[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

I’m on my 8th 911. 997.2 GTS or 991.1 GTS is where you want to be.

Not a flame, but if the 911 is such a great car, why have you gone through eight of them? Just curious.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Hard to find a really good spec on an S but there are some unicorns out there. S was still narrow body for 991 too. Great car though would own again.

Yes, it is hard to find a good spec S. Mine has 50K worth of options - one of the highest spec 991.1S ever built from what I was told. I have only seen 2 other with higher MSRPs which had the X51 (GTS) package.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Not a flame, but if the 911 is such a great car, why have you gone through eight of them? Just curious.

Porsche's micro segmentation works brilliantly is the answer. I've owned several of them myself and several Caymans as well (several Macans too). They make you want to keep going up the ladder so to speak. They also somewhat ruin you for driving anything else that isnt a 911 or unless you move into a Ferrari / Mclaren / Lamborghini - and even then those cars arent really better to drive than something like a GT3/RS.

[dgoldenz]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Not a flame, but if the 911 is such a great car, why have you gone through eight of them? Just curious.

Different generations and trims all feel like completely different cars. I usually drive something for 6-12 months and then find a new toy. I’ve also made money on almost all of them, so it’s also about buying and selling when the timing is right. Everything is always for sale at the right price.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Porsche's micro segmentation works brilliantly is the answer. I've owned several of them myself and several Caymans as well. They make you want to keep going up the ladder so to speak. They also somewhat ruin you for driving anything else that isnt a 911 or unless you move into a Ferrari / Mclaren / Lamborghini - and even then those cars arent really better to drive than something like a GT3/RS.

Somewhat (correction) ruin? I'll have to take that with a grain of salt.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Completely ruin? I'll have to take that with a grain of salt.

I spent thousands over the years improving the chassis and power of my 2016 M235 6MT. I thought the car became a pretty solid performer for a 2 door coupe. I then got my 2011 Cayman in Oct 2022 and after 6 months of driving it, it made me realize just how disconnected the M235 was. The Cayman forced me to get a 2018 M2 DCT

911s and Cayman/Boxsters are something REALLY special, especially the prior gen models where the driving experience isn't as diluted. They do everything exceptionally well, a true every purpose car, especially the 911s due to the rear seat. They haul ass, they're comfy, they're well built, they are elegant and timeless (barring certain GT and RS cars), they can pack tons of storage space, and you can take them on 1,000 mile road trips and not get beat up.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I spent thousands over the years improving the chassis and power of my 2016 M235 6MT. I thought the car became a pretty solid performer for a 2 door coupe. I then got my 2011 Cayman in Oct 2022 and after 6 months of driving it, it made me realize just how disconnected the M235 was. The Cayman forced me to get a 2018 M2 DCT

911s and Cayman/Boxsters are something REALLY special, especially the prior gen models where the driving experience isn't as diluted. They do everything exceptionally well, a true every purpose car, especially the 911s due to the rear seat. They haul ass, they're comfy, they're well built, they are elegant and timeless (barring certain GT and RS cars), they can pack tons of storage space, and you can take them on 1,000 mile road trips and not get beat up.

I've driven a '08 Cayman and a 1st gen water cooled 911; I think it was an '00 or '03. Neither car impressed me to the point that I'd consider getting a Porsche. To say such cars ruin the driving experience of every other make and only supercars are better, well that's a serious statement.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Completely ruin? I'll have to take that with a grain of salt.

No grain of salt needed - they are that good. I'd say the G8X M3/4 have closed in on the 992 Carreras (Base through GTS), but the GT cars are something truly special. When I got my first 718 GT4, it was another world of feel in the chassis (had a Cayman S, and Cayman GTS prior), the steering - the car felt, alive! It's hard to explain until you've driven one or experienced a Porsche at 6,7,8,9 (GT4RS/GT3/RS on the latter) and the tactile feel. They've been continuously developing this car for 70 years, and you can truly see and feel why it is the best sports car bar none.

It sounds like you have no, or little experience in 911s or Porsche sports cars. Go out and decide for yourself, but they are in a league of their own by and large.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

No grain of salt needed - they are that good. I'd say the G8X M3/4 have closed in on the 992 Carreras (Base through GTS), but the GT cars are something truly special. When I got my first 718 GT4, it was another world of feel in the chassis (had a Cayman S, and Cayman GTS prior), the steering - the car felt, alive! It's hard to explain until you've driven one or experienced a Porsche at 6,7,8,9 (GT4RS/GT3/RS on the latter) and the tactile feel. They've been continuously developing this car for 70 years, and you can truly see and feel why it is the best sports car bar none.

It sounds like you have no, or little experience in 911s or Porsche sports cars. Go out and decide for yourself, but they are in a league of their own by and large.

Well, I've never owned one, so yup, I don't have a ton of experience with the 911. Like I said I drove a friend's '03 very hard on the backroads in my 'hood, which are excellent that I've run my BMWs on for 20+ years. He was quite impressed on how well I drove it, so I acclimated to it quickly (good sign on how well the 911 is set up). I test drove a '08 Cayman for a good 40 miles on some decent backroads. This was a low-mileage Dealership CPO car, so I can assume it was setup correctly. I was expecting magic from the mid-engine chassis but wasn't that impressed with it. I ended up buying an '08 E86 Z4 Coupe over it.

Back in the early '80's I drove the 944 Turbo a few times another friend from college had. It drove much better than the '77 924 POS my older brother had in the late 1970s. The 944 is one of the best sounding cars made IMO. Build quality of '80s Porsches aside, if I were to get a classic Porsche, a 944 Turbo would be it.

Lastly was a few years ago riding in a '82 911 track rat another friend has. I didn't drive it, but from the right seat, I liked it very much.

But with me, when I find a great car, I keep it, so I can really learn to appreciate the machine. Maybe my perspective is unusual in that way. I found it odd that someone has had 8 different 911. To me that means the car might not be that satisfying; it was just an observation based on how I view automobiles. dgoldenz gave a reasonable answer to my question.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Not a flame, but if the 911 is such a great car, why have you gone through eight of them? Just curious.

This happens a lot with Corvettes too. You buy one and you're basically screwed, because there's nothing to move up into. Corvette and 911 both are amazing all rounder cars, with Porsche having the AWD and rear seat options, and Corvettes having a major advantage in price, performance, and value.

I've had 5 Corvettes, because I kept wanting one that was more "my spec" than the last one, or one that was a little older or newer. A lot of people will jump between sub models and generations and body styles and such. It makes it tough to look at other vehicles because they seem so overpriced and underwhelming. Until you just size out of a 2 seater, or your budget goes way higher, it's tough to justify anything else.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Well, I've never owned one, so yup, I don't have a ton of experience with the 911. Like I said I drove a friend's '03 very hard on the backroads in my 'hood, which are excellent that I've run my BMWs on for 20+ years. He was quite impressed on how well I drove it, so I acclimated to it quickly (good sign on how well the 911 is set up). I test drove a '08 Cayman for a good 40 miles on some decent backroads. This was a low-mileage Dealership CPO car, so I can assume it was setup correctly. I was expecting magic from the mid-engine chassis but wasn't that impressed with it. I ended up buying an '08 E86 Z4 Coupe over it.

Back in the early '80's I drove the 944 Turbo a few times another friend from college had. It drove much better than the '77 924 POS my older brother had in the late 1970s. The 944 is one of the best sounding cars made IMO. Build quality of '80s Porsches aside, if I were to get a classic Porsche, a 944 Turbo would be it.

Lastly was a few years ago riding in a '82 911 track rat another friend has. I didn't drive it, but from the right seat, I liked it very much.

But with me, when I find a great car, I keep it, so I can really learn to appreciate the machine. Maybe my perspective is unusual in that way. I found it odd that someone has had 8 different 911. To me that means the car might not be that satisfying; it was just an observation based on how I view automobiles. dgoldenz gave a reasonable answer to my question.

Makes sense. I'd definitely get more seat time in some newer cars...especially a GT car.

I myself has a Z4M Coupe and a 2006 Cayman S - the Cayman S was the better car despite the Z4M having a little better engine. My two 718 GT4 aside from being too quiet never ceased to amaze me and GT3/RS are even more so wild. Just watch the recent EVO where they pit the GT3RS vs a Radical SR3 and Mclaren 750S and what they have to say about how precise and consistent the 911 is.

I mean, if your qualifying factor is owning many of the same car, then the M2/3/4/5 should all elicit the same opinion. I am on my 8th M3/4. Vic55 on here is on his 5th G80 M3/4. It just means the car is memorable and good enough for people to want more of that experience.

[x622]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Makes sense. I'd definitely get more seat time in some newer cars...especially a GT car.

I myself has a Z4M Coupe and a 2006 Cayman S - the Cayman S was the better car despite the Z4M having a little better engine. My two 718 GT4 aside from being too quiet never ceased to amaze me and GT3/RS are even more so wild. Just watch the recent EVO where they pit the GT3RS vs a Radical SR3 and Mclaren 750S and what they have to say about how precise and consistent the 911 is.

I mean, if your qualifying factor is owning many of the same car, then the M2/3/4/5 should all elicit the same opinion. I am on my 8th M3/4. Vic55 on here is on his 5th G80 M3/4. It just means the car is memorable and good enough for people to want more of that experience.

Haha a 3rs vs a 750? The 750 eats it and makes it look like an overpriced beetle with a bodykit.

I love journos. Driven both, no comparison. SR3 is also, no comparison.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

But with me, when I find a great car, I keep it, so I can really learn to appreciate the machine. Maybe my perspective is unusual in that way. I found it odd that someone has had 8 different 911. To me that means the car might not be that satisfying; it was just an observation based on how I view automobiles. dgoldenz gave a reasonable answer to my question.

I never test drove a Cayman before getting mine. I relied on "hopes and dreams" of the various reviews and input I received from people I knew and forum opinions. I knew I wanted a Porsche and a 2011 Cayman 6MT Base seemed like the safest bet to try out one of these cars on the cheap ($33K). Like I said, it took me a full 6 months of driving and around 5K miles to learn what the car is capable of and the positives and negatives. The car astounds me at what it can do. It not the fastest thing on the road nor generates the highest Gs or best braking numbers. It's just damn good at everything for a sportscar. I've never had or driven a street car that feels so composed at the limit and begs for more and isn't full of compromise.

[Josh-PA]

I currently have a 991.2 manual cab in the fleet along with our e88, e91 and g05 + I've had 17 other BMWs in the past, so I have decent experience on this question. The 911 is great, it's incredibly competent, well built, super solid and fun. I find it to be almost too competent at times, sort of surgical in that it feels the same at 25, 50, 100mph - stable, smooth and well planted, but not playful. Compared to my 1er, I get joy out of the puppy dog nature of not being as composed, and being able to toss it around nearer the limits without fear. Jeremy and Richard did a great comparison test of a 986 and e86 z4 and I think Richard really nailed the difference in personality.

(the real fun stuff starts at 4 mins)

It's also crazy to me how much the price of the 911 has increased since 2019. I was on the waitlist for a very highly spec'ed 992s manual cab w/ PTS that was around $177k when I locked in my order. Before I got a slot, the price went up $30k and then they cut PTS options, then killed off the manual on everything but the T and then raised the price another $15k, so I left the waitlist and have a new Z4 handschalter on order. I use it as my daily, and we'll keep the 911 for weekends and whatever.

Objectively the 911 is 'better', but I don't think its ~$100k then the z4, or m2, or similar bmw for my use case.

[Alfisti]

Yeah the Z4 is compelling. I could sell my 2009 C2S Cab, grab a clean 2009 Z4M Roadster and pocket about 35 grand. Makes u think.

[thebmw]

I'll be honest, I just don't get why people are so head over heels over porsches. Until recently, I didn't find them attractive at all. Only the last two generations have been attractive to me. But beyond that, they're driving dynamics are wonky with their massively rear biased weight. I also find them to be sterile because they're so precise.

That's what I like about BMW is that they do everything well but are still not perfect and it gives you a great driving experience. That's also why I love my multiple Gen 5 Vipers. They are as raw as any car ever made with the nanny gadgets and leather that's straight from Ferrari.

I love my manuals. I love my numerous M6 manuals, DCT, and 8 spd 650s. To me, the most perfect daily driver ever made and ever will be made. I don't think Porsche holds a candle to that. I can genuinely daily my F06 and F13s but the 911 and Cayman are so damn small that they're uncomfortable and cause back pain. And they're not practical at all, have no functional rear seats, and no functional truck.

[c1pher]

As kind of intimated above, Porsche makes so many variants. I drove a Targa because my wife wanted a convertible and I wanted a coupe. We had a 991.2, then a 992, then back to a 991.2S that I really liked. I only switched to a 991.2 GTS since it practically had a dream spec so I jumped on it.

The one thing I like about Porsche is if you don’t put 10 million miles on them, they are easy to get out of and not lose your a$$. I sold my first Targa for what I paid before Covid times, then sold my 992 for $10k less than I paid after 2.5 years and 15,000 miles.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by thebmw

I'll be honest, I just don't get why people are so head over heels over porsches. Until recently, I didn't find them attractive at all. Only the last two generations have been attractive to me. But beyond that, they're driving dynamics are wonky with their massively rear biased weight. I also find them to be sterile because they're so precise.

That's what I like about BMW is that they do everything well but are still not perfect and it gives you a great driving experience. That's also why I love my multiple Gen 5 Vipers. They are as raw as any car ever made with the nanny gadgets and leather that's straight from Ferrari.

I love my manuals. I love my numerous M6 manuals, DCT, and 8 spd 650s. To me, the most perfect daily driver ever made and ever will be made. I don't think Porsche holds a candle to that. I can genuinely daily my F06 and F13s but the 911 and Cayman are so damn small that they're uncomfortable and cause back pain. And they're not practical at all, have no functional rear seats, and no functional truck.

I'll try and address this with the obvious bias that I own a 997 series 911. In saying that, I am not head over heels, I don't have the same romantic attachment to it that I had with my Alfas for example.

You're painting with a broad brush because of the wild differences from model to model and series to series. Yes a Cayman is very small and tight, a 911 is considerably easier to live with, one could argue it's biggest strength is livability. There's really no other genuine sports car that can play double duty as Dad's therapy drive, back road hustler with genuine handling chops and then also tote the wife and 2 kids and a picnic basket in a taught, sub 3500lb package. Calling the back seats non-functional is bizarre, it's tight but well over 50% of my trips are with kids in the back and wifey up front.

Then there's the series variation, a 997 and a 992 are a MILLION miles apart, really depends what you are after. And then there's the sub-models, the Turbo is basically a comfortable GT missile that leaves other GT for dead through the corners, whereas the GTS is a very streetable poor man's GT3 in 997 and 991.1 guise (NA engines).

I had the following requirements when looking for a fair weather vehicle;

• Cabriolet
• NA engine
• 2+2 Seating

This left me with following choices;

• Mustang PP2
• Camaro
• Maserati Gran Turismo
• Jaguar XKR-S
• BMW E92 M3
• 991.1 Series 911
• 997.2 series 911

Camaro first to go as I don't like the look of them and the engine is all bottom end not something that likes a rev. Jaguar far too heavy and too much of a GT car, same with the Maserati though to a lesser degree but the maintenance costs were INSANE.

The BMW felt more like a compromise, as in i'd take that option if I ditched my DD and went with one car but that engine has a distaste for short/cold trips and I do a lot of short/cold trips in my DD.

The 991 Porsche just never felt right, like it lost that 911 shape so to speak.

The Mustang was a serious contender. In PP2 format the car was shockingly grippy and the Coyote a TREMENDOUS engine, but the long hood and nose heavy dynamics always felt a bit clumsy next to the 911. The 997 also looks better, i love the shape and is a bit special. Cost wise, entry price on the 997 was absolutely BRUTAL but the lack of depreciation vs the stang was compelling. In the end the near 800lb weight difference mattered.

Each man has his own needs, so I am not saying Porsche's are for everyone but they do a fantastic job of offering such a wide gamut of varieties that one can find something suited to one's needs. I may well sell mine one day, pocket the change and get a Z4M which is in the same spirit but has just the two seats, but my 8 year old LOVES a drive and he sits out back with his big brother int he front, who am I to leave him behind?

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I ended up in my E86 Z4 Coupe because of the C7. When the C7 came out I was all ready to get one. A LT1 with the Z51 package was under $60K. I was going to daily it a few days a week, which back then meant 170 miles a day, so keeping the sale price in check was an important consideration. I found the C7 I wanted at a Rick Hendricks dealership and was ready to pull the trigger. My wife, who was all for the move originally, changed her mind (we already had 4 cars at the time), so I decided not to fight that headache. But I still needed another daily driver while the E90, then over 250,000 miles at the time, was going to need some downtime in the near future (plus I wanted a sports coupe ).

That brought me over to the Cayman I've spoken of earlier in this thread. I thought maybe get away from BMW for a bit and try a Porsche with their great build quality and longevity. The '08 had the possibility of the IMS bearing failure, but I was good with the fix for that (the oil filter bypass to feed the bearing from the outside solution). But I just didn't like the Cayman well enough, and the CPO situation wasn't what I first thought; its history showed it was a service loaner car. On the drive home from the Cayman campaign (Friday after T-day 2014), the E86 Z4 3.0si came to mind. It fit the bill nicely, having the N52 and based on the 3-series platform meant I already had the specialized tool set needed for it (built up from over 25+ years of BMW ownership at that point). I found a low-mileage one in the next few weeks, test drove it. 10 years and 100,000 miles later I still love the thing; lest for the rodent that just chewed the crap out of it in October, but that's for another thread...

It's funny how things like that work.

I was going to buy a Cayman S before I bought my first Vette. Test drove the first one and was surprised by how shitty it rode and how lifeless it felt vs my dad's 993 and 997. It was boring. I checked it up to "maybe that one had too high of tire pressure" or something like that. Started driving other cars as well, drove a few 370Zs and LOVED them. The Vq37 sounded great, the interior was nice enough, decent feature set, drove great, rode good enough, and the chassis was just SO friendly to corners whether by going around them or sliding around them. Drove a few more Caymans, and i found that the first one in drove wasn't an outlier, the car just was boring. It was capable, yes, but not satisfying or fun. At the time, I was just a single dude that moved to rural NC and was talking it over with my best friend. He told me I needed to drive a Corvette, because a couple years prior he had a 350Z, and while he liked it a lot, it was super expensive to make more power than minimal bolt ons could get you. He said he totally lost interest in his Z when he found out he could have had a C5, and nearly a C5Z for what he paid for his Z, and could have easily had a C5Z for what he'd spend to put forced induction on the Z. So I went and drove one, a magnetic red C6 with a tan interior, I thought it was hideous and old man, and part of the rear window trim kept falling off in our test drive. That said, the car drove, sounded, and performed AMAZINGLY, blowing everything else i had been driving out of the watering every single way. Plus it has a removable targa roof, so I got the hardtop I needed and the open roof unwanted (having moved from south Florida, a soft top was a no go because those just get slashed and your stuff stolen). So I looked around some more, and ended up buying a cyber gray C6 with Z51 the next state over, and my best friend and I went and picked dit up on a work night, we legit didn't get home until 3-4 AM and went to work the next day, lol. But the car was amazing, and I was kinda hooked. After having that car for a while, I had wanted a black wide body car and compromised to get that car. Intended up finding a black widebody priced really well, and traded for that car (and since I had bought it right I actually made money on that deal). Then I bought my c4 to use as a track car, because it was cheaper than a minor track issue would have been to fix on my c6.

Then I made a series of bad choices. Traded the c6 for a truck, traded that for a WRX STI (loved that car), then found my dream spec Vette. Traded the STI for it, and here we are all those years later. Recently I've considered selling it because now I've got two kids that can't ride in it, and I usually don't drive it to work because if I needed to get them I'd be SOL, but I e kind of moved past that now and will be keeping it. My son is getting to the point where he could ride in it with a booster seat, and so he could come with me to cars and coffee or something like that, which would be nice.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

It's funny how things like that work.

I was going to buy a Cayman S before I bought my first Vette. Test drove the first one and was surprised by how shitty it rode and how lifeless it felt vs my dad's 993 and 997. It was boring. I checked it up to "maybe that one had too high of tire pressure" or something like that. Started driving other cars as well, drove a few 370Zs and LOVED them. The Vq37 sounded great, the interior was nice enough, decent feature set, drove great, rode good enough, and the chassis was just SO friendly to corners whether by going around them or sliding around them. Drove a few more Caymans, and i found that the first one in drove wasn't an outlier, the car just was boring. It was capable, yes, but not satisfying or fun. At the time, I was just a single dude that moved to rural NC and was talking it over with my best friend. He told me I needed to drive a Corvette, because a couple years prior he had a 350Z, and while he liked it a lot, it was super expensive to make more power than minimal bolt ons could get you. He said he totally lost interest in his Z when he found out he could have had a C5, and nearly a C5Z for what he paid for his Z, and could have easily had a C5Z for what he'd spend to put forced induction on the Z. So I went and drove one, a magnetic red C6 with a tan interior, I thought it was hideous and old man, and part of the rear window trim kept falling off in our test drive. That said, the car drove, sounded, and performed AMAZINGLY, blowing everything else i had been driving out of the watering every single way. Plus it has a removable targa roof, so I got the hardtop I needed and the open roof unwanted (having moved from south Florida, a soft top was a no go because those just get slashed and your stuff stolen). So I looked around some more, and ended up buying a cyber gray C6 with Z51 the next state over, and my best friend and I went and picked dit up on a work night, we legit didn't get home until 3-4 AM and went to work the next day, lol. But the car was amazing, and I was kinda hooked. After having that car for a while, I had wanted a black wide body car and compromised to get that car. Intended up finding a black widebody priced really well, and traded for that car (and since I had bought it right I actually made money on that deal). Then I bought my c4 to use as a track car, because it was cheaper than a minor track issue would have been to fix on my c6.

Then I made a series of bad choices. Traded the c6 for a truck, traded that for a WRX STI (loved that car), then found my dream spec Vette. Traded the STI for it, and here we are all those years later. Recently I've considered selling it because now I've got two kids that can't ride in it, and I usually don't drive it to work because if I needed to get them I'd be SOL, but I e kind of moved past that now and will be keeping it. My son is getting to the point where he could ride in it with a booster seat, and so he could come with me to cars and coffee or something like that, which would be nice.

My brother, 9 years older, bought a new 1979 black over red C3 (I don't remember the spec). I was in my late teens at the time. Such a cool fricken car it was. To this day I remember my first ride in it. It was just so neat. Years later when the C4 debuted in my early 20's I really liked it. The clam shell hood with the engine and big fat front tires hidden underneath, it was like GM just rebodied a race car. If I had room in my fleet, I'd get a C4 because I still want one. I'd have to check, but I'd bet my Z4 out performs it given it's 22 years advanced in automotive technology. I have to admit some of the appeal of the Z4 to me takes me back to my first ride in that C3. Long hood, blistered front fenders, bucket seats. A German C3...

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

My brother, 9 years older, bought a new 1979 black over red C3 (I don't remember the spec). I was in my late teens at the time. Such a cool fricken car it was. To this day I remember my first ride in it. It was just so neat. Years later when the C4 debuted in my early 20's I really liked it. The clam shell hood with the engine and big fat front tires hidden underneath, it was like GM just rebodied a race car. If I had room in my fleet, I'd get a C4 because I still want one. I'd have to check, but I'd bet my Z4 out performs it given it's 22 years advanced in automotive technology. I have to admit some of the appeal of the Z4 to me takes me back to my first ride in that C3. Long hood, blistered front fenders, bucket seats. A German C3...

The C4 ran for basically forever by modern standards. 84-96, and the performance difference between them is HUGE. You can get an 84 that's like 200hp, or you can get a 300hp LT1, or a 96 LT4 car with 330hp (underrated because the LS1 was coming out next year with 345, the LT4 really makes roughly 350 crank HP). Then there's the ZR1 with it's DOHC engine that makes 400hp.

The best part is that any of the LT motors take mods like champs. A simple heads/cam package on an LT1 can take them to 400hp with stock drivability for under $3k. The ZR1 with heads, cams, and ported intake can do 550-600hp and drive as good as stock. They're also fantastically analog, and while they do have some chassis deficiencies due to being made a target vs a t top late in development, they still pulled over a g on a skidpad in the 80s. Add an x brace from a convertible, a camber bar up front, and a harness bar to smtie the two rails together and it gets rid of most chassis deflection. Honestly the harness bar alone got rid of 90% of mine, and the chassis deflection really only gets bad when you in olt the target roof.

They're great cars, I would highly recommend getting one now, as prices for good ones are steadily climbing. Your Z4 unless it's an M Coupe would get annihilated by an LT1 Z51 6 speed C4. They're fairly light, make a decent bit of power, and the mix of chassis, suspension, and decent rubber is great. And the steering feel, well that's just sublime. The whole car is super analog, super communicative, and just a joy.

My 92 LT1 6 speed embarrasses my dad's 996 in a straight line, or around corners. They're not world beaters anymore in terms of performance, but they're still quick for their time. The C4 was literally so fast when it was new that the other manufacturers successfully petitioned to have the kicked out of SCCA racing, and they had to create the Corvette Challenge series for them to race in because the car just dominated the competition.

[baege]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

It's funny how things like that work.

I was going to buy a Cayman S before I bought my first Vette. Test drove the first one and was surprised by how shitty it rode and how lifeless it felt vs my dad's 993 and 997. It was boring. I checked it up to "maybe that one had too high of tire pressure" or something like that. Started driving other cars as well, drove a few 370Zs and LOVED them. The Vq37 sounded great, the interior was nice enough, decent feature set, drove great, rode good enough, and the chassis was just SO friendly to corners whether by going around them or sliding around them. Drove a few more Caymans, and i found that the first one in drove wasn't an outlier, the car just was boring. It was capable, yes, but not satisfying or fun. At the time, I was just a single dude that moved to rural NC and was talking it over with my best friend. He told me I needed to drive a Corvette, because a couple years prior he had a 350Z, and while he liked it a lot, it was super expensive to make more power than minimal bolt ons could get you. He said he totally lost interest in his Z when he found out he could have had a C5, and nearly a C5Z for what he paid for his Z, and could have easily had a C5Z for what he'd spend to put forced induction on the Z. So I went and drove one, a magnetic red C6 with a tan interior, I thought it was hideous and old man, and part of the rear window trim kept falling off in our test drive. That said, the car drove, sounded, and performed AMAZINGLY, blowing everything else i had been driving out of the watering every single way. Plus it has a removable targa roof, so I got the hardtop I needed and the open roof unwanted (having moved from south Florida, a soft top was a no go because those just get slashed and your stuff stolen). So I looked around some more, and ended up buying a cyber gray C6 with Z51 the next state over, and my best friend and I went and picked dit up on a work night, we legit didn't get home until 3-4 AM and went to work the next day, lol. But the car was amazing, and I was kinda hooked. After having that car for a while, I had wanted a black wide body car and compromised to get that car. Intended up finding a black widebody priced really well, and traded for that car (and since I had bought it right I actually made money on that deal). Then I bought my c4 to use as a track car, because it was cheaper than a minor track issue would have been to fix on my c6.

Then I made a series of bad choices. Traded the c6 for a truck, traded that for a WRX STI (loved that car), then found my dream spec Vette. Traded the STI for it, and here we are all those years later. Recently I've considered selling it because now I've got two kids that can't ride in it, and I usually don't drive it to work because if I needed to get them I'd be SOL, but I e kind of moved past that now and will be keeping it. My son is getting to the point where he could ride in it with a booster seat, and so he could come with me to cars and coffee or something like that, which would be nice.

man this goes to show how subjective it all is

I had a 350Z and a 2015C7 and those two cars are 2 of my least favourites!

I find the VQ sounds like a coffee grinder in the upper rpm range. I traded it for a crossfire (yes you read that right) and liked it better than the 350Z.

I went from a 2014 Cayman S to a 2015 C7 7 speed and did not like it all (too big, weak PARTIAL throttle response, bad visbiility), sold it within weeks and ended up in a 2016 Cayman S

different strokes (and bores!) for different folks!