[hwelvaar]

According to modern day BMW terminology, shouldn't 9-series coupe be called 8-series (or 10-series)?
Like 2, 4 and 6 series all are coupes...
Not that it really matters if it's been axed anyway...

[hwelvaar]

Originally Posted by FilipMPower

I thought about this. And I defend BMW with everything. I owned Bimmers since I have my license. But the company has really turned into a mess. way too many models, way too many niches filled. Who in their right mind buys a GT or the active tourer and thinks he is driving the ultimate driving machine. And people can talk good things about the M divison and the m235i, and yet it isn't as refined as BMW used to be. Yes, the M6 is better than the competition, but I still am not really satisfied with it. Its too heavy, rolls too much in corners... It kills in the straight, but if I want a car like that, Id buy an audi. All these FWD vans to fund the M division? So that the M division cam build more 2 ton cars? AWD? Recycled engines? Where is the halo car? Where are the moster kicks when you shift the DCT, like with the SMG? Where is the sound? BMW should build cars which compete with porsche, not mercedes and audi, which are duller. Make the 7-series compete with the panamera. The X line with cayenne and macan. The 3 and 5 series must set sport car benchmarks for sedans. Hell, BMW might sell less, but is it really all about profit? Is it not about making a point? 1,3,5,6,7 and x3,x5,x6 is all that bmw needs.

That's your personal opinion out of historic love for BMW.
The board and shareholders don't seem to agree, and the profit and growth numbers don't seem to prove them wrong.
Yes, it actually is all about the money.

[CesaroM]

I knew that this was coming , it seemed too good to be true , I don't get it bmw?! , why tease and always quit at the end? that's like masturbation without the payoff , I wonder what exciting thing you will present for your 100th birthday? maybe a 2,5 cylinder 3 series active touarer ? , or a gt version of x3? or maybe a new x 2,2? with fwd?...as my friend would say : rubbish.

[BMW269]

The only car to come is the Z5, and is 2 years away, should be on sale in Q1 2017, the earliest.


SCOTT is here just for marketing/PR, so many things he said never happened (except 2er Active/Gran Tourer and X4).


Oh yes, and next M5/M6, no more RWD.

[ron_jeremy]

Originally Posted by FilipMPower

I thought about this. And I defend BMW with everything. I owned Bimmers since I have my license. But the company has really turned into a mess. way too many models, way too many niches filled. Who in their right mind buys a GT or the active tourer and thinks he is driving the ultimate driving machine. And people can talk good things about the M divison and the m235i, and yet it isn't as refined as BMW used to be. Yes, the M6 is better than the competition, but I still am not really satisfied with it. Its too heavy, rolls too much in corners... It kills in the straight, but if I want a car like that, Id buy an audi. All these FWD vans to fund the M division? So that the M division cam build more 2 ton cars? AWD? Recycled engines? Where is the halo car? Where are the moster kicks when you shift the DCT, like with the SMG? Where is the sound? BMW should build cars which compete with porsche, not mercedes and audi, which are duller. Make the 7-series compete with the panamera. The X line with cayenne and macan. The 3 and 5 series must set sport car benchmarks for sedans. Hell, BMW might sell less, but is it really all about profit? Is it not about making a point? 1,3,5,6,7 and x3,x5,x6 is all that bmw needs.

Let's be fair. The AT and GT is messy in deed.
But look at the competition.
MB makes buses, and this:
Audi is a derivate from VW and is filled with Skoda parts, so is the Brand formelt known as THE sportscar Brand - Porsche.
These days they're making more SUV than sportcars.
That's your competition, it's all business.
Look at the craze around Apple a year ago, how they were critized for not beeing innovative.
Look at the Stock and products since then.

The M2 is coming, the performance M4 model is coming shortly as well.
And then some, things are starting to happen, the weight are going into the right direction as well.
All this points into a nice direction If you ask me, but it's just to much complaining imo.

[Manbnda]

Originally Posted by gvega702

They may be making more money than ever but I think he's referring to the lack of inspiring products. I went into the dealership yesterday and sat in everything. The only model that enticed me to want a test drive was the M3 but that's out of my budget (for now).

Everything else felt cheap even compared to my e46 which is now over 10 years old. Nor did they have the features of my 10 year old car for nearly 40 or more grand. I'm looking to replace my e46 as it is getting old but non of the current range of BMW's do anything for me and I used to be a huge fan boy. I don't even recommend the brand to friends anymore because I'd feel bad putting recommending them knowing their are lots of other good options.

Who made the cost cutting decision to get rid of the button to open the center arm rest in the f30? Now you have yank it out of the center console and slam it back in. All while making unpleasant noises. Did they take that little bit of savings and put it into something else like standard xenon lights? Higher quality plastics on something you touch regularly? Nope... they took that bit of savings and laughed to the bank. I that's just one minor instance of the cost cutting that went into the F30 I'm sure, and you can tell. Along with the rest of the current line up...

Higher quality interiors with better driving dynamics, please. Hopefully the new CEO knows that and he's axing extra models to get what we already have back up to speed.

I see what you mean.
If I have to be honest, to me the 2,3,4,5,6 series is the same car with their respective coupe versions. The first one is sportier than the next, ending with the 6 being very heavy. This 6 is the more luxurious and the least is the 2.

With BMW, luxury is inversely proportional to sportiness.
Just my opinion.

On paper the M235i seemed like the perfect car for me. But when I sat down on it, I perceived it like a step down from my 328i Sport Line, even the M235i being more expensive.

[dreamspeed]

Jack of all trades but master of none. It's almost always a bad idea in the long run to chase volume instead of strengthening your core competencies.

[GuyOh]

so much for the people at BMW really valuing the opinions of people on the bimmer forums

2er active tourer, 3er GT, 5er GT, what the hell bmw....

[Wolf]

Originally Posted by Alpine F31

Blanket statement.
My M235i is brilliant to drive. It's quick, it has neutral handling, it sounds amazing and it has a 6 speed manual. It's a proper BMW. Hopefully, more products like this are coming down the pipe.

your M235i is brilliant. The next M235i is gonna be even better when it switches to FWD.

/sarcasm

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by ron_jeremy

Let's be fair. The AT and GT is messy in deed.
But look at the competition.
MB makes buses, and this:
Audi is a derivate from VW and is filled with Skoda parts, so is the Brand formelt known as THE sportscar Brand - Porsche.
These days they're making more SUV than sportcars.
That's your competition, it's all business.
Look at the craze around Apple a year ago, how they were critized for not beeing innovative.
Look at the Stock and products since then.

The M2 is coming, the performance M4 model is coming shortly as well.
And then some, things are starting to happen, the weight are going into the right direction as well.
All this points into a nice direction If you ask me, but it's just to much complaining imo.

So much lack of understanding in this post. Mercedes Trucks and Busses is another business, and it is not like they started making them yesterday to increase sales volume, they have been doing them since decades. Same goes for BMW Motorcycles.

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by GuyOh

so much for the people at BMW really valuing the opinions of people on the bimmer forums

2er active tourer, 3er GT, 5er GT, what the hell bmw....

All great choices to the customers that have bought them, and profitable to our sales.

[Wolf]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

All great choices to the customers that have bought them, and profitable to our sales.

you do realize that this is an enthusiasts' forum.. All this nonsense doesn't matter and won't ever matter here right?

[clbmw]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

None of this is definite. I have not heard otherwise.
As work is still ongoing on several models discussed here.
We have already discussed the i5 and there has been an official comment from BMWi that the car will launch after 2020 following a two-stage concept programme.

Well let's hope the article is very wrong.

Mercedes managed to produce the AMG GT, Audi got a new R8, Porsche make pretty much anything exciting etc etc and are already planning the next exciting thing.

I don't give a damn about more active tourers or any more of that boring stuff. Vauxhall and Ford make these that should give BMW a clue. Remember it's hard to stay premium and sell out, you have to keep the exclusive stuff as well to create the halo effect or the brand goes to shite.

Granted the i8 was exciting, but that's done now; axing all those models is like saying Christmas is cancelled to children

[GuyOh]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

All great choices to the customers that have bought them, and profitable to our sales.

that's exactly my point, seems like all BMW cares about is making money, which is fine, but what annoys me is BMW seems to forget nor care about the loyal bmw fans and customers.

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by Wolf

you do realize that this is an enthusiasts' forum.. All this nonsense doesn't matter and won't ever matter here right?

Yes and there are enthusiasts on this forum for the GT's and Active Tourer.
Why should they not be considered as enthusiasts when their choice is directly related to the attributes of the vehicles in question?

A BMW enthusiast does not have to be an M only "enthusiast" anyone who buys a BMW either the latest,classic or even well used should be allowed to share in the enthusiasm of the brand even if their first BMW is the bare entry 116i.

[MalibuBimmer]

I'm not sure if BMW considers me an enthusiast or just an easy customer.

[undecided]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Yes and there are enthusiasts on this forum for the GT's and Active Tourer.
Why should they not be considered as enthusiasts when their choice is directly related to the attributes of the vehicles in question?

A BMW enthusiast does not have to be an M only "enthusiast" anyone who buys a BMW either the latest,classic or even well used should be allowed to share in the enthusiasm of the brand even if their first BMW is the bare entry 116i.

Those people can be enthusiastic about their automobile choices but that doesn't make them enthusiasts. Enthusiasts lust over cars that have soul. Cars that you ogled over as a teenager. Even if you can't afford them you hope some day you will. Trust me, no one is lusting over the GT and Xs and the rest of the ho-hum family haulers. We understand that BMW needs to make $$$$, they are a business after all but if they dilute the 'image', long term it may be the wrong choice to do so. Don't get me wrong, the 5GT for example is an amazing vehicle for what it is. Probably best in its class. Not an enthusiast car though.

[Petr0lhead]

Let's take a look back at what we had 15 years ago in the year of 2000:

What cars did BMW make for the driving ethusiast?
There was the just introduced E46 M3, the E39 M5 and the Z3M. Maybe the 330i... And that was it!

SO, there're currently enough models in the lineup that I still lust and look after and in my opinion, those vehicles are very much build for the driving enthusiasts:

--> M3/M4/M5/M6/M135i/M235i/Z4/maybe M550Xd
--> and soon, even more models: M2/M4 CSL/M340i/Z?...

I don't care if BMW is making cars like the GT's or FWD 2er Active Tourer as long as they continue to build proper M-cars/sportcars.
And I think the upcoming lineup of M-cars is going to be the best one they've ever had so far. There is going to be a car for every type of driving enthusiast.

Seriously, BMW has never made more different types of cars for the enthusiastic driver! And all of those are great modern driving machines in their own ways.

I think we shouldn't complain that much...

[cc3]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

All great choices to the customers that have bought them, and profitable to our sales.

Sorry Scott dealer loaned me a 2 Active Tourer when my car was in for a service. I found it pretty awful. The view out of the front at junctions and roundabouts is dangerous due to a massive blind spot in each corner. It drives like a front wheel drive and has dead steering. The car had loose door mirrors the gear lever rattled and vibrated like a 1970s Mini. Interior trim creaked. I was very pleased to hand it back, simply dreadful

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by Petr0lhead

Let's take a look back at what we had 15 years ago in the year of 2000:

What cars did BMW make for the driving ethusiast?
There was the just introduced E46 M3, the E39 M5 and the Z3M. Maybe the 330i... And that was it!

SO, there're currently enough models in the lineup that I still lust and look after and in my opinion, those vehicles are very much build for the driving enthusiasts:

--> M3/M4/M5/M6/M135i/M235i/Z4/maybe M550Xd
--> and soon, even more models: M2/M4 CSL/M340i/Z?...

I don't care if BMW is making cars like the GT's or FWD 2er Active Tourer as long as they continue to build proper M-cars/sportcars.
And I think the upcoming lineup of M-cars is going to be the best one they've ever had so far. There is going to be a car for every type of driving enthusiast.

Seriously, BMW has never made more different types of cars for the enthusiastic driver! And all of those are great modern driving machines in their own ways.

I think we shouldn't complain that much...

Not for the BMW fan that wants bragging right in a supercar. BMW i8 is the bragging car for the Toyota Prius owner. Makes no sense M5 is faster than i8. There is also nothing for the one that wants a light-weight sports car with (questionable) premium materials, something like Z2 Coupé that can compete with GT86 and 4C. M2 is far from being really light.

[clbmw]

The news from BMW is like watching Game of Thrones, just when you thought it was looking good some power hungry individual kills a load of the things you like at the last moment.

[Pentium]

Originally Posted by Levi

So much lack of understanding in this post. Mercedes Trucks and Busses is another business, and it is not like they started making them yesterday to increase sales volume, they have been doing them since decades. Same goes for BMW Motorcycles.

Exactly, you have a point...