[BRAKE!]

Originally Posted by Tag

Whenever I question why BMW does something like that, I start by asking what's the cost to have such an offer and how much money it will make them? So my guess would be it cost them nothing to offer it since they are already using the same RWD drivetrain for the base models so why not offer it for the Comps as it opens the door to more potential buyers who don't want xDrive for any number of reasons. They did the same thing with the M240i, it was only AWD and then they came out with a RWD model roughly 6mo later. The G42 is also only offered in AT.

I think you’re spot on here. Every decision will come down to the bottom line.

[02M3ForMe]

Originally Posted by Allenssmart

What about ynguldyn

His track record destroys BMWBLOG’s. Is it possible he could be wrong this time? Sure, but I doubt it. Look at what he posted about the G87 literally 2 years ago, before anyone knew anything about the car. The production iDrive 8 curved display hadn’t even been officially shown yet and he predicted it would 100% be in the car.

Original post - April 26, 2021

G87 M2 will be available with a manual and an automatic.
Most options will be the same as G80/G82, and I don't see much of that decontenting that was done with the original F87 compared with F80/F82. Though ceramic brakes and bucket seats seem to be missing, all the drivetrain and suspension things are the same as G82, and even carbon roof will be an option.
The wheels will be 19" front and 20" rear, G87 specific design.
The first four months of its production will fall into the "M 50th anniversary" period so expect the initial run to become somewhat collectible.
And the new dashboard will be standard from day one.

https://g42.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1820632

He also nailed the 12/22 SOP schedule a year early.

https://g42.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1868765

Small details can be off, but he seems to get right BMW’s big decisions. Again, he could be wrong, but that would be extremely out of character.

[Caerus]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

Small details can be off, but he seems to get right BMW’s big decisions. Again, he could be wrong, but that would be extremely out of character.

I would not say he is wrong, that would not be a proper characterization of maybe BMW changing direction slightly. BMWBLOG spent some time talking to BMW management this past weekend at Daytona. Hence, the recent article. Easy to read between the lines, but can't be official until BMW makes an announcement.

[02M3ForMe]

Originally Posted by Caerus

I would not say he is wrong, that would not be a proper characterization of maybe BMW changing direction slightly. BMWBLOG spent some time talking to BMW management this past weekend at Daytona. Hence, the recent article. Easy to read between the lines, but can't be official until BMW makes an announcement.

Sure. No accounting for product roadmap changes after the leaks. It’s possible the Comp has been cancelled. He did indicate in November that the predicted 8/24 M2 Comp changeover may end up being something else (emissions-related powertrain update).

[sl0m0]

So does anyone have a guess of what the cs might cost?

[Beenz]

Funny how quickly everyone is forgetting exactly the same arc for the F87. The “CS” turned out to be the comp. Even well into spied road mules the Comp was being reported as the likely CS.
Then after that was launched as the Comp, the CS actually came out.
Just sayin…..

[T_U_D]

Originally Posted by Beenz

Funny how quickly everyone is forgetting exactly the same arc for the F87. The “CS” turned out to be the comp. Even well into spied road mules the Comp was being reported as the likely CS.
Then after that was launched as the Comp, the CS actually came out.
Just sayin…..

Why the F87 Comp existed below.

New Environmental Regulations Made the BMW M2 Competition Possible https://www.bmwblog.com/2018/05/02/n...tion-possible/

[BRAKE!]

Originally Posted by sl0m0

So does anyone have a guess of what the cs might cost?

I’m guessing it’s going to be close to $100k if not slightly more with the options ticked.

It’s scary how expensive cars are getting.

[M Division]

An Xdrive model to create the ultimate all weather 2 door Beemer would be a nice option for those who want an all weather, traffic light monster like a smaller, slightly lighter, nimbler M4..

[Caerus]

Originally Posted by M Division

An Xdrive model to create the ultimate all weather 2 door Beemer would be a nice option for those who want an all weather, traffic light monster

If it could be had with a manual transmission would be nice.

[Tag]

FYI, I brought this to the attention of ynguldyn and asked if he saw anything about a future M2C in this post. Haven't gotten any response.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

Sure. No accounting for product roadmap changes after the leaks. It’s possible the Comp has been cancelled. He did indicate in November that the predicted 8/24 M2 Comp changeover may end up being something else (emissions-related powertrain update).

Emissions related? BMW going hybrid on m2/3/4 at that point?

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by T_U_D

Why the F87 Comp existed below.

New Environmental Regulations Made the BMW M2 Competition Possible https://www.bmwblog.com/2018/05/02/n...tion-possible/

See this post of December 2021 (signs exist that the F87 M2 Competition was initially supposed to get the "M2 CS" badge - but plans got changed because of tightened EU emissions regulations taking force on Sep 1, 2018):

Originally Posted by Artemis

Think again. First N55 M2 deliveries: April 16, 2016. Signs exist (but never officially confirmed) that the M2 Competition was initially supposed to be named "M2 CS" (S55 'closed deck' engine instead of N55 'open deck' engine, 410hp instead of 370hp, redesigned front end, bigger brakes, sports seats, new wheels, two new body colors (HS and SO)) and scheduled to go into production in March 2018. A 450hp M2 (possibly dubbed "M2 CSL") would follow at the end of the F87 M2 life cycle. Plans got changed late 2017 / early 2018: N55 M2 would be discontinued from 1 July 2018 onwards because of tightened EU emissions regulations taking force in September 2018. Some new big carbon fibre parts were surprisingly added to the M2 M Performance Parts catalogue in early 2018 such as CF hood, CF trunk, CF hood, CF fenders. The S55 410hp M2 was introduced on April 17, 2018 and available from September 2018 onwards: it got the first ever "Competition" moniker and was offered at a surprisingly attractive price-tag, by necessity (as there was no choice between the entry N55 M2 model and the S55 M2 model: the S55 M2 model was the only M2 available from September 2018 onwards: entry-level BMW M car). Deliveries of the 450hp M2 dubbed "M2 CS" started in March 2020.

See for example here and here.

IMHO these posts of the past are a correct summary:

I don't expect BMW M to wait till 2028 for releasing a G87 M2 CS: too much cash to earn for BMW with an M2 €$.

AFAIK, regardless the boot badge, this was my take in October 2022:

Originally Posted by Artemis

Hypothetically speaking in a world of logic: what about a 473hp G87 M2 that BMW won't call "Quattro", where 13hp can help 'compensating' additional weight ?

[Tag]

Argument against an M2C

• No M car with MT has more than 406lb-ft of torque.
• The headroom for bumping the S58's power while retaining MT is currently 473hp/406lb-ft, same as the M3/4, which in theory would leave no headroom for more power while retaining a MT for any other variants like a CS or CSL.

Argument for an M2C

• The CS or CSL models don't need to offer MT unless BMW decides it must have one. The G80/2 CS and CSL are AT only.
• The '3.0 CSL' also has an S58 but BMW managed to get 553hp out of it while limiting the torque to 406lb-ft and is also why that car has a MT. They could theoretically use the same engine and detune it to have ~500hp for instance and 406lb-ft and offer a MT for the CS. That would also give them the overhead needed to bump the power up a bit more for a CSL model should they choose to make one.

For the record I have no idea what they'll do other than sit back in this boat with the rest of you and see what happens.

[T_U_D]

Originally Posted by Caerus

If it could be had with a manual transmission would be nice.

Nice, but highly unlikely to happen with Xdrive factored in.

[zero21]

Originally Posted by Tag

Argument against an M2C

• No M car with MT has more than 406lb-ft of torque.
• The headroom for bumping the S58's power while retaining MT is currently 473hp/406lb-ft, same as the M3/4, which in theory would leave no headroom for more power while retaining a MT for any other variants like a CS or CSL.

Argument for an M2C

• The CS or CSL models don't need to offer MT unless BMW decides it must have one. The G80/2 CS and CSL are AT only.
• The '3.0 CSL' also has an S58 but BMW managed to get 553hp out of it while limiting the torque to 406lb-ft and is also why that car has a MT. They could theoretically use the same engine and detune it to have ~500hp for instance and 406lb-ft and offer a MT for the CS. That would also give them the overhead needed to bump the power up a bit more for a CSL model should they choose to make one.

For the record I have no idea what they'll do other than sit back in this boat with the rest of you and see what happens.

I'm guessing they got to 553 by simply extending the redline and adding fuel with additional turbo pressure. It's easy to limit torque these days.

Did BMW confirm specifics on power unit changes?

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by zero21

I'm guessing they got to 553 by simply extending the redline and adding fuel with additional turbo pressure. It's easy to limit torque these days.

Did BMW confirm specifics on power unit changes?

This motor and AT are both beasts and capable of crazy power (way more than any factory version). A food tune of the ECU (and TCU to enhance and optimize the ECU tume) will give you monster torque.

I know its a different drivetrain but I have my 2018 S5 ECU and TCU tuned for "street racing" aka stop light to stop light power (not for top end) and I went from stock 369 torque to 560 torque.

[VIERsr]

I was told the same thing some time ago, and by the way I don't see any room for an M2 G87 Competition.
The current M2 already has the S58 detuned, where would a hypothetical G87 M2 Competition fit in, considering that by 'policy' it shouldn't overpower the M3? And unlike the base M3/4 base vs Competition, the M2 is already offered in both MT and AT.
More likely a CS with the same tune as the current M3/4 Competition (and only AT then). We'll see.

[Chicane_]

My feeling is that the G87 M2 and G80 M3 CS (and possibly the G80/G82 LCIs) will be the last pure ICE S58 applications. I think future models including the M2 CS will have hybrid assist and no longer offer a manual transmission. I fear these are the end of days for the third pedal at BMW.

[RPM33]

Seems like a G87 M2 Competition is redundant so they may just go straight to the G87 M2 CS.