[omasou]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

I don't think you're being fair; amongst others such as the M5CS, Marcus was responsible for M2CS the EVO 2020 car of the year - second position went to a mere McLaren

https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/unite...language=en_GB

The release said... Franciscus van Meel it is a return to the chief executive position at the top of BMW M GmbH. Between 2015 and 2018, which means the M2CS (don't follow M5) was designed and built under his watch.

The M2CS was launched under Marcus. Doesn't me he was "responsible"

[omasou]

Originally Posted by m3welt

Does this mean no more giant grills???

One can only hope, but maybe not unless van Meel shakes up the LT...
https://carbuzz.com/news/bmw-isnt-pl...rce=apple.news

The M2C/M2CS have actually grown on me. In fact, this summer, I saw an E36 and E46 parked next to each other and the grills actually look puny. Funny how that works.

But the 4 series and iX grills, they still haven't grown on me and I seriously doubt they ever will.

[swagon]

Originally Posted by ASAP

All things considered, I can't name a single Flasch accomplishment... outside of making those ridiculous you tube videos.

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

Can't argue, we had more exciting drivers cars produced under Van Meel leadership than MF who seemed to focus a lot more on social media advertising.

I'd say Flasch wasn't bad at all...

I don't know the timeline of when models were green lit for production, but he has at the very least had an influence on the F87 CS, F90 CS, G82 CSL, G81 Touring and the new M2 under his reign. All exciting models. van Meel was said to be responsible for the AWD ZF8 development, which makes sense as he is an ex-Audi guy.

The fact the new cars are butt ugly are not entirely his decision, I would bet. The social media strategy, eh, maybe, but BMW AG's was also as bad. M GmbH is very much tied up in AG's corporate decisions - confirmed by Biermann who's openly spoken about leaving the brand because BMW would not let him use NA engines or DCTs.

[Prince_of_Persia]

Thank god, hopefully these stupid big grills go away!

[itsmabs]

I'm happy one of them green lit a m3 touring, and my hope is the other shifts direction to bring it to the US.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by Prince_of_Persia

Thank god, hopefully these stupid big grills go away!

That would require a shift in the design team, which hasn't been made...

[thaalrasha]

Isn't van Meel responsible for losing the M talents team such as Albert Biermann and all ?

[rmanm4]

Originally Posted by thaalrasha

Isn't van Meel responsible for losing the M talents team such as Albert Biermann and all ?

The word is that Albert Biermann left cause he didnt like the direction BMW was going and wanted more control, which is what the Koreans offers!

[R N M]

Van Meel is brought in to turn M into EV - what else is there to wonder about M division?

My last hope is for new M2 to look half way decent otherwise im keeping my F80 comp and will look to add E92 in future.

[thaalrasha]

Originally Posted by rmanm4

The word is that Albert Biermann left cause he didnt like the direction BMW was going and wanted more control, which is what the Koreans offers!

He said the last straw was when he wasn't getting a DCT on the F90 and had to go with the ZF...

[Giom]

Originally Posted by R N M

How do M cars have their own grills?!
The same grill is on regular 4series, i4 and now iX. The new 7series will also have it.

The performance of new M3/4 is less unique as it no longer uses DCT but same ZF auto as in regular models.

There has never been a time when M cars were less differentiated from regular models in BMW history especially with all the Mperformance variants M340, M550 etc. Most ppl think those are also true M cars.

Yea, what do I know...

[MikeCH]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

Can't argue, we had more exciting drivers cars produced under Van Meel leadership than MF who seemed to focus a lot more on social media advertising.

Agree 100%

[3RDSECTOR]

At least this means there's a chance that the G8X LCI models will look halfway decent.

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by omasou

The release said... Franciscus van Meel it is a return to the chief executive position at the top of BMW M GmbH. Between 2015 and 2018, which means the M2CS (don't follow M5) was designed and built under his watch.

The M2CS was launched under Marcus. Doesn't me he was "responsible"

I may be mistaken but the M2CS only started its development phase in 2018, so no, the old guard wasn't "responsible" for the M2CS

[omasou]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

I may be mistaken but the M2CS only started its development phase in 2018, so no, the old guard wasn't "responsible" for the M2CS

Do you seriously think the entire F87 development plan wasn't conceived and approved before the first prototype was ever carved in clay?

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by omasou

Do you seriously think the entire F87 development plan wasn't conceived and approved before the first prototype was ever carved in clay?

You obviously didn't read my comment properly

I never said anything about the ENTIRE F87 lineup; I spoke about the M2CS .... aaaand, even if its clay prototype was carved before Flasch arrived as you suggest, it was entirely DEVELOPED during his reign

Open eyes, avoid foot in the mouth

[IcewaterPete]

Typical corporate stuff that will have almost no visible effect to the public. Or you could just say shuffling chairs on the deck of the Titanic!!

[omasou]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

You obviously didn't read my comment properly

I never said anything about the ENTIRE F87 lineup; I spoke about the M2CS .... aaaand, even if its clay prototype was carved before Flasch arrived as you suggest, it was entirely DEVELOPED during his reign

Open eyes, avoid foot in the mouth

I read it. The M2CS was decided before the first M2 was released. I don't believe the forum conjecture that the M2C and then M2CS were after thoughts.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by thaalrasha

Isn't van Meel responsible for losing the M talents team such as Albert Biermann and all ?

Well, Albert Biermann was also partially responsible for the the F8x. The way it was tuned on launch was not great. That resulted in the worst critical reception of an M3 ever. It took ZCP to make the car drive like it should have.

I would also point out they were so proud of the direct rear subframe mount, which was of questionable value. It is already gone in the G8x and yet performance and ride quality have increased.

These are big companies and complicated projects, there won't be one single person responsible for success or failure.

[themnmd]

Originally Posted by RyanBMW

No kidding, it's so obvious

Sorry to be captain obvious

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by omasou

I read it. The M2CS was decided before the first M2 was released. I don't believe the forum conjecture that the M2C and then M2CS were after thoughts.

I never intimated they were after thoughts. Working on a line up and delivering the line up are two different things.

Yes, it would have been decided on paper that "yes, we will also have a M2 CS at the end of production cycle", however, after the decision was made, it was entirely DEVELOPED under Flasch' leadership.

Bean counters decide the line up; engineers make the machine; visionaries deliver the dream. Arguably so, M2 CS is touted as one of the best of M-Division's products by many reviewers and owners alike. This may even prove to extend well beyond the Fxx generation.

That's my take on it anyway and I acknowledge your views equally

[4everkidd]

Blame the G80…