[dArNeLLi]

this will ruin the e/d experience, the autobahn was key role in my trip!

[ski360]

It will never happen, the Germans will never let it the EU dictate the autobahn speed limit.

[Lost Cosmonaut]

Originally Posted by ski360

It will never happen, the Germans will never let it the EU dictate the autobahn speed limit.

I think if Great Britain can keep using the pound instead of the Euro, the Germans should be able to keep the Autobahn.

- LC

[Dante]

Originally Posted by Lost Cosmonaut

I think if Great Britain can keep using the pound instead of the Euro, the Germans should be able to keep the Autobahn.

- LC

I really hope you're right!

[ski360]

Originally Posted by Lost Cosmonaut

I think if Great Britain can keep using the pound instead of the Euro, the Germans should be able to keep the Autobahn.

- LC

Trust me, It won't happen...They pride them selves way to much on their Autobahns.

[danimal]

Originally Posted by Chi-town330

Since I wrote a post, I will add one totally un-related comment that has probably been beat to death on here: no temp gauge in the E90? WTF?

Realized this after I bought it. Oh yea, I would totally rather have a stupid fuel consumption gauge than a temp gauge....not.

I was thinking the same thing, but if I had a choice between coolant temp and fuel consumption, I'd choose fuel consumption. At least it moves and provides information even when the car is not overheating

From what I've read on this forum, oil temp is what matters for telling you when the engine is ready for WOT and high revs. Don't know if I need a gauge for that either--I just want to know when the engine is ready for hard use (maybe some red/yellow/green lights on the tach a la M5/M6).

I like the fuel consumption gauge for when I'm stuck in traffic. I make a game out of seeing how smooth and efficient I can be, and check the gauge to see how well I'm doing. What can I say, I'm geeky like that

-Dan

[MacAttack]

Dante is right. Way too much traffic and much more dangerous with all the construction with extremely narrow bypasses, foriegn truckers pulling into the passing lane at 50 mph screeching everyone to a halt trying to pass, causing accidents and stau's (traffic jams). Even with that, Germany has the most efficient and professional drivers license program generating an experienced & rule abiding (generally) set of drivers out there. Know that its not easy getting a license over here. Costs $$$ and many hours on the road with an instructor.

As for the autobahn....my vote is no limits..which there are fewer areas than it used to be. Why...the German drivers know what they're doing. Everyone pulls in the right lane after passing a car, no one tail gates, you don't have young derelict kids driving amuck like they stole it, etc. List goes on. I love it here.

[BLUE LABEL]

not happening

[rpiopio]

Originally Posted by MacAttack

Why...the German drivers know what they're doing. Everyone pulls in the right lane after passing a car, no one tail gates, you don't have young derelict kids driving amuck like they stole it, etc.

+1

That is my biggest Praise for the German roads, courteous drivers. These guys know what they're doing. The left lane is NOT "I'm going the speed limit so I can stay here" lane, it's a freakin PASSING LANE. The worst was coming back from ED and dealing with the monkeys on the roads at home.

[Lost Cosmonaut]

My wife and I were talking about this at lunch. I really really wish the US would enact some rules about driving to bring us closer to Europe as far as the capability of drivers.

The MAJOR reason America has problems with drivers is because driving is treated as a RIGHT not a privilege like it is in Europe and primarily Germany. Driving is and always should be a privilege, even in America where... Well, it would scare alot of people to see the kind of people that get handed a drivers license. I mean, you all know some pretty stupid drivers and wonder "how in the world did they get a license?!", but I've had some personal experiences that would raise hairs on your neck.

But of course, being the "Land of the Free (But Highly Legislated)", you'd never see wide-sweeping rules to improve the drivers out there.

/rant

- LC

[MaDoose]

who cares, i leave germany in 62 days, they can have this place

[bimmerFUD]

Originally Posted by Anan

Not true. Air resistance increases exponentially with speed.

Not true. It goes like the square of the speed (v * v, not exp(v)). That's a HUGE difference when v is big...try putting exp(100) in your calculator.

[Zwanzigoetzel]

Originally Posted by MacAttack

Dante is right. Way too much traffic and much more dangerous with all the construction with extremely narrow bypasses, foriegn truckers pulling into the passing lane at 50 mph screeching everyone to a halt trying to pass, causing accidents and stau's (traffic jams). Even with that, Germany has the most efficient and professional drivers license program generating an experienced & rule abiding (generally) set of drivers out there. Know that its not easy getting a license over here. Costs $$$ and many hours on the road with an instructor.

As for the autobahn....my vote is no limits..which there are fewer areas than it used to be. Why...the German drivers know what they're doing. Everyone pulls in the right lane after passing a car, no one tail gates, you don't have young derelict kids driving amuck like they stole it, etc. List goes on. I love it here.

Hi there,
People, don't worry! The autobahn will always be without speed limits. It's like trying to take away Thanksgiving for Americans! Germans (including myself) won't stand for it. It's nothing more than a political discussion because it's "IN" now to talk about Global Warming and saving the environment!
As to the cost of the driving license, boy do I remember it. Even 17 years ago when I got mine, it was 2500 German marks, roughly 1800 Euros I'd say. The training that is obligatory was about 6 months which included tons driving and classroom sessions including so called night driving. So it's no surprise that Germans are superior drivers.

Gruss,

Zwanzigoetzel

[ages944]

Originally Posted by bimmerFUD

Not true. It goes like the square of the speed (v * v, not exp(v)). That's a HUGE difference when v is big...try putting exp(100) in your calculator.

exp(100) = 2.68811714 × 10^43
...my calculator's Google (no pun intended)


Either way, I hope Germany threatens to invade something if they can't keep their Autobahns. Seriously, I thought Europe got over it's fascination with dictators? If so, then what's with the benevolent dictator model aka the EU? Does everyone have to give up all their liberties in the names of safety and security?

[010101]

Ummmmmmm if you force cars to drive slower then they will be on the road longer. If cars are on the road longer there will be more of them on there at any one time. If there are more on the road at any one time traffic will increase. If traffic increases then people will have to slow down even more. If people slow down too much emissions will increase. If emissions increase because of increased traffic this whole thing is completely pointless.

Screw the EU. Long live the autobahn! And to the poster who said taking the autobahn from Germans would be like taking Thanksgiving away from us... I would gladly trade thanksgiving for an autobahn. Hell I'd trade every holiday of the year including my birthday for one After visiting Germany I am very envious of you guys. Living in a country where the traffic laws make no sense sucks. You are more likely to die in an accident and you have to drive slow... worst of both worlds.

[Zwanzigoetzel]

Originally Posted by 010101

Ummmmmmm if you force cars to drive slower then they will be on the road longer. If cars are on the road longer there will be more of them on there at any one time. If there are more on the road at any one time traffic will increase. If traffic increases then people will have to slow down even more. If people slow down too much emissions will increase. If emissions increase because of increased traffic this whole thing is completely pointless.

Screw the EU. Long live the autobahn! And to the poster who said taking the autobahn from Germans would be like taking Thanksgiving away from us... I would gladly trade thanksgiving for an autobahn. Hell I'd trade every holiday of the year including my birthday for one After visiting German I am very envious of you guys. Living in a country where the traffic laws make no sense sucks. You are more likely to die in an accident and you have to drive slow... worst of both worlds.

Hahaha...can't agree more. It can be VERY frustrating driving in this country, and at this point I only own a freakin' slow ass SATURN Only God knows what will happen once I have my BMW! I see trouble on the horizon....Big trouble.....

[Pedal2Floor]

While I don't believe Germany should change, I think there are few facts wrong here:

1) Not all Autobahn roads have an unlimited speed limit
2) They are talking about lower the speed to 80mph vs unlimited on some roads. That is still more than the US.
3) We have lots of traffic laws here that are not enforced. Since the Police often function as an extention of the tax department in many states, they go after the biggest fines they can get, which is speeding. Why because police and law makers are stupid and easy revenue that they can argue in the press in their favor and hide it as a benefit for the public. If the governments would simply raise the fine for illegally driving on the left lane (or other traffic stupidity), then the tax man would go after a different target and drivers would change habits. Not all states nor all highways have a not left lane driving law which is another problem.

4) Sprawl and lack of public transportation in the suburbs forces people to have cars and to drive to work, school or just get groceries so more stringent driving schools will never work in the US. Also, the people who run the DOT in each state believe that if people are given better driving instruction like the 3 or 5 day defensive driving courses at Skip Barber then people will take more chances on the road. This is supported by groups who claim that people who play driving simulations take more risks on the road because they believe what they can do in a video game they can do on the road. I believe its more of a social thing and nobody having respect for other people or other peoples things and we are still stuck in the 80s its all about me funk.

IMHO

[ski360]

Originally Posted by Pedal2Floor

While I don't believe Germany should change, I think there are few facts wrong here:

1) Not all Autobahn roads have an unlimited speed limit
2) They are talking about lower the speed to 80mph vs unlimited on some roads. That is still more than the US.
3) We have lots of traffic laws here that are not enforced. Since the Police often function as an extention of the tax department in many states, they go after the biggest fines they can get, which is speeding. Why because police and law makers are stupid and easy revenue that they can argue in the press in their favor and hide it as a benefit for the public. If the governments would simply raise the fine for illegally driving on the left lane (or other traffic stupidity), then the tax man would go after a different target and drivers would change habits. Not all states nor all highways have a not left lane driving law which is another problem.

4) Sprawl and lack of public transportation in the suburbs forces people to have cars and to drive to work, school or just get groceries so more stringent driving schools will never work in the US. Also, the people who run the DOT in each state believe that if people are given better driving instruction like the 3 or 5 day defensive driving courses at Skip Barber then people will take more chances on the road. This is supported by groups who claim that people who play driving simulations take more risks on the road because they believe what they can do in a video game they can do on the road. I believe its more of a social thing and nobody having respect for other people or other peoples things and we are still stuck in the 80s its all about me funk.

IMHO

1. No one is saying that all Autobahn's are unlimited
2. 80 Mph is = 130 Kph and the majority of the Autobahn that have limits are limited to 130, 120 Kph. Not to mention that even on sections that don't have a limit the recommended limit is still 130 Kph. None of the articles I've read on this even describe the speed they wish to lower it to.
3. The schools that are referred to that german drivers have to take are thousands of euros. and take forever to complete. The whole point is to ensure that the driver just doesn't drive in a defensive manner, its so they know the laws of customs of the road. I have yet to see a Farschuler (student driver) learning how to drive Skip Barber style.

[Lost Cosmonaut]

Originally Posted by 010101

You are more likely to die in an accident and you have to drive slow... worst of both worlds.

They have done studies on this. Back when Montana was unlimited speed there were alot of injury accidents but very little fatalities. On the other hand, when they put speed limits into force across the state, fatalities skyrocketed while plain injury accidents went down.

I attribute this fact to human herd mentality on the road. You see it all the time, particularly in bad weather when it's the worst time to happen. With a speed limit, it forces the cars into small bunches which makes the possibility of multiple car accidents much higher. Multiple car accidents have a higher likelihood to cause fatalities.

When the speed limits are higher people have much more of a tendency to drive their own race. They also tend to be more cautious.

Honestly, I would love to see speedlimits removed in the US particularly on empty stretches of interstates. Combine it with stricter rules about who can get a license and stricter enforcement of road aggression and other rules rather than speed alone (like Germany does) would solve alot of driving problems around here, IMO. Of course, it'll never happen with those of the public and government who feel determined to create arbitrary laws to attempt to futilely save us from ourselves.

The irony is most of the countries trying to enforce these rules in Germany have some of the worst drivers you'll find in Europe. Maybe they think Germany is just making them look bad?

- LC

[funkahdafi]

as someone coming from and living in Germany I can tell you this: 90% of the Autobahn roads already have speed limits. So deploying a general speed limit wouldn't change much in terms of pollution.

Plus, although Germany is very pro-Europe, we are a strong influence in the EU and it will not be easy to force that speed limit upon our country.

But we shall see. Even if they put it on, it won't change much, because as I said, 90% of the roads already fall under some kind of speed limit anyways.

I can see one positive thing about the speed limit though: Less agression on the Autobahn = less fatal accidents (has anyone in the US ever seen cars that got involved in a high speed accident on the Autobahn? Trust me, you don't want to see it).

My 2 cents.

[ukthunderace]

The unlimited poritons of the autobahn are great, but don't fool yourself into thinking that driving here in Germany is an experience of sharing the road with excellent drivers.
In the past couple of years I have seen a realy decline in driving. People in the slow lane put their indicator on and change lanes without looking into the fast lane. This is all the time. When they get in the fast lane, they continue to go 100kph and hold up traffic. Then, if there is anything in the slow lane within the next half mile, they will stay in the fast lane until they finally overtake that vehicle. Sometimes I just overtake them in the right lane, but that is illegal here, so not very often...only when really really frustrated.
And here, if you are frustrated, you can not even flip someone off as you go by. If they get your license plate, they can bring you into court and charge you. You end up paying a couple of hundred Euro.

[010101]

Originally Posted by funkahdafi

Less agression on the Autobahn = less fatal accidents (has anyone in the US ever seen cars that got involved in a high speed accident on the Autobahn? Trust me, you don't want to see it).

My 2 cents.

I have seen videos of these accidents. I think that means that if you get into an accident on the autobahn you are more likely to die. Yet there are still FAR less driving fatalities per capita. To me this just makes a stronger case for leaving the autobahn the way it is.