[Bumpinjeep]

Originally Posted by Slick1984

Are you saying an AT is more fun than the MT on this car or just generally?

Having a hard time comprehending how an AT can be more “fun”, I guess.

It's not, full stop. There is no way around it, putting a car into "D" is nowhere near as engaging as actually driving it. If for some reason you're chasing milliseconds on some racetrack then by all means, get a DCT. But in the real world, where you're going to spend 99.9% of the time, get the car you're actually going to enjoy driving.

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by mitchels

It just says the new one is better than the old one in terms of performance

Shock of the century

[DSTR]

Originally Posted by Bumpinjeep

It's not, full stop. There is no way around it, putting a car into "D" is nowhere near as engaging as actually driving it. If for some reason you're chasing milliseconds on some racetrack then by all means, get a DCT. But in the real world, where you're going to spend 99.9% of the time, get the car you're actually going to enjoy driving.

So a robot drives for you with the ZF8 eh. Delusional post. Full stop.

[zero21]

Originally Posted by Tag

I've noticed that whenever the G87 is tested with an AT it gets glowing reviews but not when it's got a MT.

Yeah. You have to WANT the 6MT.

I drove some fast cars early today and I have no problem "enjoying" paddles on an auto. It's a preference thing.

[zero21]

Originally Posted by baron95

That is easy to explain. The ZF8 is the best torque converter transmission in the world.

The Getrag manual and it's implementation in the G8x is one of the worst.

P.S. I've only driven the manual G87 - I thought the shifting action was OK, but rubbery and imprecise. But compared to a good manual like the Tremec 6060 in my current car, it was lacking - a lot. Having said that, the manual G87 was still a ton of fun and engaging.

Everything is correct about this post. The G87 is an amazing car, AND modern autos are substantially better at transferring more torque to the ground.

[E63M6_G42M240i]

Sorry, but looks count too as MT politely pointed out. If BMW would have stuck with the basic shape of the G42 (rounded less Lego), then it would be a home run, or at least a triple. I will not buy any car that I’m not checking out every time I step out of it. I’ll take the large snouted comparably equipped G82 minus $14k in my pocket every day and twice on Sunday.

[yaymitch]

Originally Posted by E63M6_G42M240i

Sorry, but looks count too as MT politely pointed out. If BMW would have stuck with the basic shape of the G42 (rounded less Lego), then it would be a home run, or at least a triple. I will not buy any car that I’m not checking out every time I step out of it. I’ll take the large snouted comparably equipped G82 minus $14k in my pocket every day and twice on Sunday.

Looks are completely dependent on the individual. I haven’t liked the looks of any M4, F or G series, that car has never looked good to me. RS5 coupe looks so much better. G80 also looks miles better. I also really like the look of the G87 and would buy
that over the G82 any day of the week and I own the F87 CS and still like the looks of the G87. Not wrong or right just opinion.

[6speed_M2]

The new M2 is twice the car of the old one, but with it only being 20-30lbs lighter than the M4 and having no xDrive option, less tech with the drivers assistance pack missing some items & having lower quality leather (no ventilated seats either), how can the M2 be better than the M4 in any objective way?

If the tiny fraction on the track from the weight means that much, the C7/8 Z06 is probably the better option.

[6speed_M2]

baron95 I don’t disagree, but imo I’d rather have the BMW manual for a daily driver but not a track car.

It’s alittle easier to drive and requires less focus. It’s softer as well. Those are qualities I’d want for a daily driver manual over the competitors. Notably for me would be the C7 Corvette.

[Squidget]

Originally Posted by 6speed_M2

The new M2 is twice the car of the old one, but with it only being 20-30lbs lighter than the M4 and having no xDrive option, less tech with the drivers assistance pack missing some items & having lower quality leather (no ventilated seats either), how can the M2 be better than the M4 in objective way?

If the tiny fraction on the track from the weight means that much, the C7/8 Z06 is probably the better option.

The M2 is in a different "price segment" than the M4 (AKA M2 costs less), and a different "use segment" than the Z06 (AKA M2 is a daily driver).

And while it's not strictly objective (in terms of lap times), the shorter length of the M2 is an advantage if you want a more tossable car. It beats the M4 in nimbleness.

So the M2 does have a niche, although it's rubbing shoulders with other niches.

[ourlee]

also the new iPhone 14 does not outperform the iPhone 13 Pro)

take that back right the F now

[LemonOne]

Originally Posted by Slick1984

Are you saying an AT is more fun than the MT on this car or just generally?

Having a hard time comprehending how an AT can be more “fun”, I guess.

There's a car called M3 CSL back in the days.
Check it out. It's an "automatic" too.

[ourlee]

Originally Posted by 6speed_M2

The new M2 is twice the car of the old one, but with it only being 20-30lbs lighter than the M4 and having no xDrive option, less tech with the drivers assistance pack missing some :items & having lower quality leather (no ventilated seats either), how can the M2 be better than the M4 in objective way?

If the tiny fraction on the track from the weight means that much, the C7/8 Z06 is probably the better option.

I like the m2 better only because it’s not 23’ long

[baron95]

Originally Posted by E63M6_G42M240i

Sorry, but looks count too as MT politely pointed out. If BMW would have stuck with the basic shape of the G42 (rounded less Lego), then it would be a home run, or at least a triple. I will not buy any car that I’m not checking out every time I step out of it. I’ll take the large snouted comparably equipped G82 minus $14k in my pocket every day and twice on Sunday.

I don't know. The M2 looks mighty good next to the M4.

[E63M6_G42M240i]

Originally Posted by baron95

I don't know. The M2 looks mighty good next to the M4.

Not really. That’s a convertible btw lol. Let’s see the front and back. From the back the M2 is horrendous. Sides it’s better, but I’m still taking M4. How about front quarter like this photo? Again no contest, M2 is horrendous, M4 smooth shapely lines. How about direct front now that’s debatable. Huge grill vs Legoland and a “missing” lower front air dam.

[MmmmmM2]

Originally Posted by Bumpinjeep

It's not, full stop. There is no way around it, putting a car into "D" is nowhere near as engaging as actually driving it. If for some reason you're chasing milliseconds on some racetrack then by all means, get a DCT. But in the real world, where you're going to spend 99.9% of the time, get the car you're actually going to enjoy driving.

Part of me HATES BMW for doing away with the DCT. It's such a great transmission for those who don't prefer manuals.

With that being said, at low speeds, in efficient mode, it makes tons of noise and isn't very smooth at all. I get that the 8ZF does away with all that.

However, I can live with it as I put about 300 miles on my car a month.

I've also learned that driving it in Sports + with the #2 setting on the trans does away with all the negative aspects and noise of the tranny.

[AlpineBoost]

Originally Posted by E63M6_G42M240i

Sorry, but looks count too as MT politely pointed out. If BMW would have stuck with the basic shape of the G42 (rounded less Lego), then it would be a home run, or at least a triple. I will not buy any car that I’m not checking out every time I step out of it. I’ll take the large snouted comparably equipped G82 minus $14k in my pocket every day and twice on Sunday.

MT doesn't exactly think the look of the G42 is anything to write home about either.

"We'll resist commentary on the styling of the new 2 Series other than saying our impression didn't change once we saw it in the metal. This isn't a design that must be viewed up close to be understood. It looks like it does in photos—make of that what you will."

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...-drive-review/

I agree with you though on only buying cars for myself that I naturally want to look at as I approach from across a parking lot, open the garage door, or look back at as I walk away. For me the G87 is that car where as the G42 is not.

[bromudez]

New car performs better. Earth shattering stuff right there.

Wonder what’s faster G80 or F80? Stay tuned

[m2ss]

Originally Posted by 6speed_M2

The new M2 is twice the car of the old one

Sheesh...it's not that much heavier.

[02M3ForMe]

Originally Posted by Slick1984

Are you saying an AT is more fun than the MT on this car or just generally?

Having a hard time comprehending how an AT can be more “fun”, I guess.

The car is geared a bit better with the 8-speed transmission, making the power delivery more interesting more of the time. The ZF8 works well and has personality, especially in the most aggressive setting. It's also better than M-DCT for daily driving.

I think the 6MT car is great, too. I enjoy the shift and clutch action mainly due to familiarity; anyone who's spent time in a manual M made in the last 15 years should know what to expect here. Very incremental changes since the E46/E92 days. I still very much enjoy working the 6MT when pushing hard. However, the car simply feels more 'eager' at day-to-day driving intensity with the 8-speed. The 6MT car can feel almost ordinary when not pushing it. I believe this is why reviewers who spend relatively little time with these cars (versus actual owners) can easily develop the wrong impression about the 6MT version. The car is a beast, you just have to work harder to get to the exciting part.

If you truly want the 6MT (and not simply because the internet convinced you that it's something to be "saved"), you'll have no issues. The car delivers. Just make sure to drive it properly - like an S65, not a B58.

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by Slick1984

Are you saying an AT is more fun than the MT on this car or just generally?

Having a hard time comprehending how an AT can be more “fun”, I guess.

AT holds boost solid between shifts

Can’t get much better than that

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

For the guy who wanted an objective comparison between the G87 and the F87 CS, here it is.

Yep!