Car and Driver: LIGHTNING LAP 2019

TSM330i · 10-14-2019, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The HACK

?

72 718 Cayman S: 2:58.3
85 BMW M2 Competition: 2:59.7

Unless my math is wrong, lower number is quicker?

Actually, the 718GTS from a year ago (LL#12) ran a 2:56.7, so 3 seconds quicker than the M2C.

Still can't get my hear wrapped around the Urus though.

pgviper · 10-15-2019, 09:20 AM

What still blows my mind on that master list is the time of the 2015 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 with 2:50.9. It just hits so far out of its league. Even today, at the price you can grab one for, I really don't think there is a better option out there.

TSM330i · 10-15-2019, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgviper

What still blows my mind on that master list is the time of the 2015 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 with 2:50.9. It just hits so far out of its league. Even today, at the price you can grab one for, I really don't think there is a better option out there.

There's a reason why Chris Harris owns(ed) one.

paliknight · 10-15-2019, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSM330i

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3_WC

Not cross shopping but rather buying them as additions. Over on Rennlist there is a couple long threads about the ZL1 1LE. Actually more praise than I would have expected, a few members have one in their stable as a track car along side their P-cars(which include GT3's). I see them all the time at my track days, they are beasts.

Plus the fact that running costs are MUCH higher with the GT3/RS than the ZL1 1LE.

Today, it does seem that the all-out performance cars that are priced in the $50-$75K range are a tough sell. As others have pointed out, many of the new 3-series are not the performance versions, but 320 or 330i.
We should all be grateful for the stellar options we have and that they're even being offered as we know making money is the manufacturers first priority.

Back on topic: Lightning Lap keeps getting better and better every year. We can see the development of each vehicle as the years go by. Who would have thought that an NA, 500hp GT3RS would be quicker around a track than a 918 with almost twice the HP?!?! Hats off to all.

To be fair, if someone owns a GT3 or RS variant, and tracking it, then they are probably not too worried about running costs. I still agree though that the 1LE is nuts. If it wasn't for the major visibility issue I experienced, I'd probably own one too; my 991TTS has better visibility.

TSM330i · 10-17-2019, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paliknight

To be fair, if someone owns a GT3 or RS variant, and tracking it, then they are probably not too worried about running costs. I still agree though that the 1LE is nuts. If it wasn't for the major visibility issue I experienced, I'd probably own one too; my 991TTS has better visibility.

I actually do know someone who had a GT3 and tracked it quite a bit. He was surprised at the cash outlay to run it, so he actually switched back to an M car.

RM7 · 10-17-2019, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSM330i

I actually do know someone who had a GT3 and tracked it quite a bit. He was surprised at the cash outlay to run it, so he actually switched back to an M car.

Mmmm, carbon brakes.

heavyD^2 · 10-17-2019, 02:58 PM

I respect the Camaro but I feel I'm just not tall enough to own one. Sitting in it I feel like a little kid peeking out of a bathtub and the one time I took one out for a test drive I just didn't feel comfortable. I'm sure over time I would probably get used to it but at $50K+ Canadian it's too much of a risk in the case I can't get used to it.

Humdizzle · 10-17-2019, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSM330i

I actually do know someone who had a GT3 and tracked it quite a bit. He was surprised at the cash outlay to run it, so he actually switched back to an M car.

this. the guy who can afford to buy a Porsche or Ferrari … and the guy who can buy one and run it on track days multiple times a year are probably in different tax brackets.

My buddy just got his first Porsche experience. his gf got a Macan and they took it in for an alignment. $500. He said F that and took it to audi it was a lot cheaper.

GenXer · 10-21-2019, 12:51 AM

Jetta GLI is one quick grocery getter and it's the least expensive of the bunch.

RM7 · 10-21-2019, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

My buddy just got his first Porsche experience. his gf got a Macan and they took it in for an alignment. $500. He said F that and took it to audi it was a lot cheaper.

Porsche Experience=I want a 911, but my wife wants an SUV...so we'll get a Porsche SUV as a consolation prize...

TSM330i · 10-21-2019, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Mmmm, carbon brakes.

Nope. It was an early 997 car.

Neuner · 10-21-2019, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgviper

What still blows my mind on that master list is the time of the 2015 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 with 2:50.9. It just hits so far out of its league. Even today, at the price you can grab one for, I really don't think there is a better option out there.

if you can ignore the fact that it comes wrapped in a Camaro, the 2015 Z28 is really good. It's hard edged enough to feel purposeful, usable as a track car out of the box, but not a total mess on the road either.

Mingwan · 10-21-2019, 08:03 PM

I’m so shocked the Senna destroyed every other car...

RM7 · 10-22-2019, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neuner

if you can ignore the fact that it comes wrapped in a Camaro, the 2015 Z28 is really good. It's hard edged enough to feel purposeful, usable as a track car out of the box, but not a total mess on the road either.

It's not really a good car, it's a good track car. It sacrifices just about everything to get there, from ride quality to interior (has one speaker for the "radio", no A/C, etc.). Go look up what they did to get it to that point. The ZL1-1LE gives up nothing on the interior, fully loaded with everything and eats just about everything on the track. That's how much better the alpha chassis is.

I'd go for a GT350R a long time before a Z/28. It's cool what they did with the Z/28, but that was truly a car just for the track.

TSM330i · 10-22-2019, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mingwan

I’m so shocked the Senna destroyed every other car...

I knew it was coming when I saw a video testing the Senna against a Pista, Aventador SV and a Manthey Racing modified GT2RS and the Senna spanked them all.

pgviper · 10-22-2019, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

It's not really a good car, it's a good track car. It sacrifices just about everything to get there, from ride quality to interior (has one speaker for the "radio", no A/C, etc.). Go look up what they did to get it to that point. The ZL1-1LE gives up nothing on the interior, fully loaded with everything and eats just about everything on the track. That's how much better the alpha chassis is.

I'd go for a GT350R a long time before a Z/28. It's cool what they did with the Z/28, but that was truly a car just for the track.

I'm aware of what they did for it, A/C is actually optional... not missing. But 5 years old and setting that time is no doubt impressive.

Neuner · 10-22-2019, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

It's not really a good car, it's a good track car. It sacrifices just about everything to get there, from ride quality to interior (has one speaker for the "radio", no A/C, etc.). Go look up what they did to get it to that point. The ZL1-1LE gives up nothing on the interior, fully loaded with everything and eats just about everything on the track. That's how much better the alpha chassis is.

I'd go for a GT350R a long time before a Z/28. It's cool what they did with the Z/28, but that was truly a car just for the track.

no shit, the entire thread is about track capability.. the ac & radio delete was the advertised curb weight special, most were ordered with both options and I doubt you'd notice the difference. The ride is purposefully stiff, in a good way and not unlivable. I'd bet many here put up with a harsher ride from bilsteins & lowering springs on their 3'ers.

The 350R came later and was designed to outperform the z/28, no surprise there. The ZL1-1LE is faster yet but loses some of the charm of the z/28. Feels like it weighs 6000lbs, sounds worse, and is even harsher due to heim joints everywhere.

Have you driven all 3 or are you just comparing magazine reviews? again, the z28 would be awesome if it wasn't a Camaro.

10-15-2019, 09:20 AM	#24
pgviper Captain 284 Rep 832 Posts Drives: X3m40 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Long Island, NY iTrader: (0)	What still blows my mind on that master list is the time of the 2015 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 with 2:50.9. It just hits so far out of its league. Even today, at the price you can grab one for, I really don't think there is a better option out there.
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10-17-2019, 02:58 PM	#29
heavyD^2 Colonel 3726 Rep 2,989 Posts Drives: X3M Competition Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Too close to Santa iTrader: (0)	I respect the Camaro but I feel I'm just not tall enough to own one. Sitting in it I feel like a little kid peeking out of a bathtub and the one time I took one out for a test drive I just didn't feel comfortable. I'm sure over time I would probably get used to it but at $50K+ Canadian it's too much of a risk in the case I can't get used to it.
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10-21-2019, 12:51 AM	#31
GenXer Major 1396 Rep 1,031 Posts Drives: Like a bat out of hell. Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: here and there iTrader: (0) Garage List 2017 Chevrolet Volt [0.00] 2020 Chevrolet Tahoe [0.00]	Jetta GLI is one quick grocery getter and it's the least expensive of the bunch.
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10-21-2019, 08:03 PM	#35
Mingwan Major 1890 Rep 1,340 Posts Drives: X1 Individual custom paint Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Kansas iTrader: (0)	I’m so shocked the Senna destroyed every other car...
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