[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Kevin_The_Clean1

RockCrusher Reading your post makes me want to get a V1 asap.

The V1 is good but it is not a cloaking device.

I bought the V1 because I was -- this was in MO where I lived at the time (circa 2000-2003) -- seeing lots of what I suspected were speed traps. Ok. If one doesn't speed there's no problem right?

Well, not exactly. Got pulled over for "speeding" -- this in my '96 Mustang GT -- by some young police officer who also had some young female in some kind of uniform (cadet (?)) in the cruiser with him. He put on a big show. Called for back up. Besides speeding I forget what I was written up for. But contacted an attorney in that town and all the charges were dismissed.

But lesson learned. Bought the V1.

From Jan 2002 (when I bought my Boxster) to Jan 2018 when I sold my 996 Turbo and Boxster and replaced them with a 2018 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack and a 2018 MINI Cooper JCW) I averaged about 41,600 miles per year. My work commute from March 2003 to March 2020 was 60 miles a day, 300 miles a week, 15,000 miles per year. The rest of those miles are racked up on road trips which over time had me driving all over the western US. (Not all the miles were driving the Boxster or the Turbo. At times between Jan 2002 to June 2009 (when I bought the 996 Turbo) I also owned a 2002 VW Golf TDi (put 150K miles on it) and a 2006 GTO (put 50K miles on it).

With all that driving one gets subjected to consider opportunities to get pulled over. If you don't speed you don't get pulled over right? Wrong.

I got pulled over one night in Texas (on I20) by a local LEO in the middle of the freeway with radar -- had plenty of warning from the V1 and CB radio -- when a car whizzed past my Boxster which was in the right lane at 5mph *under* the night time speed limit. The V1 went crazy. Saw the LEO cruiser lights come on. But he came after me instead of the car which passed my Boxster! As I was getting pulled over I heard one truck over the radio: "He's pulling over the wrong 4-wheeler!"

Long story short I "argued" with the officer used the presence of the V1, the CB radio, even a Garmin NAV device which had recorded my max speed since I left the hotel earlier in the day, to show the officer I was not speeding. I met with success. I was issued a warning. In my book that was a win!

On another road trip got pulled over in my Turbo -- which just west of Williams AZ by a state trooper for failing to signal. I didn't cut any one off. I was so tired I think I was grabbing the cruise control stalk which was just under the turn signal stalk. Officer made a big deal having me work the turn signal indicator stalk -- I was fully awake at this time -- to confirm the turn signals worked. At some point he told me he holds drivers of cars like mine to a higher standard.

This was no surprise to me actually. On a previous road trip just west of Kingman AZ I observed an SUV change lanes with no signal and right in front of a AZ state trooper's car. I waited for the lights to come on. But they never did. The state trooper I guess was saving himself for Porsche drivers...

Another time just some miles east of Amarillo TX on I40 was going along -- oh in my Turbo -- at 10mph over. And so was every other car. Traffic was light. Spotted what turned out to be a sheriff's car coming from the other direction and as I watched the lights went on and the officer cut across the median and pulled me over for speeding. I was not feeling well when I left the hotel in Amarillo and had forgotten to turn on the V1.

I pointed out I was going with traffic not passing other vehicles but he said he was "required" to give me a ticket. Sure. Driving a Porsche Turbo in the land of pick ups and mini vans with with CA plates on the Turbo a ticket is a must... But I let it go. As I had learned some years ago TX has a probation before adjudication system so I when I got home I called the Dalhart TX county courthouse and arranged for this. Six months later with no additional tickets charge was dropped for a less than $100 court fee.

The V1 is in the M2. Don't bother to turn it on as I'm just running errands or even on a pleasure drive. But if/when I head out on a road trip of some time/distance I'll turn it on as I'm sure when I venture out on the open road the M2 will be an eye catcher extraordinaire. Will be a minor miracle if I don't get pulled over at some point.

[ScottyRyan2019]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

Missed the 300K vs. 100K difference. Thanks for catching that.

Don't think PIP (Personal Injury Protection — I had to look it up I had not heard of this before) is available here. AR doesn't have any no fault insurance laws that I'm aware of.

I see nothing on the declaration pages that appear to have anything to do with that coverage.

There is uninsured and under insured motorist coverage. Bodily injury limits are 250K/500K and a property damage limit of 100K.

Yes, Bella Vista is a beautiful area. Briefly looked at houses in that area but stopped. I'm not fan of living in a area with the roads that Bella Vista has — hilly/curvy/rather "narrow" — when said area is subject to snow/ice in the winter.

The minimum PIP here is $40K per person per accident, $20K medical, and $20K for non-medical such as lost wages, replacement for services , etc. You can select higher coverages.

You can also stack the coverage. For each car you own you can stack the coverage so if you own 3 cars with same coverage you multiply the above coverages by 3.

Being as we are a no fault state these coverages are available regardless of who is at fault, whereas liability coverage is available to others if you caused the crash.

However, this is where your Underinsured Liability Umbrella coverage comes into play because you can supplement the PIP with it if the injuries exceed the policy limits of the other at-fault driver.

Then there is your health insurance coverage... vehicle coverage comes first but health insurance will come into play if that doesn't cover everything.

* I'm not an insurance agent or lawyer, I just play one on TV.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by ScottyRyan2019

The minimum PIP here is $40K per person per accident, $20K medical, and $20K for non-medical such as lost wages, replacement for services , etc. You can select higher coverages.

You can also stack the coverage. For each car you own you can stack the coverage so if you own 3 cars with same coverage you multiply the above coverages by 3.

Being as we are a no fault state these coverages are available regardless of who is at fault, whereas liability coverage is available to others if you caused the crash.

However, this is where your Underinsured Liability Umbrella coverage comes into play because you can supplement the PIP with it if the injuries exceed the policy limits of the other at-fault driver.

Then there is your health insurance coverage... vehicle coverage comes first but health insurance will come into play if that doesn't cover everything.

* I'm not an insurance agent or lawyer, I just play one on TV.

I'll visit my agent and go over what PIP coverage I have or can get. I found a good article on Personal Injury Protection insurance (as it works in Arkansas).

I'll paste the PIP specific info:

Personal Injury Protection (PIP) is a coverage option that covers medical expenses and, in most cases, lost wages — regardless of who is at fault for an auto accident. In Arkansas, you have three options for PIP, and you can choose to purchase one, two, or all of them together.

The first option is Medical Payments (sometime known as Med Pay), which provides compensation for doctor’s bills, X-rays, ambulance costs, and funeral expenses. PIP-Med Pay also covers medical payments for all passengers in your vehicle if they are injured in an accident.

The second option is Lost Wages, which covers lost wages with certain restrictions.

The third option is Death Benefits. This provides accidental death benefits should you or a loved one sustain injuries from an accident that result in death within one year of the accident. Each of these policies will provide you with a minimum of $5,000 in coverage. While Insurance companies are required to include minimum PIP coverage, you have the option to reject that coverage in writing. Another important aspect of PIP is that there is no deductible. So PIP payments are preferable over health insurance for some medical bills.

PIP coverage is comprehensive, and it doesn’t take into account who is at fault in an accident. That’s why it is always recommended that you carry PIP coverage on your auto insurance policy.


In looking into PIP and what coverage I have in going over insurance declaration pages now until my eyes burn there was an unexpected bonus albeit a bit of an embarrassing one...

I learned I made a mistake regarding the insurance cost of the M2.

The 6 month premium cost for my 2023 M2 is $650.83. For my 2024 230i xDrive it is $570.51.

[ScottyRyan2019]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

I'll visit my agent and go over what PIP coverage I have or can get. I found a good article on Personal Injury Protection insurance (as it works in Arkansas).

I'll paste the PIP specific info:

Personal Injury Protection (PIP) is a coverage option that covers medical expenses and, in most cases, lost wages — regardless of who is at fault for an auto accident. In Arkansas, you have three options for PIP, and you can choose to purchase one, two, or all of them together.

The first option is Medical Payments (sometime known as Med Pay), which provides compensation for doctor’s bills, X-rays, ambulance costs, and funeral expenses. PIP-Med Pay also covers medical payments for all passengers in your vehicle if they are injured in an accident.

The second option is Lost Wages, which covers lost wages with certain restrictions.

The third option is Death Benefits. This provides accidental death benefits should you or a loved one sustain injuries from an accident that result in death within one year of the accident. Each of these policies will provide you with a minimum of $5,000 in coverage. While Insurance companies are required to include minimum PIP coverage, you have the option to reject that coverage in writing. Another important aspect of PIP is that there is no deductible. So PIP payments are preferable over health insurance for some medical bills.

PIP coverage is comprehensive, and it doesn’t take into account who is at fault in an accident. That’s why it is always recommended that you carry PIP coverage on your auto insurance policy.


In looking into PIP and what coverage I have in going over insurance declaration pages now until my eyes burn there was an unexpected bonus albeit a bit of an embarrassing one...

I learned I made a mistake regarding the insurance cost of the M2.

The 6 month premium cost for my 2023 M2 is $650.83. For my 2024 230i xDrive it is $570.51.

Check on stacking to0 as it doubles the coverages if you have two vehicles or triples if you have three. I cannot recall if stacking is capped though.

[RootsTootsMagoots]

Jeez, I'm getting absolutely hosed. I have USAA for $1500/6 months. 35 years old, doctorate degree, homeowner, no accidents, 5k-7k miles average a year. We get hail and tornadoes where I live.

Limits are 100/300, full coverage. Deductible is 1k. Progressive was $140 cheaper, but I don't trust them. Geico wanted $600 more than USAA.

My only blemish in the last 5 years is slow rolling a stop sign two blocks from house. Still can't believe that ****head cop gave me a ticket for that.

I contacted three different insurance brokers, and they all were stumped why my rates were so bad.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by RootsTootsMagoots

Jeez, I'm getting absolutely hosed. I have USAA for $1500/6 months. 35 years old, doctorate degree, homeowner, no accidents, 5k-7k miles average a year. We get hail and tornadoes where I live.

Limits are 100/300, full coverage. Deductible is 1k. Progressive was $140 cheaper, but I don't trust them. Geico wanted $600 more than USAA.

My only blemish in the last 5 years is slow rolling a stop sign two blocks from house. Still can't believe that ****head cop gave me a ticket for that.

I contacted three different insurance brokers, and they all were stumped why my rates were so bad.

Any effect the ticket would have had on your insurance I expect has gone away after 5 years.

In some areas one's credit score can affect insurance rates.

[MineralGreyMetallic]

CA is a mess right now it seems.

I'm reading that insurers don't want to take on new drivers.

I have an absolutely clean record, and my premium is $2,900 with a $1,000 deductible and the most basic/minimum coverage allowed through AAA.

I was quoted $2,400 by Geico (through the website), but they also said they need 15 days to perform an underwriting analysis or something.

I'm going to try Progressive today, but I've been reading that people are having that same experience with other providers.

When I called AAA to ask why it was so expensive considering my clean driving record, they basically shrugged their shoulders.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by MineralGreyMetallic

CA is a mess right now it seems.

I'm reading that insurers don't want to take on new drivers.

I have an absolutely clean record, and my premium is $2,900 with a $1,000 deductible and the most basic/minimum coverage allowed through AAA.

I was quoted $2,400 by Geico (through the website), but they also said they need 15 days to perform an underwriting analysis or something.

I'm going to try Progressive today, but I've been reading that people are having that same experience with other providers.

When I called AAA to ask why it was so expensive considering my clean driving record, they basically shrugged their shoulders.

Insurers in CA have taken huge losses due to mainly property damage claims. In some cases they are no longer writing new policies and (no surprise) raising premiums.

Google this "california insurance crisis" (without the quotes) and read all the reports of of a number of companies no longer writing policies and in some cases -- based on a quick glance at the first paragraph -- closing offices.

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

Insurers in CA have taken huge losses due to mainly property damage claims. In some cases they are no longer writing new policies and (no surprise) raising premiums.

Google this "california insurance crisis" (without the quotes) and read all the reports of of a number of companies no longer writing policies and in some cases — based on a quick glance at the first paragraph — closing offices.

Yessir that’s right. My insurance guy for our Arizona cars is flooded with requests from California immigrants (note: please stay there) with tales of rates, cancellations, and the like. I’m not looking forward to March renewal here and our NY renewal in April. If NY is really nuts, I’ll register all 3 cars here. More to come……

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Carefree

Yessir that’s right. My insurance guy for our Arizona cars is flooded with requests from California immigrants (note: please stay there) with tales of rates, cancellations, and the like. I’m not looking forward to March renewal here and our NY renewal in April. If NY is really nuts, I’ll register all 3 cars here. More to come……

There can be problems registering vehicles in a state in which you do not reside which when I lived in CA was rather common to avoid paying CA taxes (registration fees) and in some cases obtaining lower cost insurance for the car.

For a car registered and insured in a different state by someone who lives/works in CA and uses the car in CA coverage may not be in effect. But one might not find this out until he has to file a claim or has a claim filed against his insurance.

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

There can be problems registering vehicles in a state in which you do not reside which when I lived in CA was rather common to avoid paying CA taxes (registration fees) and in some cases obtaining lower cost insurance for the car.

For a car registered and insured in a different state by someone who lives/works in CA and uses the car in CA coverage may not be in effect. But one might not find this out until he has to file a claim or has a claim filed against his insurance.

It’s resolved for us.
California can be unusual in myriad ways.
Thank you.

[G87M]

I'm at $960 per 6 months with USAA.

Deductibles:
$500 comprehensive/$1000 collision

Liability:
$300k/$500k bodily injury
$100k property damage

Injury:
$300k/$500k uninsured motorists

Rental reimbursement with towing & labor added. As well as accident forgiveness.

I have 3 vehicles on this policy for reference and listed the M2 as 4k miles per year.

[M_Power Rob]

Originally Posted by RootsTootsMagoots

Jeez, I'm getting absolutely hosed. I have USAA for $1500/6 months. 35 years old, doctorate degree, homeowner, no accidents, 5k-7k miles average a year. We get hail and tornadoes where I live.

Limits are 100/300, full coverage. Deductible is 1k. Progressive was $140 cheaper, but I don't trust them. Geico wanted $600 more than USAA.

My only blemish in the last 5 years is slow rolling a stop sign two blocks from house. Still can't believe that ****head cop gave me a ticket for that.

I contacted three different insurance brokers, and they all were stumped why my rates were so bad.

You are lucky you aren't in South Florida. Rates are ridiculous and they increase a minimum of 25% annually.

[superavant]

There’s speak of rates going higher as well. As an industry whole, insurance carriers pay 104% of the premiums paid by insureds back in claims. That math doesn’t work for long.

If you don’t daily your car and have a garage, Grundy will be by far the cheapest option.

Curious why most of you don’t use a broker? Piecemailing everything together through various direct writers seems like a hassle with no advocate for you in between.

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by RootsTootsMagoots

Jeez, I'm getting absolutely hosed. I have USAA for $1500/6 months. 35 years old, doctorate degree, homeowner, no accidents, 5k-7k miles average a year. We get hail and tornadoes where I live.

Limits are 100/300, full coverage. Deductible is 1k. Progressive was $140 cheaper, but I don't trust them. Geico wanted $600 more than USAA.

My only blemish in the last 5 years is slow rolling a stop sign two blocks from house. Still can't believe that ****head cop gave me a ticket for that.

I contacted three different insurance brokers, and they all were stumped why my rates were so bad.

My understanding is your driving record plays a significant role in the premium but a larger percentage is determined by demographics and the accidents, violations, etc. within that geo area, population et al. This was explained to me a few years back by an adjuster and might be totally out of whack today. YMMV

[xtougher]

Originally Posted by Carefree

My understanding is your driving record plays a significant role in the premium but a larger percentage is determined by demographics and the accidents, violations, etc. within that geo area, population et al. This was explained to me a few years back by an adjuster and might be totally out of whack today. YMMV

This is my understanding as well.

Just a question though: although at some level it makes some sense (some of it doesn't, since it seems they can always cherry pick info that justifies whatever they ask for, etc.), I'm curious is that same practice isn't allowed in a lot of other contexts.

For example, interest rates CAN be based on credit scores, but CANNOT be based on age/race/etc. demographics, right?

Or am I overgeneralizing?

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by xtougher

This is my understanding as well.

Just a question though: although at some level it makes some sense (some of it doesn't, since it seems they can always cherry pick info that justifies whatever they ask for, etc.), I'm curious is that same practice isn't allowed in a lot of other contexts.

For example, interest rates CAN be based on credit scores, but CANNOT be based on age/race/etc. demographics, right?

Or am I overgeneralizing?

Will only speak to my situation which appears to support my prior post; no intention of speaking for anybody else’s situation. We have 2 homes. Both are in affluent high income communities. The first, in Arizona, is largely composed of somewhat elderly retired (or near) people. It is filled with luxury automobiles. The second, in a western New York suburb, is chock full of young families with kids. Many luxury but far more SUV and secondary (Camry, Accord, etc.) cars. We are undoubtedly one of the oldest couples therein. Now to my previous point. Our M240i Arizona premium is significantly lower than our New York M240i. Same year, same options. Different color . Similar mileage. Clean driver licenses. No accidents.

Not anxiously waiting for premium notice in early March on M2 here.

[xtougher]

Originally Posted by Carefree

Will only speak to my situation which appears to support my prior post; no intention of speaking for anybody else’s situation. We have 2 homes. Both are in affluent high income communities. The first, in Arizona, is largely composed of somewhat elderly retired (or near) people. It is filled with luxury automobiles. The second, in a western New York suburb, is chock full of young families with kids. Many luxury but far more SUV and secondary (Camry, Accord, etc.) cars. We are undoubtedly one of the oldest couples therein. Now to my previous point. Our M240i Arizona premium is significantly lower than our New York M240i. Same year, same options. Different color . Similar mileage. Clean driver licenses. No accidents.

Not anxiously waiting for premium notice in early March on M2 here.

Got it...it's the COLOR!

But yeah, I'm not even saying I disagree to some of the logic...just thought it's interesting that we actually sort of accept the different standards in different context. I happen to do mortgages for a living, and it's a thing (apparently, wasn't a thing not too long ago!) to be very careful that certain demographic information is not a factor in loan decisions.

But either way, it's interesting.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by Carefree

My understanding is your driving record plays a significant role in the premium but a larger percentage is determined by demographics and the accidents, violations, etc. within that geo area, population et al. This was explained to me a few years back by an adjuster and might be totally out of whack today. YMMV

My insurance broker walked me through what influences he is seeing in the industry that are leading to higher rates overall. The main thing he pointed was the high cost of repair on BMW's as #1 (assume all things equal in terms of the people insured in terms of driving record, age, etc). Windshield replacement alone can be $3500+. On top of that nearly everything we consume now costs more so why wouldn't insurance go up?

Our auto and home policy renews in April so he is going to take another look at rates then. I'm scared of things going up again....

[MineralGreyMetallic]

What's the process for finding a good broker? Do they take a fee?

[xtougher]

Originally Posted by JMcLellan

My insurance broker walked me through what influences he is seeing in the industry that are leading to higher rates overall. The main thing he pointed was the high cost of repair on BMW's as #1 (assume all things equal in terms of the people insured in terms of driving record, age, etc). Windshield replacement alone can be $3500+. On top of that nearly everything we consume now costs more so why wouldn't insurance go up?

Our auto and home policy renews in April so he is going to take another look at rates then. I'm scared of things going up again....

That's completely fair. It's like a fast food meal costing over $10/person now...didn't used to be like that.

Originally Posted by MineralGreyMetallic

What's the process for finding a good broker? Do they take a fee?

There are people around that are parts of companies that do this as a business model. The ones I've seen around me don't have fees they charge or anything directly to the consumer.

If you throw it out there to like a local social media group, I'm sure people can name some people who are insurance brokers.

Not sure if that's helpful, but that's what I've got.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by MineralGreyMetallic

What's the process for finding a good broker? Do they take a fee?

I don't know what the process is but guessing a google search of a local insurance broker would find options, or talk to friends and family to see if they have a guy. I just piggybacked on to what my parents had been doing for years.