[Ali Shiralian]

Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8

My bosses youngest drives a couple of year old RX350, the media setup is a joke, it makes the old BMW idrive seem nice and it has zero sportiness and seems somewhat cheap and drives like a minivan. He owns a few Porsche SUV's and a Mercedes GLE and there really is no comparison but they also cost a lot more. Now, his daily is a 2010 Acura MDX SH AWD and puts the Lexus to shame in every way and it's 8 years old with 140k on it. Having driven the RX350 quite a bit, it really changed my opinion of Lexus and not in a good way.

It's always interesting to see people views on cars.

I agree with the media argument on the Lexus, much prefer our X5s idrive which in my opinion is the best in the business however the argument here is the long term reliability. I've only had the RX for a year so can't be sure of the long term but as I said before imo it's debatable whether BMW has a better one than the Japanese. I also cross shopped the MDX and jaguar F-pace but non was even close to the ride and luxury of the RX so we chose the RX.

[xander_g]

Originally Posted by Fast4d

they tend to go with new designs and technology for sake of performance before it is proven and matured.

look at the N63

first of its kind in the production world.

look at the reliability.....horrible.

Reminds me of the ussr. Ty-144 konkordski anyone?

[Meeni]

It's more than when something breaks on the japanese car, it is no big deal. Parts are cheap, easy to replace, and even doing it at the dealer the price is moderate.

On the BMW, it breaks just a tad more, but every time you are looking at 4 figures at the dealer, hundreds of dollars in parts (because you cannot get the hose without the 'full assembly sold as a set'), and the design makes you work as a contortionist if you DIY.

So its not so much that its unreliable, more that the sticker shock makes it a memorable event everytime.

[9krpmrx8]

I don't know what your experience working on cars is but my 2011 E90 335i has been really easy to work on and I have wrenched on many platforms. As for parts pricing, well it depends, some things are really cheap and others are expensive. I mean even on the N54 versus the N55, injectors for the N55 are way cheaper and they rarely fail, so for the turbo on the N55, so it has gotten better.

[F32Fleet]

German reliability would go a long way if they chose a different material for some of their gaskets.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

German premium brands vs. Japanese premium brands...

They both use the latest technology in their products and have for a long time now.
They both engineer very solidly.
Germans appear to be more profitable overall at a given price point, indicating their costs are lower.

....

Everyone has their own experiences. My observation would be that Japanese automakers have tighter quality control. With german vehicles you see ones that are perfect and the next one is a reliability mess - this is why people still buy VWs, because enough people have perfect ones to counterbalance those who have awful experiences. Whereas it's extremely rare to find ANYONE who has a terrible experience with a Lexus (for example); their consistency and quality control is better somehow.

As an anecdote: My m3 is now 4 years, 5 days, and 51k miles old and has been absolutely perfect. Technically it's been the single most reliable vehicle I've ever owned as it's needed less maintenance and repairs than any other vehicle over 51k miles.

if someone tells me a japanese company like toyota has a lower profit margin that bmw; then i'd have a heart attack seeing as how they have reused and abused virtually every engine and tranny in each of their cars for about 15 years now... look at the tundra, tacoma and camry as perfect examples. If their profit point is lower than bmw; they are doing something severly wrong. Also, you mentioned premium; Lexus is just as slow to adapt powerttrain and tranny tech. The rx (lexus's top seller in USA) was using the same old V6 and 6 speed tranny as other toyota models 10 years before.

[insanecoder]

German = edge in mechanical engineering
Japanese = edge in quality control throughout their process, manufacturing, and production
This was clear before decades ago but as time moves forwards the advantages blurred.. ie.. the Germans are starting to focus more on quality throughout their entire process

[Unknown_Car]

Originally Posted by alex2364

People that buy Japanese, especially Toyota and Lexus.

But they have crappy interior. My cousin has 2 lexuses is350 and gs350 and i can tell you one thing my 05 rl was much better build interior then his 08 gs and drives much better. Also both of his lexuses rattle/ Squeak on every pothole. Also he had to have all his is350 interior swapped because his leather seats were leaving marks on his clothes the color was coming off.

[Unknown_Car]

Originally Posted by Ali Shiralian

I agree with the media argument on the Lexus, much prefer our X5s idrive which in my opinion is the best in the business however the argument here is the long term reliability. I've only had the RX for a year so can't be sure of the long term but as I said before imo it's debatable whether BMW has a better one than the Japanese. I also cross shopped the MDX and jaguar F-pace but non was even close to the ride and luxury of the RX so we chose the RX.

Really? My parets had rx350 and now they have the mdx. And mdx drives soo much better, its also alot quieter inside, much more room. Overall much better car. Plus looks much better then that toyota clown face.

[Ali Shiralian]

Originally Posted by Roma_335i

Really? My parets had rx350 and now they have the mdx. And mdx drives soo much better, its also alot quieter inside, much more room. Overall much better car. Plus looks much better then that toyota clown face.

Well to each its own. The interior of the MDX and the F-Pace looked pedestrian compared to the RX. Also as far as the ride goes, the MDX was good but the F-Pace was too harsh. The front grill of the Lexus especially in the F-Sport model was a determining factor also for us, we both liked the edginess of it but looks are objective obviously.

There's a reason RX sales are way more than other SUVs worldwide.

[yco]

German engineering = reliability.. except BMW..

and BMW is clearly ripping off people by spare parts.. and in near future it seems its not gonna change also which ll make me disconnect with the brand soon after 2 M cars..

[Germanauto]

I don't drive my Bimmer much because it's a head case. Picked up a lightly used Lexus IS 3 1/2 years ago for daily duties and it gives much greater peace of mind.

With that being said, aside from reliability and cost of ownership it's inferior to BMW in every single way. Steering, ride quality, build quality, interior materials, panel gaps, infotainment, and the list goes on. There's no denying that from right out of the factors, German cars will shit on anything and everything.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Ali Shiralian

There's a reason RX sales are way more than other SUVs worldwide.

Because of reliability and being one of the best value propositions on the market.

But it's still a dorky car at the end of the day. At least the interior is halfway respectable in the latest model.

[Ali Shiralian]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Because of reliability and being one of the best value propositions on the market.

But it's still a dorky car at the end of the day. At least the interior is halfway respectable in the latest model.

I agree, even with the F-sport model it's not sporty but again prople who buy the RX not looking for sportiness and Lexus IS aware of this...

[Fender150]

Its very reliable for the first 3-4 years of lease
And ready to have some parts by return time lol

[BigNorm4Life]

I don’t know what’s going on with German cars... but it’s not just BMW

I want a new or CPO car.... I would love to own my first German car. I want a performance car because I tend to drive the piss out of cars. I also prefer a V8 and as of the moment any bimmer engine with S in front of it is out of my budget and I refuse to buy anything with a N63 in it

Go look at Audi mainly a S6 or S8... almost the same issues. Either it’s the PCV valve or injectors which is an engine out preceedure or both turbos are shot... two out of warranty turbos from Audi is $9000 with labor for the TT 4.0 V8... seriously?!?? WTF!

And the one thing I don’t get is that German car owners rag on American reliability and bitch about paying let’s say $600 for a Ford 5.0 throttle body but an injector goes out on a N63 or if it needs seals an the SA say that’s going to cost you $8,000.... and most suckers with money is going chalk it up to “German engineering” and say okay..... GET THE **** OUTTA HERE

If I buy a BMW today... it will have the tried in true Inline 6 whether it’s a CPO X5 Msport, or aG series 540i Msport and if I can find one... a CPO M3 for $45k (wishful thinking)

Food for thought... let’s say you blow an engine on a 1LE Camaro.... most you willl pay is $8,000 last time I checked