[pz619]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I'm not a fan of EVs being forced upon us, but the level of hysteria, conspiracy, and anti-democrat politics being spewed by Car-Addicted and others is amusing, but not surprising either.

Honestly, it's the reason why I keep checking this thread. It's 400+ pages of hysteria. I have to admit, I am entertained. It's become part of my morning coffee routine.

[eugenebmw]

Originally Posted by Weather Man

CA & NY school districts begging states to rescind EV bus mandates because they literally can't drive the routes. I would imagine you will see rural EV buses with generators mounted on the back in desperation.

I feel sorry for all the drivers who need to drive those EV buses especially when buses full of kids asking the drivers "Are we there yet?'' You can't tell them shut up and be patient

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I'm not a fan of EVs being forced upon us, but the level of hysteria, conspiracy, and anti-democrat politics being spewed by Car-Addicted and others is amusing, but not surprising either.

I don't agree with forced EV policy either. It just creates a backlash.

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by Weather Man

Mandated hysteria you lucky duck!

The best wisdom is that while we can't control the world. We can control our reaction to it. This really helps to stay well amidst constant change.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

First you are always welcome to challenge the facts that on posts I make. Second it is amusing, but not surprising that you fail to understand where all this global climate change crap comes from and who it benefits.
If not for EVs being forced upon us I really wouldn't give a dam. People should be able to buy and drive what ever they want and I shouldn't be made to pay for it.

You mean some the alternative facts you post from questionable sources?

You're so caught up in the Green Grift and the subsidies and such given to the EV market. What are your thoughts on the billions upon billions in subsidies and tax breaks the oil/gas/coal companies get; companies of which are massively profitable year after year? The amount of subsidies allotted for electric is well below what is given the oil industry alone in the US. You cool with that? To me, that makes less sense and is more bonkers than doling big dollars to the EV side of things. And you can't claim politics here because the Republicans are very much supportive of giving the oil/gas/coal industries this money and breaks.

[kyriian]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

You mean some the alternative facts you post from questionable sources?

You're so caught up in the Green Grift and the subsidies and such given to the EV market. What are your thoughts on the billions upon billions in subsidies and tax breaks the oil/gas/coal companies get; companies of which are massively profitable year after year? The amount of subsidies allotted for electric is well below what is given the oil industry alone in the US. You cool with that? To me, that makes less sense and is more bonkers than doling big dollars to the EV side of things. And you can't claim politics here because the Republicans are very much supportive of giving the oil/gas/coal industries this money and breaks.

Not gonna go too deep into the rabbit hole that some of the people here dive into...

Oil industry supplies more than just fuel for cars. It make sense to provide these companies with more support, because they have their hands in a much larger swatch of industries, including many parts of an EV. Practically everything today uses some byproduct of oil, and should they fail, it'd literally set humanity back to the stone age.

[tturedraider]

I feel pretty confident this has probably already been posted, but just in case

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

You mean some the alternative facts you post from questionable sources?

By all means enlighten us as to what questionable sources?

Originally Posted by XutvJet

You're so caught up in the Green Grift and the subsidies and such given to the EV market. What are your thoughts on the billions upon billions in subsidies and tax breaks the oil/gas/coal companies get; companies of which are massively profitable year after year?

An industry subsidy is very different than direct tax payer funded rebates but you know that and chose to ignore the facts.
Apparently you also didn't remember this so I'll post it again. With out the fossil fuel industry you wouldn't last a month.

Originally Posted by XutvJet

The amount of subsidies allotted for electric is well below what is given the oil industry alone in the US. You cool with that?

IEA and Reuters and acceptable source?
IEA expects global clean energy investment to hit $2 trillion in 2024
June 6, 2024
Total energy investment is expected to exceed $3 trillion for the first time in 2024, the IEA said in its annual World Energy Investment report.
Some $2 trillion is set to go to clean technologies – including renewables, electric vehicles, nuclear power, grids, storage, low-emissions fuels, efficiency improvements and heat pumps - with the rest directed towards gas, oil and coal.
Combined investment in renewable power and grids overtook the amount spent on fossil fuels for the first time in 2023.
"For every dollar going to fossil fuels today, almost two dollars are invested in clean energy," said IEA Executive Director Fatih Birol.
https://www.reuters.com/sustainabili...24-2024-06-06/

[Car-Addicted]

Just stirring the pot

It's Been 6 Years Since Greta Thunberg Warned We Have 5 Years to Stop the Extinction of Humanity
June 25, 2024



Thunberg deleted the tweet in 2023 which is amusing, considering it was the five-year mark.
While Thunberg’s post did not say humanity would end in five years — we did make it past 2023 after all — there was one glaring problem with it. The article that Thunberg linked misquoted the scientist who made the relevant remarks.
In January 2018, James Anderson, a professor of atmospheric chemistry at Harvard, gave a speech that was covered by Forbes.
Anderson remarked in that speech on damage he claimed climate change is doing to the “permanent ice” at the Earth’s poles, and its implications for the globe, according to Forbes.
“The chance that there will be any permanent ice left in the Arctic after 2022 is essentially zero,” he said, according to Forbes. “Can we lose 75-80 percent of permanent ice and recover? The answer is no.”
https://www.westernjournal.com/6-yea...tion-humanity/

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

By all means enlighten us as to what questionable sources?

Ummm....there 400 pages of posts in this thread. You know damn well you've posted from a some very extreme and Right-wing sources, some of which are simply not credible. You are hell bent you proving your point and sometimes get rather desperate with your daily posts. You really should consider starting a YT channel.

An industry subsidy is very different than direct tax payer funded rebates but you know that and chose to ignore the facts.
Apparently you also didn't remember this so I'll post it again. With out the fossil fuel industry you wouldn't last a month.

No, it's really not. I don't dispute all the products the oil industry provides us. What I do have a problem with is the hilarious amounts of subsidies, tax breaks, etc. that they get. It really makes no sense. You posted salaries of certain EV CEOs, CFOs, and board members. Those salaries are nothing compared to those of the top players Shell, BP, etc. The oil industry and it's lobbyists pull a lot of strings. A lot. They are likely more powerful than the US government itself. Just something to consider.

IEA and Reuters and acceptable source?
IEA expects global clean energy investment to hit $2 trillion in 2024
June 6, 2024
Total energy investment is expected to exceed $3 trillion for the first time in 2024, the IEA said in its annual World Energy Investment report.
Some $2 trillion is set to go to clean technologies – including renewables, electric vehicles, nuclear power, grids, storage, low-emissions fuels, efficiency improvements and heat pumps - with the rest directed towards gas, oil and coal.
Combined investment in renewable power and grids overtook the amount spent on fossil fuels for the first time in 2023.
"For every dollar going to fossil fuels today, almost two dollars are invested in clean energy," said IEA Executive Director Fatih Birol.
https://www.reuters.com/sustainabili...24-2024-06-06/

Now what is exactly wrong with investing in clean energy? While we have gotten quite creative with finding and extracting more fossil fuel that thought imaginable, we must explore other ways to create energy. Sometimes you've got to invest it, even some really bad ideas, to find the one thing that may be the Holy Grail.

And before you go off the deep end here, I'm an environmental consultant that works for one of the leading environmental firms in this country. I work for and represent the oil/gas industry. I've worked at refineries, worked all across the "plays" of Texas, done the permitting, battled the EPA and state DNRs regarding consent orders/violations/etc, dug the O/G clients out of deep regulatory holes due to their ignorance/arrogance, watched the O/G industry get away with bloody murder regarding contamination and violations while getting mere slaps of on the wrist for it, etc. I lived this industry for better or worse. My company is also heavily invested in Green incentives, ESG, etc. and I'm not totally into that either and don't tow that line because I see the some of the hypocrisy and idealism. But you're not going to see me go bonkers about EVs, claim that politics is the driver behind it all, or that government is the Boogey Man. Yes, many politicians have sold their soul, but I like to think that a select few on both sides will can and will do the right thing when it really matters.

[M5Rick]

Stellantis who make Vauxhall, Citroen and Peugeot vehicles WILL shut production in England if leaders continue with unattainable net zero targets.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/2874...t-uk-net-zero/

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

Ummm....there 400 pages of posts in this thread. You know damn well you've posted from a some very extreme and Right-wing sources, some of which are simply not credible. You are hell bent you proving your point and sometimes get rather desperate with your daily posts. You really should consider starting a YT channel.



No, it's really not. I don't dispute all the products the oil industry provides us. What I do have a problem with is the hilarious amounts of subsidies, tax breaks, etc. that they get. It really makes no sense. You posted salaries of certain EV CEOs, CFOs, and board members. Those salaries are nothing compared to those of the top players Shell, BP, etc. The oil industry and it's lobbyists pull a lot of strings. A lot. They are likely more powerful than the US government itself. Just something to consider.



Now what is exactly wrong with investing in clean energy? While we have gotten quite creative with finding and extracting more fossil fuel that thought imaginable, we must explore other ways to create energy. Sometimes you've got to invest it, even some really bad ideas, to find the one thing that may be the Holy Grail.

And before you go off the deep end here, I'm an environmental consultant that works for one of the leading environmental firms in this country. I work for and represent the oil/gas industry. I've worked at refineries, worked all across the "plays" of Texas, done the permitting, battled the EPA and state DNRs regarding consent orders/violations/etc, dug the O/G clients out of deep regulatory holes due to their ignorance/arrogance, watched the O/G industry get away with bloody murder regarding contamination and violations while getting mere slaps of on the wrist for it, etc. I lived this industry for better or worse. My company is also heavily invested in Green incentives, ESG, etc. and I'm not totally into that either and don't tow that line because I see the some of the hypocrisy and idealism. But you're not going to see me go bonkers about EVs, claim that politics is the driver behind it all, or that government is the Boogey Man. Yes, many politicians have sold their soul, but I like to think that a select few on both sides will can and will do the right thing when it really matters.

I have never known C-A to get that upset about anything, even under provocation.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by gblansten

The best wisdom is that while we can't control the world. We can control our reaction to it. This really helps to stay well amidst constant change.

But the problem is some people think they can control the world. Controlling the climate by dictating every person must drive a BEV is bedded in the belief one can control the world.

[gonzo]

lOl

[Car-Addicted]

Another very extreme and Right-wing news source. (Scientific American) Since you didn't grasp it the first time.
Clean Energy Spending Will Surpass $2 Trillion This Year
June 12, 2024
Investments in carbon-free energy will be twice as large as fossil fuel spending in 2024, the International Energy Agency predicts.
The report also notes an uptick in clean energy spending in emerging markets, a critical development for reaching the world's climate targets. And it provides evidence that the wave in green energy spending sought by President Joe, with passage of the Inflation Reduction Act in 2022, is starting to take root. U.S. spending on clean energy is projected to increase by $300 billion this year.
And while clean energy spending continues to grow, it is not happening fast enough to limit global temperature rise to 1.5 degrees Celsius.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...ion-this-year/

We can go back over the billions in green grift and bankruptcies like A123 Systems, Solyndra, Abound Solar, ABB, Inc., Calisolar and Fisker Automotive?
What is our national debt now? 35 trillion!
What is the debt service on that Debt! 400 billion in 2023
"Net interest payments on the debt are estimated to total $395.5 billion this fiscal year, or 6.8% of all federal outlays, according to the Office of Management and Budget."

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

But the problem is some people think they can control the world. Controlling the climate by dictating every person must drive a BEV is bedded in the belief one can control the world.

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face—for ever.”
― George Orwell, 1984

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

But the problem is some people think they can control the world. Controlling the climate by dictating every person must drive a BEV is bedded in the belief one can control the world.

I'm talking about keeping excellent mental health.

[Car-Addicted]

Another very extreme and right-wing source (South China Morning Post)
Europe’s EV battery hope fades as China pulls ahead while US subsidies undermine resources
20 Jun 2024
In 2019, France and Germany agreed to pump billions of euros into a plan to boost Europe’s battery industry and catch up with China and the US. Five years later, that effort is running out of steam.
As electric-vehicle sales slow, companies including Volkswagen, Stellantis and Mercedes-Benz are scaling back or refocusing battery projects. Chinese manufacturers are slashing costs and the US is drawing away investment with lucrative subsidies.
China already has excess battery-making capacity, can make cells at a fraction of the cost it takes in Europe, and has a head start on the next generation of cell technology.
Northvolt AB, the continent’s biggest and most promising home-grown battery maker, is being buffeted by making “premium” cells amid a flood of cheaper Chinese batteries.
The US will dole out an estimated US$160 billion in tax credit spending before 2029 for solar and battery cells, according to BloombergNEF. Canada committed US$25 billion in battery incentives last year, attracting investments from companies including Volkswagen and Stellantis.
https://www.scmp.com/business/china-...mine-resources

Interesting article. Batteries are not all created equal and when it comes to LiPo batteries, cheap is not better. You don't want me to post more EV battery fire stories? You know I will!

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by gblansten

I'm talking about keeping excellent mental health.

And that goes for the climate as well. Thinking the Earth is going to perish in terms of supporting human life any sooner or later than the natural algorithm that defines such things because of man's input, is in my opinion a form of mental disease. Life on Earth reacts to the climate. The climate does not react to life on the planet. Thinking one can control all 8 billion individuals on the planet in such a way to affect a specific climate outcome is definitely a form of mental disease.

I do not worry about the climate. I do worry about how the economy will be affected by lunatics who think they can control the climate. It's the economy that is fragile, not the planet.

[Car-Addicted]

A few pertinent quotes from my favorite Austrian economist.

Ever since the beginning of modern science, the best minds have recognized that "the range of acknowledged ignorance will grow with the advance of science." Unfortunately, the popular effect of this scientific advance has been a belief, seemingly shared by many scientists, that the range of our ignorance is steadily diminishing and that we can therefore aim at more comprehensive and deliberate control of all human activities. It is for this reason that those intoxicated by the advance of knowledge so often become the enemies of freedom.
Friedrich von Hayek

The ideas of economists and political philosophers, both when they are right and when they are wrong are more powerful than is commonly understood. Indeed, the world is ruled by little else. Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influences, are usually slaves of some defunct economist.
Friedrich von Hayek

At the end of the day is always about control and money.

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

And that goes for the climate as well. Thinking the Earth is going to perish in terms of supporting human life any sooner or later than the natural algorithm that defines such things because of man's input, is in my opinion a form of mental disease. Life on Earth reacts to the climate. The climate does not react to life on the planet. Thinking one can control all 8 billion individuals on the planet in such a way to affect a specific climate outcome is definitely a form of mental disease.

I do not worry about the climate. I do worry about how the economy will be affected by lunatics who think they can control the climate. It's the economy that is fragile, not the planet.

Because there are so many things with which to worry over I have been trying to risk stratify my fears and focus on the things under my control. This has led to me exercising a lot more and I feel better overall.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by gblansten

Because there are so many things with which to worry over I have been trying to risk stratify my fears and focus on the things under my control. This has led to me exercising a lot more and I feel better overall.

Maybe then you should mentor Greta Thundberg, she could use a lot more exercise.