[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by Maestro

Here is what I know about FIOS.

First, Verizon paid to installed all the fiber, they did this because they did not want the government to regulate the Fiber like they do the copper wires which DSL runs on. Since the pay all the cost verse it being subsidized like copper was back in the day they can do what they want with it. However, they are still required to use the right a ways owned by the government. To gain access to the right a ways Verizon said they would run fiber everywhere, which they did, except what is know as the last mile or community demarcation.

Since Fiber is expensive to put in and maintain VZ made a decision some yrs back to only hook communities which meet certain criteria. That criteria is average income for the homes, if the communities average income is not over a certain number like $100K they did not bother running the fiber to any of the homes in that area. VZ decided to only go after top tier customers, they were not interesting in most of the Comcast customer who pay for the minimum package like $20/month. VZ wants customer who are going to spend $100 to $200/month.

This is probably why you can not get FIOS around you and why your mom can not get DSL since they are not installing any new copper based equipment, as they move people to FIOS they turning off all that copper equipment. When my mom got FIOS they removed all the copper phone lines to her house all the way back to the pole.

Comcast Cables were also subsidize back in the day that is why most places have it and Comcast will be the one stuck supporting all the place VZ does not think it worth putting in the fiber. Most of Comcast customer are basic subscribers and VZ and DirecTV have all the higher tier customers.

The area where I live in now is not lower or even just middle middle class. Home prices on average for existing homes are around $400k. The new construction going up around me have single family home starting in the $400s which ultimately end up in the low $500s. The influx of people escaping the higher cost of living in the neighboring counties are is what is driving up the prices of homes here along with changing the income demographics. While comparatively speaking, these home prices are not the tops for this region, they're certainly not at the middle or bottom.

I'll have to find the news articles behind the pact Verizon entered into with the cable companies to stop expansion of FIOS into non existing markets. But that is the primary reason why there has been no FIOS expansion and not because of income demographics.

[Scout10]

Geeeee . . . . . sorry no sympathy. Your worst days with them is
NORMAL for years where i am.
There is no choice ! Charter . . . . . sucks.
.
actually i wish i had your choices

[Never_Enough]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

The area where I live in now is not lower or even just middle middle class. Home prices on average for existing homes are around $400k. The new construction going up around me have single family home starting in the $400s which ultimately end up in the low $500s. The influx of people escaping the higher cost of living in the neighboring counties are is what is driving up the prices of homes here along with changing the income demographics. While comparatively speaking, these home prices are not the tops for this region, they're certainly not at the middle or bottom.

I'll have to find the news articles behind the pact Verizon entered into with the cable companies to stop expansion of FIOS into non existing markets. But that is the primary reason why there has been no FIOS expansion and not because of income demographics.

So $400k is low cost of living? LMAO

[Maestro]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

The area where I live in now is not lower or even just middle middle class. Home prices on average for existing homes are around $400k. The new construction going up around me have single family home starting in the $400s which ultimately end up in the low $500s. The influx of people escaping the higher cost of living in the neighboring counties are is what is driving up the prices of homes here along with changing the income demographics. While comparatively speaking, these home prices are not the tops for this region, they're certainly not at the middle or bottom.

I'll have to find the news articles behind the pact Verizon entered into with the cable companies to stop expansion of FIOS into non existing markets. But that is the primary reason why there has been no FIOS expansion and not because of income demographics.

It is not House price it is household income they look at and there use to be a real estate app that showed you what the median income was based on an address not sure it that feature is available anymore. When I did my area the medium income was close to $150K and we have FIOS. I work in the video delivery equipment industry and Verizon was one of our largest customers and when the first started to install Fiber they use to give us big number since they had grand plans they were going to run fiber to every home. Then the number began falling out and we asked them what the deal was, that is when they shared they only going after the top tier customers. Trust me they want every last customer who is willing to spend $200/month.

Even in my neighborhood, not everyone has fiber to the house, not even mine. They ran the fiber down the street, but will not run it to your house until to sign up. When they come to the door and ask you to sign up they profile you, they want to know how much you spend and do you have premium channels. Because I do not bundle I do not pay a lot. My internet phone is $3/ month, Internet is $50 and my TV is $70. Every time Verizon stopped by they could not tough my deal they would always coming higher.

If they keep building around you FIOS will show up they need enough people in the area to make it worth their time.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by Maestro

It is not House price it is household income they look at and there use to be a real estate app that showed you what the median income was based on an address not sure it that feature is available anymore. When I did my area the medium income was close to $150K and we have FIOS. I work in the video delivery equipment industry and Verizon was one of our largest customers and when the first started to install Fiber they use to give us big number since they had grand plans they were going to run fiber to every home. Then the number began falling out and we asked them what the deal was, that is when they shared they only going after the top tier customers. Trust me they want every last customer who is willing to spend $200/month.

Even in my neighborhood, not everyone has fiber to the house, not even mine. They ran the fiber down the street, but will not run it to your house until to sign up. When they come to the door and ask you to sign up they profile you, they want to know how much you spend and do you have premium channels. Because I do not bundle I do not pay a lot. My internet phone is $3/ month, Internet is $50 and my TV is $70. Every time Verizon stopped by they could not tough my deal they would always coming higher.

If they keep building around you FIOS will show up they need enough people in the area to make it worth their time.

First, here's an article talking about the cellular spectrum deal I spoke about Verizon entered with the cable companies:

https://www.cnet.com/news/what-3-9-b...ns-to-you-faq/

So this is not some worker giving their own myopic view or basing it on hearsay.

Second, home values doe have a bearing on income level. We're no longer in the world of liar loans where anyone with a pulse could have obtained a mortgage for houses they have no business buying even if they worked their entire life to just pay the principle. There are literally a few homes about a mile from my house valued into the 7 figures.

The market dynamics in my area is such that there are household incomes in the 6 figures. Many of these households are also in the tech space and would spend the money on faster access.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by Never_Enough

So $400k is low cost of living? LMAO

In the DC area depending on where you live, yes.

[catcher22]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

And what are you basing this on? If you're talking about what AT&T and Verizon are providing as a service over fiber then yes. If you're talking about fiber versus copper cabling, then read what I wrote to understand why there's no real advantage of one over another.

I had Comcast cable for 10 years. I've had Verizon Fios for about the same now, about 10 years. I'm no networking guy, but know quite a lot about IT/computers in general (only have a degree in it) and have been working in the IT realm my entire career. Today, latency numbers are so close, they're of least concern to the common individual (MAYBE gamers though).

Anyway I'm basing it on the reliability of Fios (doesn't even go down when the power goes out due to a 4 hour Fios back up battery, just gotta plug a laptop directly into the ONT), the dedicated fiber optic line directly to each residence, good Verizon customer service (great compared to Comcast), newer technology, the list goes on and on....

I doubt Comcast offers gigabit internet too. 940 down/880 up!

OP made the right decision to leave Comcast cable for Verizon Fios.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by catcher22

I had Comcast cable for 10 years. I've had Verizon Fios for about the same now, about 10 years. I'm no networking guy, but know quite a lot about IT/computers in general (only have a degree in it) and have been working in the IT realm my entire career. Today, latency numbers are so close, they're of least concern to the common individual (MAYBE gamers though).

Anyway I'm basing it on the reliability of Fios (doesn't even go down when the power goes out due to a 4 hour Fios back up battery, just gotta plug a laptop directly into the ONT), the dedicated fiber optic line directly to each residence, good Verizon customer service (great compared to Comcast), newer technology, the list goes on and on....

I doubt Comcast offers gigabit internet too. 940 down/880 up!

OP made the right decision to leave Comcast cable for Verizon Fios.

That's why I asked about the basis of your statement on going with fiber. As I've said repeatedly, just because your connectivity is delivered via fiber doesn't automatically make it faster. It's only a transport medium. The network equipment on both ends dictate the speed with the assumption the fiber being used is of a specification which will support whatever wavelength of choice is being used for the optics and the distance between end points. Fiber isn't just fiber. There are vary types out there such as 62.5, 50, and 9 micron fiber. Multi mode versus single mode.

Not arguing with you about the reliability of the ISP circuits during a power outage. I don't think Comcast is bound by the same requirements as Verizon since Verizon is responsible for the old POTS lines for land lines. Because Verizon is replacing the copper lines as indicated by Maestro, I'm pretty sure there's probably some government mandate to require reliability for phone service. When Sandy blew by, we lost power for 3 days. Even though I could keep some of my equipment up and running with a UPS at the time, Comcast was down on their end. So it wouldn't matter if I had power to my networking equipment or not. But my land line was still working as it's the old but tried and true POTS line.

I'm also not going to argue with you about the whether cable is going to be able to provide Gigabit service to the home. Currently they can't based on the current DOCSIS standard.

For full disclosure, if I could get FIOS, I would. But I don't have that choice. It's either Comcast or DSL. Me wanting FIOS isn't because of it being fiber. It's because of the symmetrical up/down speeds and the availability of more speed tiers. It's better at my primary residence versus my vacation property. There I only have one choice...Mediacrap...I mean Mediacom. And they provide service accordingly knowing they're the only game in town.

[EALm4]

If I had the option to switch to FIOS, I would in a heart beat. Comcast blows.

I switched to Comcast's highest speed and still got shit performance. Even had their tech come out and rewire the rooms since he said my condo had really old coax cable and it couldnt get a solid signal through it. They did it for free and was a nice gesture but I noticed ZERO difference in speed. So I dropped back down to some middle of the road speed.

I had FIOS back in the day when I didnt live in the city and had roommates. 3 dudes streaming all sorts of shit and over 6 connected active devices on at any given point and we had zero bandwidth problems.

Looking to buy a house now and having FIOS is a huge factor in where we decide to look.

[Never_Enough]

I'm all switched over to Fios

[infinitekidM2C]

Originally Posted by Never_Enough

I'm all switched over to Fios

what's your down and upload speeds?

[Shipkiller]

I had Cox Cable for almost 30 years. Service was superb and I had virtually no down time the entire time. I switched to Fios about a year ago. Using the same approx. services as a benchmarks, I save over $175/month with Fios and I opted for the higher 150/150 internet speed over the theoretical 100Mb/sec you get with DOCSIS 3 over copper. I and my whole family saw a noticeable picture quality improvement with Fios.

Doing a speed test with Fios, I regularly get 175Mb/sec up and down. I can get their new gigbit speeds, but for me its not really necessary for the extra $40/month.

One thing on Fios not normally known until after installation.
When you subscribe to the Fios service, you will most likely already have fiber to the house for your phone line. This single mode (8nm) fiber connects to the Optical Network Translator (ONT). The ONT splits out the different frequency ranges to different ports on the output of the ONT. One connection is standard phone lines (2 lines), basically a Voice over IP (VoIP) translator . Another port is a copper (coax) MODEC connection. This is your primary network interface for the 50/50 and 100/100 internet service. It is also the back channel for the TV menus and two way communication for service upgrades, pay per view (PPV) etc. etc. The ONT also has an Ethernet connection. This is enabled for speeds above the 100/100 but if you ask the installer they will have the main office to enable it for the lower speeds if you want that separate connection. To reiterate, the Ethernet port is not enable by default for the lower speeds. You must ASK for it to be enabled. No extra cost. It is enabled by default for the 150/150 and above speeds.

The copper MODEC cable is then connected to a splitter. The splitter filters all the unnecessary frequency's (non-internet) for the cable connection to the Fios router (mentioned below). The other coax connections are routed to your primary DVR and the smaller set top boxes. We have five (5) TVs in the house. The DVR has six (6) tuners. My DVR will hold over 320 hours of 1080P high def programming..

Currently the MODEC (coax) and Ethernet port (if enabled) are then connected to the Fios router, which is your firewall. My Fios ActionTEC router has two Wifi transceivers. A 2.4Mhz and a 5Mhz. I personally do not use the WiFi on the router. I use Ubiquity Commercial Grade WiFi in my house. I'll never use consumer WiFi again..... That is a topic for a different thread.

If you only have Fios for internet and or phone, you do NOT need to use the Verizon router... It MUST be used for TV for full interactive Fios TV operation.

Initially, I did try not using the Fios router and just use my own firewall. Internet and TV worked but I could not use the PPV or the on the TV screen caller ID for the phone. I also could not remotely control/program the DVR except for on the TV. After about two months of experimentation with port forwards and such, I put the Fios router back in and reconfigured my network. Now its pretty cool to be able to program my DVR from outside the home and watch something on the Fios network, all on my phone, tablet etc... using the Fios app. I did put my firewall between my Fios router and internal network.

I recommend putting your own firewall between the Fios router and your home network. If you do not, then the Verizon techs can get to any machine on your internal network... Not something I recommend...
The Verizon router does have the ability to put one internal IP address in a DMZ so it has direct access to the internet, while all other ports on the router will be firewalled. This helps with the pains of double NATing...



I am a Submarine Combat Systems Electrical/Computer Engineer.
RedHat Linux System Engineer
Microsoft System Engineer
Cisco Switch Engineer
Certified Fiber Optic Installer and Maintenance and Blown Fiber Tech

[Never_Enough]

Originally Posted by infinitekid2002

what's your down and upload speeds?

Just tested via speedtest.net
245 mbps down & 211 mbps up

[infinitekidM2C]

Originally Posted by Never_Enough

Just tested via speedtest.net
245 mbps down & 211 mbps up

nice

[paliknight]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Be thankful you have a choice. At my primary residence, the only real high speed broadband I have access to is Comcast. Overall the service has been pretty good but the stupidity about having asynchronous speeds is just beyond me. Verizon only offers DSL in this area because they entered into an anti consumer deal with the cable companies about getting cellular RF space in exchange for not entering into new market areas with FIOS where they don't already have a presence.

At my vacation place, it's even worse. I have to deal with Mediacrap...I mean Mediacom. Those bastards are blatantly traffic shaping my usage as when I stream anything, the video gets throttled to a crawl. But they're the only game in town as Verizon doesn't even offer DSL...only POTS service. The only other real options are cellular Internet and satellite.

Comcast I'm paying about $86 a month for 150/10 service. Mediacrap I'm paying about $50 for 20/2 service. I also looked into getting business class service with Comcast and got sticker shock. I'll pay if the service seems reasonable for the cost. But at $140 a month for 50/10 service just so I can get more than one public IP is way too much. I checked on what the next tier speed would cost and at 100/20, it comes out at $180 a month.

Dude youre in the DC area. Verizon has 1gbps speeds for 70 bucks a month!!

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by paliknight

Dude youre in the DC area. Verizon has 1gbps speeds for 70 bucks a month!!

Verizon only offers DSL where I am. Comcast is all I have other than paying to have an OC3 or above pulled to my house specifically and dropping 5 figures or more for installation depending on how far away the fiber has to be run; if it's even an option.

[paliknight]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Verizon only offers DSL where I am. Comcast is all I have other than paying to have an OC3 or above pulled to my house specifically and dropping 5 figures or more for installation depending on how far away the fiber has to be run; if it's even an option.

Shit thats insane. Verizon just dropped FIOS 1gbps for the DMV area. Surprised you dont even have FIOS.

[bimmerfrk]

This thread made me try Fios once more since they released 1gigabit speed on Long Island NY.

Just got it installed on Friday. So far so good. But still think Fios is going to one up me and fuck me up the ass some how.

Here are my current speeds: i will be paying 69.99 a month. Used my own router so i dont have to use their crap.

[infinitekidM2C]

Originally Posted by bimmerfrk

This thread made me try Fios once more since they released 1gigabit speed on Long Island NY.

Just got it installed on Friday. So far so good. But still think Fios is going to one up me and fuck me up the ass some how.

Here are my current speeds: i will be paying 69.99 a month. Used my own router so i dont have to use their crap.

Attachment 1643298

If it does fuck you up the ass at least it will be quick apparently!