Masters of Accounting program, and when I tell them this you can definitely tell they approve of this over the standard 150.

Also, when did you start to go to job fairs and talk with the firms? Regardless of your GPA you should start talking to them your sophomore year. Also getting involved in a group like Beta Alpha Psi is a great idea. The earlier and more often they see your faces the better. If your GPA isn't that hot, this is even more important. I know the recruiters from all the firms, and it really makes a difference when I walk into a job fair and they know me on a first name basis.

I'm sure it sucks, but maybe you shouldn't have slacked off as you admitted. The best thing to do if you have your heart set on a Big 4 and are unable to get a job with them is to go for a smaller local firm. Get some experience in there and then try to move on up to the larger firms. I've met people at all of the Big 4 who have gone that route.

Don't get discouraged. Apply to as many companies as you can and take the best offer you get.

Numbers: Overall 3.1; Major 2.9

Total turn around today; I landed 1st rounds with a big 4 company and I definitely think its more about who you know or how many ppl you talked to in a firm cuz I did a lot of talking to ppl in this firm.

I also did my interview with a mid-tier and hoped that went well =D.

I've also been a past officer in BAY and current and am in an accounting club. I know by going to a top tier school they can give you certain advantages, you just need to take them and use the opportunity.

Seminole's answers in order:
1)SLP is the most selective and they drop by internship and are least picky about fulltime, though a 3.2 to 3.3 is a lot better and will for sure get you an interview (I know you need at least a 3.0)
2) you're never guaranteed a job, but a big named school sure does help; I just feel the grading on a curve really hurts more than it helps
3) most firms will take you as long as your major GPA is above a 3 and you've been talking to the campus recruiters a lot and showing interest
4) Grades do weigh a lot because its the only thing an interview can rely on besides your personality
5) I feel like going for the 150, especially in CA since we don't need it; shows initiative
6)You talk to firms as soon as you can if you don't have the grades, but in all reality; I've known ppl who went through spring recruiting who went directly through interviews to get an internship--> job
(Soph year is also a little extreme because most ppl don't know what they want; I got in 1st rounds with Deloitte soph year, but didn't make it through basically cuz I had no experience to talk about)
7)Yea....it wasn't so much slacking off as it was family/gf issues, but no excuses that's my bad =(
8) As for applying I'm 2/15 or so and got an email today for a direct in-house =D

[ae8t6ix]

Just found this article on MSN. No disresprect, just some info that relates to the top 10 business schools. Kudos to you business school graduates, the requirements to get in are impressive.

http://spotlight.encarta.msn.com/Fea...html?GT1=27001

[Seminole]

Originally Posted by aznshrek88

Numbers: Overall 3.1; Major 2.9

Total turn around today; I landed 1st rounds with a big 4 company and I definitely think its more about who you know or how many ppl you talked to in a firm cuz I did a lot of talking to ppl in this firm.

I also did my interview with a mid-tier and hoped that went well =D.

I've also been a past officer in BAY and current and am in an accounting club. I know by going to a top tier school they can give you certain advantages, you just need to take them and use the opportunity.

Seminole's answers in order:
1)SLP is the most selective and they drop by internship and are least picky about fulltime, though a 3.2 to 3.3 is a lot better and will for sure get you an interview (I know you need at least a 3.0)
2) you're never guaranteed a job, but a big named school sure does help; I just feel the grading on a curve really hurts more than it helps
3) most firms will take you as long as your major GPA is above a 3 and you've been talking to the campus recruiters a lot and showing interest
4) Grades do weigh a lot because its the only thing an interview can rely on besides your personality
5) I feel like going for the 150, especially in CA since we don't need it; shows initiative
6)You talk to firms as soon as you can if you don't have the grades, but in all reality; I've known ppl who went through spring recruiting who went directly through interviews to get an internship--> job
(Soph year is also a little extreme because most ppl don't know what they want; I got in 1st rounds with Deloitte soph year, but didn't make it through basically cuz I had no experience to talk about)
7)Yea....it wasn't so much slacking off as it was family/gf issues, but no excuses that's my bad =(
8) As for applying I'm 2/15 or so and got an email today for a direct in-house =D

Congrats on the interview! Be yourself and you'll do fine.

I wasn't aware California was only a 120 state. Florida is a 150, and they LOVE it if you come in with your CPA, but if you don't have it yet, they definitely like it if you go for the masters here.

[dth656]

yes, it is tough to get into those 10 MBA programs, but i would say the adage "there are smart and dumb people everywhere" applies.

case in point, at my last company, we fired (yes, canned), some people who had graduated from Wharton (Penn) and HBS. they were fired for egregious levels of incompetence. in contrast, one of the exec-track partners got his MBA at univ of north texas (a non-name school if there ever was one).


name can get you in the door, but after that, its up to you..

[aznshrek88]

backtrack guys I'm in undergrad...not B-school, wish I worked harder so that I can go someday...

[mithiral67]

Originally Posted by aznshrek88

hell I've even signed the audit agreement since I was working on the client.

First, are you talking about the engagement letter or the audit opinion.

Either way. I work for a second tier public firm and have been helping recruitment this summer. Here's some facts.

The big 4 are cutting back on the number of new hires this year, big time. The big 4 are unloading a lot of experienced hires as they don't have work for them. The only three schools that would really look go on your resume for accounting are NIU, Illinois and Texas. They fight for the top 3 spots for number of students that pass the CPA, % passing rate and highest scores. (please do not compare this to business school rankings, most ivy league business schools do not have accounting degrees).

As for advice, I would start interviewing for second tier accounting firms. With the big 4, you are just a number and will be dumped quickly if we continue to go into a recession. The second tier firms pay well and can absorb extra over head in slow times then the big 4.

If you are still having trouble, sit for the CPA ASAP. Get a 90+ average for all the sections. With that on your resume, ur basically set.

[aznshrek88]

Originally Posted by mithiral67

First, are you talking about the engagement letter or the audit opinion.

Either way. I work for a second tier public firm and have been helping recruitment this summer. Here's some facts.

The big 4 are cutting back on the number of new hires this year, big time. The big 4 are unloading a lot of experienced hires as they don't have work for them. The only three schools that would really look go on your resume for accounting are NIU, Illinois and Texas. They fight for the top 3 spots for number of students that pass the CPA, % passing rate and highest scores. (please do not compare this to business school rankings, most ivy league business schools do not have accounting degrees).

As for advice, I would start interviewing for second tier accounting firms. With the big 4, you are just a number and will be dumped quickly if we continue to go into a recession. The second tier firms pay well and can absorb extra over head in slow times then the big 4.

If you are still having trouble, sit for the CPA ASAP. Get a 90+ average for all the sections. With that on your resume, ur basically set.

SCORES COUNT????? okay whoa whoa...I thought you just needed to pass; I didn't know ppl cared about your scores...could you elaborate?

I know the market's tough, I'm going through interviews right now and am fairly optimistic.

[mithiral67]

Originally Posted by aznshrek88

SCORES COUNT????? okay whoa whoa...I thought you just needed to pass; I didn't know ppl cared about your scores...could you elaborate?

I know the market's tough, I'm going through interviews right now and am fairly optimistic.

They do and they dont. If you get 4 75s, dont put them on your resume. If you get scores in the 90s, put them on the resume. Passing the CPA isnt easy, showing you destoryed them helps.

[aznshrek88]

Are salaries or bonuses decided on this???? like if I'm already working and I get 90's then will I get some sort of raise or just props? I know the CPA is hard, ppl compare it to the BAR, etc. and say its harder...if I can get past FARS first then I think i'll be a happy camper =D

[Seminole]

Originally Posted by aznshrek88

Are salaries or bonuses decided on this???? like if I'm already working and I get 90's then will I get some sort of raise or just props? I know the CPA is hard, ppl compare it to the BAR, etc. and say its harder...if I can get past FARS first then I think i'll be a happy camper =D

I don't think your passing bonus is any larger for scoring higher, you get it just for passing. Most of the firms give you a bonus if you pass it in your first year there.

[mithiral67]

yea, some places give a bonus or pay bump for passing. My firm does not care. Its expected and required for promotion.

One of the jokes around my school was, if you cant pass the cpa, then be a lawyer.

[aznshrek88]

Nono, I know that companies give bonuses for passing, smaller firms are about 2-3k, while big 4 is standard like 4-5k or something, but with the economy; I heard its dropping. Private companies I heard are 10k or for some...

So if your employed and pass; that's all you need; its like bragging about SAT scores if you got something really high; I just want to pass =D