[Squidget]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

If you ask most car reviewers or look at any of those M car group tests most of the time people put the E46 or E92 at the top.

I think there is some selection bias due to the average age of car journalists. We've seen some young reviewers and they don't talk about the E46 at all, they compare the G87 to more modern cars. The new Supra, or the Z, etc. Nostalgia and "your first love" is a powerful force.

[MLBMW]

Originally Posted by Squidget

I think there is some selection bias due to the average age of car journalists. We've seen some young reviewers and they don't talk about the E46 at all, they compare the G87 to more modern cars. The new Supra, or the Z, etc. Nostalgia and "your first love" is a powerful force.

Exactly! Everything is relative. To really understand a reviewer's opinion, you have to understand the reviewer. The only review, or opinion, that really matters to you is your own.

[baron95]

Originally Posted by Squidget

Apparently the price is pretty close in the UK, where the M2 is hella expensive. Or like, Singapore, I guess. In North America, you are right, it's not close.

Is it though?

M2 UK Starting Price is: £64,890

Cayman GTS 4.0 UK Starting Price is: £73,300

That is approximately US$11,000 difference in price.

That is basically the difference between the M2 and the M3 the next class up in BMW's range.

[clydefrog]

Originally Posted by baron95

Is it though?

M2 UK Starting Price is: £64,890

Cayman GTS 4.0 UK Starting Price is: £73,300

That is approximately US$11,000 difference in price.

That is basically the difference between the M2 and the M3 the next class up in BMW's range.

£64.8k is $81.8k though, so ~$19k more expensive than in the US to start with, while the £73k is $92.4k which is much closer to the US price of $95k.

$19k is pretty significant although not Singapore levels of crazy, where a honda civic goes for like $120k US.

At least for me, the M2 is a harder sell at $82k base. Definitely can see why our European friends would just spend the extra dosh on the Porsche.

[aerobod]

Comparing EU and UK prices with North American prices has to also take into account the fact that the EU/UK prices include 20% VAT (sales tax) in the quoted prices, whereas North American prices require the relevant sales taxes to be added. The EU/UK prices typically have to be quoted as OTR (On The Road) prices, no additional amounts added.

[clydefrog]

Originally Posted by aerobod

Comparing EU and UK prices with North American prices has to also take into account the fact that the EU/UK prices include 20% VAT (sales tax) in the quoted prices, whereas North American prices require the relevant sales taxes to be added. The EU/UK prices typically have to be quoted as OTR (On The Road) prices, no additional amounts added.

Ah good to know, I knew about that in like the grocery store didn't connect the dots to cars too.

I love that about Europe the price you see is the price you pay!

[baron95]

Originally Posted by clydefrog

Ah good to know, I knew about that in like the grocery store didn't connect the dots to cars too.

I love that about Europe the price you see is the price you pay!

In other words....they hide the taxes (kinda of how we do it with gasoline)

[baron95]

Originally Posted by clydefrog

£64.8k is $81.8k though, so ~$19k more expensive than in the US to start with, while the £73k is $92.4k which is much closer to the US price of $95k.

$19k is pretty significant although not Singapore levels of crazy, where a honda civic goes for like $120k US.

At least for me, the M2 is a harder sell at $82k base. Definitely can see why our European friends would just spend the extra dosh on the Porsche.

So, in the UK and Singapore the GTS is a lot more expensive than the M2.

In the US the GTS is hugely more expensive than the M2.

But in no continent is the GTS "basically the same price" as the M2.

I guess 2+2 coupes are a lot more desirable in the UK and command higher prices. I'm glad I don't live there

[VIERsr]

The 'basic' M2 is an almost complete car, a 'basic' Cayman GTS barely has four wheels and two doors, you have to pay extra to add everything.

[aerobod]

Also, the UK M2 basic config includes more than in the US and Canada (such as standard carbon fibre roof), whereas the Porsche base configs are even more basic than in North America. Once the standard European taxes are removed, the basic car starting price is very close to the US price, although Canada still seems to have the lowest BMW starting prices after adjusting for exchange rates.

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by VIERsr

The 'basic' M2 is an almost complete car, a 'basic' Cayman GTS barely has four wheels and two doors, you have to pay extra to add everything.

Fact. Since I'm now in a holding pattern on M2, I've been pricing out P-cars to see if I could get into one, and GTS is one of those. It very quickly balloons to 100K+. I mean, I can't effing believe you have to pay extra for buttons on the steering wheel, for example.

Porsche gets away with it because they can, but any claims that they're in the same price ballpark as BMW are ludicrous.

[Albator_IIII]

Originally Posted by JustinHEMI

Fact. Since I'm now in a holding pattern on M2, I've been pricing out P-cars to see if I could get into one, and GTS is one of those. It very quickly balloons to 100K+. I mean, I can't effing believe you have to pay extra for buttons on the steering wheel, for example.

Porsche gets away with it because they can, but any claims that they're in the same price ballpark as BMW are ludicrous.

While current p-car prices are out of range for me, I applaud this a la carte approach.

As I stated before, if I could strip the M2 to the "bones" as a factory order, I would.

[JustinHEMI]

Originally Posted by Albator_IIII

While current p-car prices are out of range for me, I applaud this a la carte approach.

As I stated before, if I could strip the M2 to the "bones" as a factory order, I would.

I do appreciate it as well. As a "poor," I'm just reeling from the high base price and how quickly it ramps up from there, so I say "poor" things like "I can't believe I have to pay extra for buttons!"

In principle, I wish buying every car was like this. Let me a la carte everything.

[VIERsr]

Originally Posted by Albator_IIII

While current p-car prices are out of range for me, I applaud this a la carte approach.

As I stated before, if I could strip the M2 to the "bones" as a factory order, I would.

So do I, I really like the customisation that Porsche offers (well, it's not exactly on offer )and would love to have more choice on the M2, but be aware that nothing is free with Porsches and you don't see many Cayman GTSs with basic specs, so the starting price is very theoretical and the real price gap with the M2 could eventually be very large.

[aerobod]

I thought I would do a comparable pricing check across the Canadian, US and UK M2 configs with the same options. Due to some items being standard in one market and not the others, it is a superset with the following config:

Manual transmission, TR paint, carbon fibre trim, carbon fibre roof, adaptive LED lights, heated steering wheel, wireless charging, HUD, driver assist, parking assist, comfort access, Harmon Kardon sound.

The price with sales taxes not included (20% VAT removed for UK price) is:

Canada - CAD$87,130 = £50,810 / USD$64,176
US - USD$70,595 = CAD$95,846 / £55,887
UK - £55,600 (£66,720 with VAT) = USD$70,229 / CAD$95,350

[VIERsr]

https://www.largus.fr/actualite-auto...-30028703.html

[MLBMW]

Originally Posted by aerobod

I thought I would do a comparable pricing check across the Canadian, US and UK M2 configs with the same options. Due to some items being standard in one market and not the others, it is a superset with the following config:

Manual transmission, TR paint, carbon fibre trim, carbon fibre roof, adaptive LED lights, heated steering wheel, wireless charging, HUD, driver assist, parking assist, comfort access, Harmon Kardon sound.

The price with sales taxes not included (20% VAT removed for UK price) is:

Canada - CAD$87,130 = £50,810 / USD$64,176
US - USD$70,595 = CAD$95,846 / £55,887
UK - £55,600 (£66,720 with VAT) = USD$70,229 / CAD$95,350

Thanks for the comparison!

[Chet for short]

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...t-test-review/

[baron95]

Originally Posted by Chet for short

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...t-test-review/

And they put it on the scales, full fuel.....

3,748lbs (52%F/48%R) with the manual.

Put the G80 826M wheels on and it becomes 3,730lbs. Put the G80 Li-ION battery on and it becomes something like 3,700lbs.

So this car is ˜100lbs less than a G80/G87 similarly equipped. Which is what you'd expect.

[baj_baj]

In Germany a fully speced M2 is about 94k, but you can get about 15% discount. The Cayman starts from 90k and if you don't want to feel like you're sitting in a Golf Mk4, you might be spending 115k+. They are not even close... Spec for spec can end up being a 40k difference..

[Chet for short]

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/big...718-cayman-gt4

Nothing new or earth shaking, but Top Gear is always an amusing read.

[clydefrog]

Originally Posted by Chet for short

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/big...718-cayman-gt4

Nothing new or earth shaking, but Top Gear is always an amusing read.

The M2 drives like it looks. Burly. Broad shouldered and unapologetic. If it were a person it’d crack your knuckles when it shook you by the hand, with a glint in the eye that it’d done so deliberately to assert alpha male dominance. That might not be your cup of tea but it absolutely has personality, and it leaves an impression. Just perhaps, not quite the GOAT you might’ve hoped.

I love that ending haha