[boostspoon]

Where do we start with these guys?

They're so unaware their review lacks credibility and trust.
- Using a public road to judge suspension do only one turn?
- Doing doughnuts in a crappy parking lot (probably without permission)
- Drives a 350z? Like that thing is dated and if it were modified, you can't compare aftermarket parts to oem, they're in different classes of engineering and have a place in an overall package
- Rolling race with only 2 seconds on the pedal? What's that like a 3k rpm band?


If there's one thing I learned this morning, it should be that I don't support any "car review vlogger" that
- Doesn't take a car on a real race track of any sort to actually get on a throttle. Kudos if they often drive all reviewed cars on that track to know how each turn should feel.
- Cannot describe technical aspects of how the engineered systems are working, especially from one generation to the next
- Personally drives a car that is tasteless in styling and performance compared to the car they're reviewing

[m2ss]

Originally Posted by MMMGuy60

Have you seen the Z in person? It actually looks great.

True, I need to see it in the wild.

When I saw the G87 it looked far better than the pics.

My wife hated it which is odd given her impeccable taste.

One look at her husband is proof enough...

[boostspoon]

Originally Posted by moodyhank82

Positives for the G87 from the review, compared to the Z and Supra:

- largest interior space
- best visibility
- latest tech
- most well-equipped
- best sound (exhaust and intake)
- most grip

Negatives:

- heavy
- expensive
- ugly (obviously subjective)
- not any faster despite the price tag
- worst/most rubbery shifter

Both reviewers ending up rating the G87 last place for their personal preference.

Bro, they don't deserve this list. Their tests don't even validate anything.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by Bungus

If you want objective reviews, watch savagegeese. They are one of the few good car review channels.

Saying the M2 isn't faster than the Z or Supra is laughable. Like legitimately insane. The fact that the Z is even compared (let alone the fact that is was Yuri's preference...) is embarrassing. The Z is a certified nissan turd inside and out.

his review was on a track on RE71 RS tires... hardly a good review for the street at all

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by boostspoon

Where do we start with these guys?

They're so unaware their review lacks credibility and trust.
- Using a public road to judge suspension do only one turn?
- Doing doughnuts in a crappy parking lot (probably without permission)
- Drives a 350z? Like that thing is dated and if it were modified, you can't compare aftermarket parts to oem, they're in different classes of engineering and have a place in an overall package
- Rolling race with only 2 seconds on the pedal? What's that like a 3k rpm band?


If there's one thing I learned this morning, it should be that I don't support any "car review vlogger" that
- Doesn't take a car on a real race track of any sort to actually get on a throttle. Kudos if they often drive all reviewed cars on that track to know how each turn should feel.
- Cannot describe technical aspects of how the engineered systems are working, especially from one generation to the next
- Personally drives a car that is tasteless in styling and performance compared to the car they're reviewing

i am going to repeat... track reviews are for the most part trash... they are ok as a secondary metric but give me a street 1/4 mile and then tell me how the car feels on normal streets... their review may suck but its far more realistic than savageese's RE71 RS track tire comparo on a closed track lol... the best track car consistently seems to be the Supra... why because its a light weight 2 seater? a completely unrealistic comparo or car for 95% of people

[boostspoon]

Originally Posted by ASAP

i am going to repeat... track reviews are for the most part trash... they are ok as a secondary metric but give me a street 1/4 mile and then tell me how the car feels on normal streets... their review may suck but its far more realistic than savageese's RE71 RS track tire comparo on a closed track lol... the best track car consistently seems to be the Supra... why because its a light weight 2 seater? a completely unrealistic comparo or car for 95% of people

Well obviously you won't take in a summer track review if you're trying to find out how it performs in the snow.

What's your point? You know there are only so many 1/4 mile runs you can do before you nail down a number. These cars are more than that - it can be done at the track in addition to the full testing package.

If you're looking for a non-track review, being only on the streets, the M240i is probably a better match for you (unless you prefer the styling on the M2)

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by boostspoon

Well obviously you won't take in a summer track review if you're trying to find out how it performs in the snow.

What's your point? You know there are only so many 1/4 mile runs you can do before you nail down a number. These cars are more than that - it can be done at the track in addition to the full testing package.

If you're looking for a non-track review, being only on the streets, the M240i is probably a better match for you (unless you prefer the styling on the M2)

interesting, i was going to tell you the exact opposite... if you want a serious track car, boy have i got better and cheaper spec options for u... no one serious about tracking will track a 3800 lb car w a dell monitor inside it... or perhaps you missed that i am the guy that had the m2c and thought it sucked lol... so i hope this is a better car

[Ravenseal]

Same as with the Supra 6MT, the 400Z is locked behind trashy dealerships as unobtanium. The few that I've seen local to me were either automatic or marked up by $20,000+. I don't care how much "better" some YouTuber thinks a car is if I can't test drive it or buy it.

[MMMGuy60]

Originally Posted by D22M2

All these less than great reviews are starting to get to me

Bummed cause I love the way this car looks .

You have nothing to worry about. I have cars that is highly rated and I dont like it. Cars is like food. what taste good to one can taste nasty to another. The M2 looks and sound amazing in person, way way better than any photos online.

[MMMGuy60]

Originally Posted by Ravenseal

Same as with the Supra 6MT, the 400Z is locked behind trashy dealerships as unobtanium. The few that I've seen local to me were either automatic or marked up by $20,000+. I don't care how much "better" some YouTuber thinks a car is if I can't test drive it or buy it.

Yup, I wanted to get a manual Supra but I aint playing the stupid dealership games. I am getting M2 for msrp now and will get a Supra with S58 or Nismo Z in the future when stealership stop being stupid.

[Squidget]

Originally Posted by deneed4spd

After hundreds of pages of threads, I wish bmw just fixed the manual feel and made the car 3650 lbs for $72k start. Yah it would have been more expensive but, with CTRs going for mid 40s, acura going for low 50s, I’m sure the price premium would have been accepted with standard forge wheels, better manual parts like Supra, lighter frame pieces. Feel more nimble, etc. but then the bean counters would have yelled because it would be way better than the m4.

A thought. If your goal is to reduce weight by 100 pounds and improve the shifter, you can just buy an M2 and mod it, and get the same result for less than $72.

Buy a SSK, replace the OEM wheels, put in a lithium battery, and you are basically there. Or rip out the rear seats for free.

[DSTR]

OMG Click's for Money on YOUSHITETUBE = Really so Shawwwwkedd LOL

[ronin13013]

The Supra looked wider than the Z.
I thought it would have more presence.

Originally Posted by MMMGuy60

Have you seen the Z in person? It actually looks great.

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by Tag

@16m10s

Just goes to show that even if a car is objectively better people won't want it if it subjectively doesn't appeal to them.

The "reviews" are objectively worthless.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by Squidget

Yeah, I gotta agree I don't understand what point he was trying to make, felt like moving the goalposts.

Here's what I've took away from the reviews we got. I see three categories:

1. The professional reviewers, generally don't like the numbness but admittedly they are very sensitive to that by nature. But they ALSO give the M2 good marks on practicality, performance, comfort. So yeah, they are gonna critique, but even SG couldn't actually provide a real alternative (i.e. a car that is a 4 seater AND in production). I pay attention to these reviews but with a critical eye.

2. There's a class of amateur drivers who don't actually seem to understand limit driving or performance nuances (like this review, or TH). I disregard them outright. (Nissan Z lol)

3. There's a class of enthusiasts who are not reviewers but actually doing real-world stuff. (Jackie, Tuxon, Daily Downshift). These vids are the most useful to me. And generally, all of these folks are having FUN and that matters most to me.

For example, sure, Jackie will mod his car because that is what track teams do. But even in the stock car, he was laughing his ass off in joy tossing it around the track. He should be jaded since he drives a modded Supra, but instead he was having a blast. That matters!

I still dont get whats so difficult to understand / comprehend-

1) Most people will be buying this car for street usage. They want to see how the stock car behaves on a street. Changing tires and driving on a track doesn't show that at all because a track has a perfect surface that cannot be replicated on the streets. I learned this hard with my M2C where everyone talked about it being the greatest car ever...on perfect surfaces... until you drove it in real world conditions and the car felt like a trampoline or a sideways drift car half the time.

2) The folks that DO track their car... will either track a far more spec set car or a car that is very heavily modded... this means nothing to folks looking for a review of a car that is to be primarily street driven. People that are very serious about tracking consistently or in a spec class will not be driving an M2... in fact on most tracks, they are rarely seen cars... so this is a review that appeals to a small subset.
If the guy strips his car or drives it on the track has 0 relevance to me... just like the SG review which is on a closed track and uses RE71 Rs tires...

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by D22M2

All these less than great reviews are starting to get to me

Bummed cause I love the way this car looks .

Don't let influencers bother you. What makes them qualified to "influence" anyway?


Watch the Jackie Ding videos. That's all anyone really needs.

[ronin13013]

I think its a combination of group think and this car really looking strange on camera. I don't know what kind of voodoo this is but when I watch a video and go out to my garage I see 2 different things.
I know it sounds like a cop out but I cant explain it any other way.

Originally Posted by D22M2

All these less than great reviews are starting to get to me

Bummed cause I love the way this car looks .

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by ASAP

no your take is 100% correct... who cares about track performance that doesn't track their car? if you do not track your car and care about track performance on the street... you are definitely confused... because the car will not feel the same on the street at all... i can attest to this from my m2c in a second... but i guess have fun using this judgement lol

Sir, my G87 will likely never see the track. A real track session that is. It will see the occasional BMW CCA event session and the like. I'm a weekend warrior. *I* care about actual track performance (AKA Jackie Ding) because it shows me the true limits of the car, which I'll likely never reach but should be aware of, and that all these "influencers" are talking out their collective asses. But mostly because it helps inform my driving on the street.

[m2ss]

I'm running out of butter here...

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by ASAP

you fellas seem like the gentlemen that see a 911 Gt2 RS run a 6:47 on the ring and later think that translates to the street lmao... where the capability is way out of your abilities, the car isn't prepped remotely the same way, wears different tires... and half the tires aren't even warmed up enough to even do a launch on the street correctly... i wont argue if these are the baselines folks now choose

I'm sorry but you read something that wasn't there. Jackie Ding ran the car stock on the track. Yes, I know he's now going to mod it beyond what will be used on the street. I'm not sure why this is confusing, I apologize that it is. I'm not sure what I said that would cause you to talk about me personally, I'm merely trying to communicate, unsuccessfully it seems, why I would value Jackie's input over the input of the people in the video this thread is based on.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by JustinHEMI

I'm sorry but you read something that wasn't there. Jackie Ding ran the car stock. I'm not sure why this is confusing, I apologize that it is. I'm not sure what I said that would cause you to talk about me personally, I'm merely trying to communicate, unsuccessfully it seems, why I would value Jackie's input over the input of the people in the video this thread is based on.

You have to remember that Jackie running the car stock... where his capabilities far outweigh ours probably will not translate to our track experience... street experience will instead translate to everyone. That's why track reviews can be very heavily skewed and throw perception off and this is why many pro reviewers have already pointed this out... especially with things such as 'ring times.

As far this video... straight pipes isn't meant to be taken for anything outside of what this car does and its features... the throttle house guys are usually far better because they will show cars under different circumstances usually... altho from my recollection their review was also trashed here.

[markcu24]

YES! Please cancel all of your orders!!!