[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by ksteckba

Somehow Max took him out again, but without being anywhere near him this time!

Yeah...I heard here in Belgium that Max has telepathic power .
In the next wet race he will show it again , just like he did last year in Brazil and Spain .

[chetrickerman]

Max was a total moron. Completely at fault for the crash

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

Max was a total moron. Completely at fault for the crash

That's BS.

[3798j]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

Max was a total moron. Completely at fault for the crash

There's a growing group that feels Max is going the way of Pastor (fast but stupid)..."If Max hasn't crashed yet, is it even a race?"

http://crashstappen.com

[chetrickerman]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

That's BS.

Why?

Originally Posted by 3798j

There's a growing group the feels Max is going the way of Pastor (fast but stupid)..."If Max hasn't crashed yet, is it even a race?"

http://crashstappen.com

Completely agree

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

Why?

Ohhh C'mon ! You really think the Ferrari team (VET and RAI) has better drivers ?
Honestly ...This was even worse !

[chetrickerman]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Ohhh C'mon ! You really think the Ferrari team (VET and RAI) has better drivers ?
Honestly ...This was even worse !

I do think Vettel is a better driver than Max, but that doesn't influence me to say that Max was not at fault for the crash when he clearly was. You are only allowed to block once, he blocked twice.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

I do think Vettel is a better driver than Max, but that doesn't influence me to say that Max was not at fault for the crash when he clearly was. You are only allowed to block once, he blocked twice.

I agree Vettel is the better driver. And that's because the Ferrari's are improved and faster .

[chetrickerman]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

I agree Vettel is the better driver. And that's because the Ferrari's are improved and faster .

Yes. Ferrari and Renault seem to have really stepped up their engine program. Now people just need to stop making stupid decisions and we will have good races.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Ohhh C'mon ! You really think the Ferrari team (VET and RAI) has better drivers ?
Honestly ...This was even worse !

I like that you posted a video that involved Max (arguably over-reacting to Vettel's movement and then getting hit by Kimi when Kimi cuts back too soon/aggressively). Almost seems like you're trolling us and you're actually a Hamilton fan

[jkoral]

Originally Posted by N52UNED

Agreed ... the whole race was a mess. Entertaining and frustrating all at the same time. Definitely wasn't a boring race.

I knew the full results before I could watch this race, yet I still really enjoyed it, totally entertaining. Really love the no commercial broadcast, even prefer the Sky F1 team.

I haven't missed a race since Speedvision brought F1 coverage to US in 1996. Was a little worried about ESPN, but so far so good!

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by ksteckba

I like that you posted a video that involved Max (arguably over-reacting to Vettel's movement and then getting hit by Kimi when Kimi cuts back too soon/aggressively). Almost seems like you're trolling us and you're actually a Hamilton fan

I'm pretty sure you know what I think about HAM.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

Yes. Ferrari and Renault seem to have really stepped up their engine program. Now people just need to stop making stupid decisions and we will have good races.

Yeah , let us hope .
One thing is for sure ...The suspense in F1 is back , because the domination of the Mercs is over ...
The thrill is on !

[TSM330i]

The ironic thing is that F1 supposedly has the "best" drivers in the world, but we've seen this over and over again when they get into a heated, close, wheel-to-wheel battle, they end up crashing (Force India and Red Bull).

This close racing is the norm in Indy Car, but the number of accidents isn't anywhere near as high.

I'm thinking it's part of the aero for F1 that is causing the issues. Once Daniel got too close to Max - the aero over his front wing was compromised and he lost a lot of downforce on his front wing. When he hit the brakes, the tires didn't have the grip they should have had and the braking was no where near where it should have been. Hence, he drove into the back of Max.

The new rules should hopefully sort this out. It'd be nice to see quicker cars actually have a chance to pass other cars without all the headaches of loss of aero.

[jkoral]

Originally Posted by TSM330i

I'm thinking it's part of the aero for F1 that is causing the issues. Once Daniel got too close to Max - the aero over his front wing was compromised and he lost a lot of downforce on his front wing. When he hit the brakes, the tires didn't have the grip they should have had and the braking was no where near where it should have been. Hence, he drove into the back of Max.

That's exactly what Brawn said:

"Once Daniel had settled for his line, and Max had changed direction blocking that line, the Australian became a passenger....The downforce loss experienced by Ricciardo in the wake of Verstappen's car would have made it unstoppable."

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...-in-baku-clash

[chetrickerman]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Yeah , let us hope .
One thing is for sure ...The suspense in F1 is back , because the domination of the Mercs is over ...
The thrill is on !

That's why I started watching again. It was boring as hell watching Merc win over and over.

[Rampant]

Originally Posted by TSM330i

The ironic thing is that F1 supposedly has the "best" drivers in the world, but we've seen this over and over again when they get into a heated, close, wheel-to-wheel battle, they end up crashing (Force India and Red Bull).

This close racing is the norm in Indy Car, but the number of accidents isn't anywhere near as high.

I'm thinking it's part of the aero for F1 that is causing the issues. Once Daniel got too close to Max - the aero over his front wing was compromised and he lost a lot of downforce on his front wing. When he hit the brakes, the tires didn't have the grip they should have had and the braking was no where near where it should have been. Hence, he drove into the back of Max.

The new rules should hopefully sort this out. It'd be nice to see quicker cars actually have a chance to pass other cars without all the headaches of loss of aero.

I totally disagree with your assessment that "Daniel drove into the back of Max"

In reality, it was Max who foolishly positioned himself in front of a faster car leaving it nowhere to go but into the back of him.


People have short memories. Where did the "2 move" rule come from?

It came about as a direct consequence to Max's immature F1 racing a few seasons ago. The 2-move rule is the Max rule.

I like watching Max race. A lot. Right up until the point where he loses his cool and goes native. If the rules cannot curb his over-exuberant enthusiasm I am deeply afraid that in future it might cost another driver his life.

Yours Aye

Mark H

[3798j]

What gets to me, the rules are in place but aren't enforced....specifically...

20.3 "More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted."

Then, during the 2016 season the FIA gave drivers more specific guidelines on what is and isn’t permissible while defending one’s position on track.
"It followed extensive discussion of whether drivers should be able to change direction under braking, largely prompted by Max Verstappen’s move in Japan while the Red Bull driver was fending off the Mercedes of Lewis Hamilton."

Article 27.5 of the F1 Sporting Regulations states that “…no car may be driven…in a manner which could be potentially dangerous to other drivers…”. Furthermore, Article 27.8 prohibits any manoeuvre “…liable to hinder other drivers, such as…any abnormal change of direction”.

Then there's regulation 20.4: "When one driver is completely ahead of another on a straight, they are permitted to make a move in one direction. This move can be of any size, within the track limits, and the move can be made as slowly or as quickly as the driver likes — they can jink suddenly to one side or they can spend an entire straight gradually shifting across the track."

[rcracin]

I’m also really baffled by it. I thought I was crazy for assuming Max was wrong for moving twice. Other top drivers seem to be following the rules just fine. Last year Vettel faked out Bottas with Bottas moving just once. And then Bottas did the same to Vettel a few races later. Meanwhile Max is out here causing accidents without reprimand.

[six_timer]

Originally Posted by Rampant

People have short memories. Where did the "2 move" rule come from?

It came about as a direct consequence to Max's immature F1 racing a few seasons ago. The 2-move rule is the Max rule.

It appears you're the one with the short memory.

Article 20.3 of the sporting regulations was enacted following the 2011 season, prompted by an incident involving Michael Shumacher
http://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/16416932

But it was an unofficial rule subject to penalty back in 2008
http://www.racefans.net/2008/09/16/f...n-rules-video/

And I'm pretty sure drivers were being penalized for it, back in the 90s. You're giving Max way too much credit.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by 3798j

What gets to me, the rules are in place but aren't enforced....specifically...

20.3 "More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted."

Then, during the 2016 season the FIA gave drivers more specific guidelines on what is and isn’t permissible while defending one’s position on track.
"It followed extensive discussion of whether drivers should be able to change direction under braking, largely prompted by Max Verstappen’s move in Japan while the Red Bull driver was fending off the Mercedes of Lewis Hamilton."

Article 27.5 of the F1 Sporting Regulations states that “…no car may be driven…in a manner which could be potentially dangerous to other drivers…”. Furthermore, Article 27.8 prohibits any manoeuvre “…liable to hinder other drivers, such as…any abnormal change of direction”.

Then there's regulation 20.4: "When one driver is completely ahead of another on a straight, they are permitted to make a move in one direction. This move can be of any size, within the track limits, and the move can be made as slowly or as quickly as the driver likes — they can jink suddenly to one side or they can spend an entire straight gradually shifting across the track."

Yea it seems pretty clear that he moved right a small bit when ric went right, and then he moved left much harder (and faster) when ric went left. I'd like to hear someone deny that...

[N52UNED]

Originally Posted by TSM330i

... ... ...

This close racing is the norm in Indy Car, but the number of accidents isn't anywhere near as high.

I'm thinking it's part of the aero for F1 that is causing the issues. Once Daniel got too close to Max - the aero over his front wing was compromised and he lost a lot of downforce on his front wing. When he hit the brakes, the tires didn't have the grip they should have had and the braking was no where near where it should have been. Hence, he drove into the back of Max.

The new rules should hopefully sort this out. It'd be nice to see quicker cars actually have a chance to pass other cars without all the headaches of loss of aero.

Indy Cars are designed with wheel to wheel racing in mind ... with the new design even more so. F1 cars are designed to be driven with much more spacing between cars ... not only for down-force but overall efficiency of their hybrid engines.

With the high rates of speed and the exorbitant costs of repairs ... I don't see F1 adding any aero changes that would facilitate more wheel to wheel racing. Frankly I think it's more issues with lack of passing areas built into the F1 circuits.

Perhaps F1 should add more time to the DRS spacing ... under 1 second isn't easy to achieve ... even with the top drivers on the top performing teams. That's where Indy Car wins out with the Push To Pass idea, as it gives more of a fighting chance to pass where you normally can't.