[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by ///M TOWN

I believe so, but not in North America ❕

Originally Posted by dmboone25

So the North American G87s get a different part? Or is it just not monitored here? The latter is the case with the 718s, which means it can be swapped / tuned without a check engine light, but the part itself is still a choke point.

My understanding is the European G 87 M2 has a particular filter which is pretty much the same thing you’re describing

I may in fact be wrong, but definitely North American bound cars do not

[c1pher]

Originally Posted by ///M TOWN

My understanding is the European G 87 M2 has a particular filter which is pretty much the same thing you’re describing

I may in fact be wrong, but definitely North American bound cars do not

That would be awesome.

[mirob]

But, Throttle House tells me the car is trash...

Eat your heart out, haters.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by nathanm4

I'm convinced the only Cayman worth buying is its GT4 variant.

Beat me to it

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by mirob

But, Throttle House tells me the car is trash...

Eat your heart out, haters.

They’re only entertainers

Nothing serious about them

[mirob]

Originally Posted by ///M TOWN

They’re only entertainers

Nothing serious about them

I give Thomas credit because I believe he's a pretty good driver, but at the end of the day, you're right, that's what they are...and they're pretty good at it.

[///M TOWN]

Yes but you definitely have to take them both with a heap of salt

No reason to take them to serious

Fun to watch them regardless

[Kevin_The_Clean1]

It's nice to see this level of performance squeezed out of a bone stock RWD G87 M2. Now imagine what some better rubber & negative camber to help dial out some of the understeer could do. And maybe a AWD variant down the line too. The future looks good for this new M machine & I'm looking forward to the S58 going out with a big bang. Also, the shifts seem pretty delayed. A proper XHP TCU tune could've really woken up those shifts up...

[Mako]

Completely different cars for different buyers, example I have a M3 (dd, family car) and am looking at cayman/boxster as a fun weekend car, but would never consider a M2 instead.

Having said that, I still find it hard to believe the GTS would lose with the same tires and driver in each. Yeah it’s down on power/torque but also weighs 700 lbs less (I think, educated guess from weights I remember seeing).

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by Mako

Completely different cars for different buyers, example I have a M3 (dd, family car) and am looking at cayman/boxster as a fun weekend car, but would never consider a M2 instead.

Having said that, I still find it hard to believe the GTS would lose with the same tires and driver in each. Yeah it’s down on power/torque but also weighs 700 lbs less (I think, educated guess from weights I remember seeing).

They’re really the only cars out I like

Boxster Spyder is my true favorite

I agree with your assessment❕

[T_U_D]

Originally Posted by nathanm4

I'm convinced the only Cayman worth buying is its GT4 variant.

Drive one on the street for a couple days, your opinion will more than likely change.

[babym_gen]

Btw, I didn't post this to shit on the Porsche, I am a true car lover, I would love a Dacia Logan the same for what it is and brings to the world. I posted this for the haters who never gave this car a chance or appreciated the engineering work within the constraints because muh ugly muh fat.

[Bimmerfun82]

It’s impressive that a daily driver, practical 2+2 coupe in the $65k (USD) price range is this brutishly fast around a track. Perhaps we can see a track compare with a base 911.

[hoyasaxa]

Originally Posted by Mako

Completely different cars for different buyers, example I have a M3 (dd, family car) and am looking at cayman/boxster as a fun weekend car, but would never consider a M2 instead.

Having said that, I still find it hard to believe the GTS would lose with the same tires and driver in each. Yeah it’s down on power/torque but also weighs 700 lbs less (I think, educated guess from weights I remember seeing).

Yah this is just forum bait. Different days, tires, and drivers. The M2 isn’t competitive with the GTS and isn’t even in the same class of car. But if you can gin up a YouTube video showing the M2 to be “faster,” you get some clicks and some ad revenue.

[VIERsr]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Does the G87 has gas particulate filters like the 718 4.0 cars do? I don't recall seeing anything on that front, but I might have missed it.

Replacing the OAPs on a 718 with one of the NA engines can yield decent HP increases (depending on the manufacturer), especially with a tune. IIRC, JCR claims somewhere around 30 BHP from swapping out the OAPs...

That's a nice advantage to the M2 if there aren't any filters...

Just to clarify:
1) ALL new cars sold in Europe are equipped with particulate filters, both diesel (DPF/FAP, since 2010) and gasoline (OPF/GPF, since 2021), although quite different. Removing them will inevitably result in an engine warning light coming on.
In the United States, only a few cars are equipped with it, including Porsches, but they are not connected to any back pressure sensor (just like the secondary catalytic converters in the Bmws), so if you remove them you will not have any check engine light. No particulate filters on American BMWs instead.
That said, both cars in the video are European (German) and therefore have particulate filters.
2) NA-spec tires are Porsche-specific tires with a dedicated compound that is totally different from normal tires. Therefore, there is no disadvantage to the Cayman tires, quite the contrary.

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by T_U_D

Drive one on the street for a couple days, your opinion will more than likely change.

Kidney’s will thank you if you don’t

[G30M]

Originally Posted by 10"

Disclaimer: I am not even a Porsche fanboy, in fact I don’t like most of them.

I don’t understand statements like these.

modern car culture is infected with an obsession over lap times—even though they are largely irrelevant to the enjoyment and fun in driving a car.

So you’ve negated the Cayman S being mid-engined, much lighter, with a much smaller wheelbase, lower to the ground, a true sports car—-just because of a lap time?

I’ve driven a Cayman (base), Cayman S, Cayman GTS, and Cayman R across different generations—they aren’t my favourite cars BUT even a base Cayman is a very dynamic sports car. Not worth negating because of a lap time…

it's like saying the only BMW worth buying is the M5 CS *drool

i like my slow 3 Touring, looks better than the M3 Touring!

However! of all the 718s, i agree the GT4 (not the RS) looks the best of any car i've ever seen. maybe. but i wouldn't want to be driving it around the pot hole riddled roads in my area! not sure about the flat six sound, too drony for me.

[PLF69]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

Yah this is just forum bait. Different days, tires, and drivers. The M2 isn’t competitive with the GTS and isn’t even in the same class of car. But if you can gin up a YouTube video showing the M2 to be “faster,” you get some clicks and some ad revenue.

You sir have a clear vision.

I tracked G8X extensively and it doesn't hold a candle vs the 718 chassis on dynamics at the limit.

[LCDRJohn]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

Yah this is just forum bait. Different days, tires, and drivers. The M2 isn’t competitive with the GTS and isn’t even in the same class of car. But if you can gin up a YouTube video showing the M2 to be “faster,” you get some clicks and some ad revenue.

Gents, there are many lessons to be learned here.

Disclosure: I alternate my daily between a 2019 GT3 and a 2022 Miata, so I have no hate for P-cars. I've owned caymans and 911s on/off for decades. My M2 is going to be my commuter car.

The first thing is that one car may not be faster than another around one track vs. another. No one seems to acknowledge this. They just say, "It's faster!!™" Full stop!

Well, that ain't how it works. When we ran motorsports, our cars would do well on some tracks and not on others. That is just physics. It's also why "Ring numbers" are for idiots. Drag, weight, fuel consumption, torque curves, front grip, rear grip, all chose the track for us to win at. And some to lose at.

It also underscores that weight has a bigger sway on lap 10 than on lap 1 or 2. Did you know that the M2 and GTS 4.0 have the same amount of cornering grip? Eh, they do. Did you know they have the same braking distances? Eh, they do. And I can tell you that a GT3 has major issues trying to keep up with the turbo 3.0 that porsche puts in the 911 GTS. In fact, the GTS is usually faster, because it can put the GT3's max torque out...almost anywhere on the tach instead of just at 8000 rpm.

So, in this case, this track, which had some pretty big straights and never put a serious burden on the front tires, favored the M2 and the P-car lost. It's that simple. If this were a real race, the M2 would have probably led for 5 or so laps, until tires get greasy, and then the balance and lightness of the GTS would have allowed it to pass. But the middle of the race would have been a thriller, with the power of the M against the chassis of the GTS. On a more technical track, we also would have likely seen another result. Which underscores that there is not a categorically "better car" that will assert dominance in all circumstances.

Spice of life, guys.

[mfarrzhp]

Originally Posted by mirob

But, Throttle House tells me the car is trash...

Eat your heart out, haters.

I don’t recall TH saying the M2 wouldn’t throw down a great lap time. Their issues were mainly the design, power delivery (in the manual), weight, and ironically too much stability made it less fun than the previous gen.

I like the styling of the G87 for the most part. I’m sure it’s a lot of fun to drive, but TH is entitled to their opinion even if subjective and biased.

I’m guessing with their current revenue and subscription numbers, Thomas could trade his F87 for a G87 without a second thought it he wanted to.

[cbertels]

Originally Posted by 10"

Disclaimer: I am not even a Porsche fanboy, in fact I don’t like most of them.

I don’t understand statements like these.

modern car culture is infected with an obsession over lap times—even though they are largely irrelevant to the enjoyment and fun in driving a car.

So you’ve negated the Cayman S being mid-engined, much lighter, with a much smaller wheelbase, lower to the ground, a true sports car—-just because of a lap time?

I’ve driven a Cayman (base), Cayman S, Cayman GTS, and Cayman R across different generations—they aren’t my favourite cars BUT even a base Cayman is a very dynamic sports car. Not worth negating because of a lap time…

Also mere mortals are unlikely to replicate the laps of their favorite cars. More likely we’d be beaten in the faster car by a better driver in a slower car. With that in mind, why not shoot for the most engaging and enjoyable car to drive?
:rant:

[VIERsr]

Originally Posted by hoyasaxa

Yah this is just forum bait. Different days, tires, and drivers. The M2 isn’t competitive with the GTS and isn’t even in the same class of car. But if you can gin up a YouTube video showing the M2 to be “faster,” you get some clicks and some ad revenue.

I don't get it.
This is a test made by the German magazine Sport Auto, obviously both cars were driven on the same day by the same driver, it is a comparison

And both have OEM-spec tires, respectively the best you can get from the factory for both.