[SloppySquid]

Need help/advice!

In 2 weeks l'm going to put my car in storage so just wanted to see what to do with the oil. I'm at 13,000km and my last oil change was at the first break in at 8,000km. * next oil change due roughly in 4,000 km*

Should I change the oil before i store it for winter, then change it when winter is done?
Or
Should I let the oil sit and just wait till next year.

I called my 2 local dealerships, one of the service advisors said with the new synthetic oil in these modern cars it wouldn't harm the car to let the oil sit and just change it next year when l'm due for my required oil change.

I don't know why new cars have the oil change intervals are so far apart from each other

***if I do an early oil change I will have to pay out of pocket which I got 2 prices $300-$400. ***
Thank you!!!

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by SloppySquid

Need help/advice!

In 2 weeks l'm going to put my car in storage so just wanted to see what to do with the oil. I'm at 13,000km and my last oil change was at the first break in at 8,000km. * next oil change due roughly in 4,000 km*

Should I change the oil before i store it for winter, then change it when winter is done?
Or
Should I let the oil sit and just wait till next year.

I called my 2 local dealerships, one of the service advisors said with the new synthetic oil in these modern cars it wouldn't harm the car to let the oil sit and just change it next year when l'm due for my required oil change.

I don't know why new cars have the oil change intervals are so far apart from each other

***if I do an early oil change I will have to pay out of pocket which I got 2 prices $300-$400. ***
Thank you!!!

I normally leave a couple of cars with synthetic oil in them over the winter with no issues. As long as the engine was given a good run before storing the car to evaporate any moisture in the oil, it shouldn’t be a problem.

I rebuilt the engine in my Caterham last winter due to a dropped valve from a fractured valve spring, it had been stored over winter for 11 years with the previous year’s oil in it after hard track use. All bearing surfaces, bores, cams, followers, oil pump and oil sump were spotless, other than the valve impact damage on one bore, the head and piston.

In Europe, many manufacturers specify oil change intervals of up to 2 years and 30,000km (including many BMW and Porsche models). Modern synthetic oils don’t oxidize to the extent conventional oils do.

[SloppySquid]

Originally Posted by aerobod

I normally leave a couple of cars with synthetic oil in them over the winter with no issues. As long as the engine was given a good run before storing the car to evaporate any moisture in the oil, it shouldn’t be a problem.

I rebuilt the engine in my Caterham last winter due to a dropped valve from a fractured valve spring, it had been stored over winter for 11 years with the previous year’s oil in it after hard track use. All bearing surfaces, bores, cam, oil pump and oil sump were spotless, other than the valve impact damage.

In Europe, many manufacturers specify oil change intervals of up to 2 years and 30,000km (including many BMW and Porsche models). Modern synthetic oils don’t oxidize like conventional oils.

Ah I see, someone said that I should start my car every 2 weeks and let it run?
Is that advised .

I know for motorcycles in winter storing is NOT to turn on the bike at all. Idk about cars

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by SloppySquid

Ah I see, someone said that I should start my car every 2 weeks and let it run?
Is that advised .

I know for motorcycles in winter storing is NOT to turn on the bike at all. Idk about cars

Starting the engine without giving the car a run to fully warm it is a bad idea, as idling won’t warm the transmission or fully evaporate moisture from the cold start, no different than motorcycle storage. Putting the battery on a good quality maintainer such as from CTEK, inflating the tyres to a higher pressure (below the max value on the sidewall) and storing it in a dry garage if possible are all that is needed. Some people add fuel stabilizer, but I just ensure I fill it with fresh fuel in the spring.

[JABCAT]

There's no issue with the current oil & the car being stored for the winter. My supercharged Z06 sees less than 1k mi per year & I change the oil annually. Store your car, take it out in Spring & drive it the 4k km until your next oil change. You have nothing to worry about

[wjones14]

You're going to get a lot of different opinions here obviously. I would say to look outside the forum for research, because the storage recommendations for an M2 are going to be the same for most any car. I stored an M235i and then a Camaro for 6 straight winters, November to April. I've been storing my motorcycle every year since 2011. I read a lot of "best practice" recommendations, and they always end up with the same things:

1. Once you park it for the winter, leave it. It will be fine. If you feel you MUST start it, then drive it at least until the oil is up to temperature.

2. Battery tender.

3. Mouse protection. Traps under the car. Dryer sheets stuffed in the tailpipes.

4. Use a good quality, breathable protective cover.

5. Overinflate the tires to avoid flat spots. Probably 40 lbs. at least.

6. Full tank of gas and mix some fuel stabilizer like STA-BIL in. Drive it after putting the stabilizer in to distribute it in the injectors and fuel lines.

As far as the oil change, if you're only doing one change per year, it makes sense (to me) to time the change before storing it, so you don't have a lot of contaminants settling. I always change the motorcycle oil prior to putting it away. Same with the cars I stored. I guess as long as the oil isn't super dirty, it should be okay.

[techwhiz1]

Originally Posted by wjones14

You're going to get a lot of different opinions here obviously. I would say to look outside the forum for research, because the storage recommendations for an M2 are going to be the same for most any car. I stored an M235i and then a Camaro for 6 straight winters, November to April. I've been storing my motorcycle every year since 2011. I read a lot of "best practice" recommendations, and they always end up with the same things:

1. Once you park it for the winter, leave it. It will be fine. If you feel you MUST start it, then drive it at least until the oil is up to temperature.

2. Battery tender.

3. Mouse protection. Traps under the car. Dryer sheets stuffed in the tailpipes.

4. Use a good quality, breathable protective cover.

5. Overinflate the tires to avoid flat spots. Probably 40 lbs. at least.

6. Full tank of gas and mix some fuel stabilizer like STA-BIL in. Drive it after putting the stabilizer in to distribute it in the injectors and fuel lines.

As far as the oil change, if you're only doing one change per year, it makes sense (to me) to time the change before storing it, so you don't have a lot of contaminants settling. I always change the motorcycle oil prior to putting it away. Same with the cars I stored. I guess as long as the oil isn't super dirty, it should be okay.

I would agree to all this but would do the oil immediately after the storage.

The oil that's on there is fine for storage. It will age, yes. If you change immediately after storage you have fresh oil and not oil that say in the pan.

But this is just opinion with no real science behind it. YMMV

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by SloppySquid

Need help/advice!

In 2 weeks l'm going to put my car in storage so just wanted to see what to do with the oil. I'm at 13,000km and my last oil change was at the first break in at 8,000km. * next oil change due roughly in 4,000 km*

Should I change the oil before i store it for winter, then change it when winter is done?
Or
Should I let the oil sit and just wait till next year.

I called my 2 local dealerships, one of the service advisors said with the new synthetic oil in these modern cars it wouldn't harm the car to let the oil sit and just change it next year when l'm due for my required oil change.

I don't know why new cars have the oil change intervals are so far apart from each other

***if I do an early oil change I will have to pay out of pocket which I got 2 prices $300-$400. ***
Thank you!!!

My advice -- and what I would do if I stored cars over the winter -- is arrange to have the oil/filter service done before putting the car away for the winter.

(While I don't store cars over the winter I drive them less. Before winter arrives I have the oil/filter changed. For example my M2 will go in for its winter oil/filter service early in November (it is now October 22). It just so happens the CBS service will be due next April. So the engine gets fresh oil for the winter driving season and fresh oil for the summer driving season. Oh, I drive the car on average around 550 miles per month. Car was 18 months old October 14 and currently has just a few miles over 10,000 miles on its odometer.)

Of course you pay for this out of schedule oil/filter service out of pocket. (I don't know where you are but in Benton County AR where I live the last out of schedule oil/filter service for my M2 -- done at the local BMW dealer -- cost me just under $200.)

With an out of schedule service what I do and what you should do is request the CBS system not be reset. I only have that reset when I have the car in for a CBS flagged service.

Over winter run the engine or not? An argument can be made to not run the engine. But an argument can be made to run for running the engine (and A/C system) every so often.

Running the engine circulates oil which exposes the seals to the fresh oil which helps prolong seal life. It also circulates coolant which helps prolong water pump seal life and hose life. And running the A/C has the compressor circulating refrigerant and compressor oil which helps with /A/C seal/o-ring life.

Yes the engine, the engine oil, will almost certainly not get up to operating temperature (212F) so the oil will accumulate bit of water.

But with fresh oil there are no contaminates to combine with the bit of water and form acids.

And come spring one treats the car to a nice long drive and the engine gets up to temperature and the water is removed from the oil.

Or believe it not my preference would be to change the oil/filter upon taking the car out of storage so the engine has fresh oil for the summer driving season.

Overkill? Maybe. But maybe not. An ounce of prevention...

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

With an out of schedule service what I do and what you should do is request the CBS system not be reset. I only have that reset when I have the car in for a CBS flagged service.

No offense intended, but this doesn't make sense. The CBS system functions on time as well as mileage. What purpose does it serve not resetting the system?

[beren]

Agree that if you start it drive it up to temp fully.

[fangelov]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

No offense intended, but this doesn't make sense. The CBS system functions on time as well as mileage. What purpose does it serve not resetting the system?

One reason would be to have the dealer do the included oil changes every 10k miles/one year. If you reset it, they might not want to do it for 10k miles/1 year after.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by fangelov

One reason would be to have the dealer do the included oil changes every 10k miles/one year. If you reset it, they might not want to do it for 10k miles/1 year after.

Yes.

Any out of phase oil/filter services I have done, and pay for out of pocket, are not intended to satisfy all of the servicing that is due when the CBS system flags a service.

[Christian_M387]

The reason why you change the oil before winterizing is as follows: Oil has a certain ability to absorb dirt; these are normally kept floating. If you park the vehicle with old oil, the abrasion/impurities will settle at the bottom of the pan over a longer period of time. In the spring they would then put the stale soup (slightly exaggerated) through the engine.

Starting the engine in winter doesn't make much sense. You introduce more fuel into the oil through the cold start than it would protect in any way. The oil sticks to the seals anyway, at least for such a period of time.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Christian_M387

The reason why you change the oil before winterizing is as follows: Oil has a certain ability to absorb dirt; these are normally kept floating. If you park the vehicle with old oil, the abrasion/impurities will settle at the bottom of the pan over a longer period of time. In the spring they would then put the stale soup (slightly exaggerated) through the engine.

Starting the engine in winter doesn't make much sense. You introduce more fuel into the oil through the cold start than it would protect in any way. The oil sticks to the seals anyway, at least for such a period of time.

There are additives in the oil which glom on to particulate matter and help the filter remove this from the oil. This in part has helped pretty much eliminate sludge formation as a problem.

The bigger problem is parking the car with old oil in the engine is the old oil likely had some acid content. This attacks any seals/o-rings and other soft materials it comes into contact with, remains in contact with.

Changing the oil of course removes the acidic old oil and replaces it with fresh oil with a full/fresh additive package.

The problem with the seals is while the car is put away and the engine not run the oil doesn't flow over the seals. The PAO based oil is not real seal friendly. Ester is added to the oil to counter this. But for the ester to protect the seals the oil needs to circulate periodically.

Upon a cold start a bit of fuel may get in the oil. But even though the oil doesn't get fully up to temperature it gets hot enough and the crankcase is under low pressure that the fuel vaporizes and is removed from the oil.

Water is a different story. The oil needs to get hotter to vaporize the water. I like to see 212F oil. That the crankcase is under low pressure means the water will surely vaporize at a lower temperature than 212F but even so one can't count on it all being removed.

Still the engine starts out with fresh and water free oil. The build up of water in the oil will be small. We're not talking about one or two cold starts a day -- work commute for instance -- but a cold start every say 4 weeks.

[aerobod]

For reference on what an engine that had over 10,000km of hard track use and 30,000km of spirited road driving looks like after 11 years of being stored over winter with the previous season's synthetic oil in it, here are some photos.

Bear in mind that a valve spring underwent a fatigue failure and dropped a valve in to #1 cylinder at 7,500RPM, so the scoring and damage in the bore photo is due to that, but otherwise the engine is very clean and corrosion-free, as these photos are during the failure investigation with no cleaning of the components done.

[Christian_M387]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

There are additives in the oil which glom on to particulate matter and help the filter remove this from the oil. This in part has helped pretty much eliminate sludge formation as a problem.

The bigger problem is parking the car with old oil in the engine is the old oil likely had some acid content. This attacks any seals/o-rings and other soft materials it comes into contact with, remains in contact with.

Changing the oil of course removes the acidic old oil and replaces it with fresh oil with a full/fresh additive package.

The problem with the seals is while the car is put away and the engine not run the oil doesn't flow over the seals. The PAO based oil is not real seal friendly. Ester is added to the oil to counter this. But for the ester to protect the seals the oil needs to circulate periodically.

Upon a cold start a bit of fuel may get in the oil. But even though the oil doesn't get fully up to temperature it gets hot enough and the crankcase is under low pressure that the fuel vaporizes and is removed from the oil.

Water is a different story. The oil needs to get hotter to vaporize the water. I like to see 212F oil. That the crankcase is under low pressure means the water will surely vaporize at a lower temperature than 212F but even so one can't count on it all being removed.

Still the engine starts out with fresh and water free oil. The build up of water in the oil will be small. We're not talking about one or two cold starts a day -- work commute for instance -- but a cold start every say 4 weeks.

Yes, I mostly agree. Although POE oils are often used in our area and this element of sealing compatibility no longer really applies. I am still of the opinion that it makes more sense to winterize the vehicle with fresh oil without starting it again every now and then.

Since you haven't taken a crucial factor into account, every start puts more strain on the engine's components, especially after a longer period of time when the oil has expired and no longer reaches the important components immediately.

This will certainly not lead to failure, but this wear and tear can be avoided. And I hardly believe that anyone here preheats the oil.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Christian_M387

Yes, I mostly agree. Although POE oils are often used in our area and this element of sealing compatibility no longer really applies. I am still of the opinion that it makes more sense to winterize the vehicle with fresh oil without starting it again every now and then.

Since you haven't taken a crucial factor into account, every start puts more strain on the engine's components, especially after a longer period of time when the oil has expired and no longer reaches the important components immediately.

This will certainly not lead to failure, but this wear and tear can be avoided. And I hardly believe that anyone here preheats the oil.

Far and away most passenger vehicles don't sit that long between uses. So cold starts are pretty much benign.

(Drove a number of cars to 150K miles and one car to 317K miles. I can't even estimate how many cold starts those engines experienced but the engines were still fine at 150K miles and even after 317K miles.)

There is some reason to worry about a start up after a prolonged period of no use. By prolonged period I'm talking months.

Still even with a prolonged period of no use a good quantity of oil remains in the bearings/oil galleys/etc. Upon cold start the engine is rev'd up which ensures a fast prime of the oil pump and quick flow of oil. The quick rise in RPMs at cold start also results in the formation of a film of oil that prevents metal to metal contact at the main/rod/cam bearings. The quick oil flow then arrives in time. Additionally quick flow of cold oil is helped by the presence of 0w-30 oil.

But periodic starting of an engine during its off season storage circulates oil and adds extra insurance all the critical bearings have an adequate supply of oil present for the next start.

In real cold climes some auto makers provide support for an engine heater. I would not keep an engine heater on for all of the time the car was stored but would turn it on a day or so before I planned on starting the engine.

Have to add I'm glad (and I guess in some ways fortunate) that I don't have to put my M2 away for the winter. Far and away regular use -- in my case every several days -- is best/better than less use or even no use for weeks or months.