[F32Fleet]

Analysts are saying that BMW, Daimler, Ford and Renault are "in an increasingly questionable position and should consider consolidation to stay in the race.."

The current renaissance of the automobile industry is coming to an end.

[Red Bread]

There was a renaissance? Half liter per cylinder turbo charged motors with automatics, largely in cute utes made for a renaissance? Guess I missed out.

[clee1982]

Originally Posted by F32Fleet

Analysts are saying that BMW, Daimler, Ford and Renault are "in an increasingly questionable position and should consider consolidation to stay in the race.."

The current renaissance of the automobile industry is coming to an end.

think that has been raised since the financial crisis though...

Originally Posted by Red Bread

There was a renaissance? Half liter per cylinder turbo charged motors with automatics, largely in cute utes made for a renaissance? Guess I missed out.

consider how much performance for $, while still has better mpg, I think for most "utility" driven this has been good (vs. say during the oil crisis it's just slower car all around)

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by clee1982

consider how much performance for $, while still has better mpg, I think for most "utility" driven this has been good (vs. say during the oil crisis it's just slower car all around)

I suppose. But I do wonder if we hadn't shifted to 1,000 pound heavier SUVs if naturally aspirated motors and manuals would be more prevalent and similarly efficient?

But I'm just a tall dad making a GTI work in a world of Range Rovers and Suburbans. And of course our Q5 actually gets better mileage than my manual car with the same motor. So I can answer my own question, I suppose.

[chassis]

Think of an industry with flat unit volume for 10 years. Would it be healthy? No.

The North American auto market has been flatlined at 17m units per year for a decade. Population has grown during that time, so unit volume should have increased. Car ownership per capita is declining.

There are more headwinds (e-commerce, drones, self driving machinery) than there are tailwinds in this industry.

Consolidation is the most likely answer from a fiduciary point of view.

[yco]

one day all cars will be VW or Toyota.. this post can stay here..

[thebmw]

Every company is different from a need standpoint. FCA and Peugeot compliment each other and whatever overlap is there will be consolidated. VW group is already huge and doesn't need a partner. Toyota and Honda will persist. BMW is independent and will need to either continue creating top-in-class models (which they have not done for a few years and definitely not now) or they will be in trouble. Time will tell what steps they take with their new CEO.

Personally, there is literally not a single new BMW I am interested in and it seems that this sentiment is echoed by many on this forum and in real life. Let's see what the sales #'s show though. That dictates everything.

[Darth One]

A truly massive amount of undesirable cars in that lineup if FCA merged with PSA

[thebmw]

Originally Posted by Darth One

A truly massive amount of undesirable cars in that lineup if FCA merged with PSA

There are massive amounts of undesirable cars in almost every manufacturers lineup nowadays, including BMW.

[clee1982]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

I suppose. But I do wonder if we hadn't shifted to 1,000 pound heavier SUVs if naturally aspirated motors and manuals would be more prevalent and similarly efficient?

But I'm just a tall dad making a GTI work in a world of Range Rovers and Suburbans. And of course our Q5 actually gets better mileage than my manual car with the same motor. So I can answer my own question, I suppose.

I doubt NA can meet modern regulations as well as mpg, not all the weight are useless, probably a lot has to do with insulation and crash safety

I still do want some manual / RWD / NA before it just completely die though...

[WestRace]

Although I am still more of a oil burner and not really electric guy, but after one M after another M from BMW it's like eating the same burger everyday. Sure you can change the flavors here and there but it's a still a burger.
I mean how many different versions of Mustang are they going to trot out each year. I feel like each special Mustang iteration is like a fast food burger churning from a McDonald's factory.
As I said, I am not an electric car guy, but I would pay more attention if electric cars are more accessible and more practical. If every car makers make a full tilt effort, batteries will get cheaper and electric cars will be more practical. How many people can afford a 100K+ electric car? And I wouldn't buy a Model 3 because Tesla could go out of business next year ... who knows!
All the self driving stuffs are nice but it's too complicated and becoming a distraction from the potential innovation in electric cars.

[clee1982]

Originally Posted by WestRace

Although I am still more of a oil burner and not really electric guy, but after one M after another M from BMW it's like eating the same burger everyday. Sure you can change the flavors here and there but it's a still a burger.
I mean how many different versions of Mustang are they going to trot out each year. I feel like each special Mustang iteration is like a fast food burger churning from a McDonald's factory.
As I said, I am not an electric car guy, but I would pay more attention if electric cars are more accessible and more practical. If every car makers make a full tilt effort, batteries will get cheaper and electric cars will be more practical. How many people can afford a 100K+ electric car? And I wouldn't buy a Model 3 because Tesla could go out of business next year ... who knows!
All the self driving stuffs are nice but it's too complicated and becoming a distraction from the potential innovation in electric cars.

Most newly rolled out electric car are sub $100k no? And most do not have Tesla kind of level 2.

If I have a private garage to install fast wall charger I'll absolutely buy an electric car