Indy recommends against coolant flush

Yoksel · 07-29-2014, 09:34 PM

Did a number of maintenance services recently on my 2010 328xi that just hit 60K. One of the services on the list was coolant flush. A very reputable indy in Seattle area recommended against it. Their opinion is that changing coolant at this time/mileage may provoke water pump failure. They're saying I should expect water pump to break around 80K and at that time I'll be able to replace it along with thermostat and coolant. What do you guys think? I certainly don't want to provoke a water pump failure but at the same time I think the 80K on average for the last production year of e90 seems very low estimate. I was expecting around 150K. Should I still go ahead and replace coolant?

cdaniel525 · 07-29-2014, 09:44 PM

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e92_enthusiast_1 · 07-29-2014, 09:45 PM

Interesting theory. 80k does seem low. Depends how much you drive on average though.

Yoksel · 07-29-2014, 09:47 PM

I think they had previous experience like this including one car where the pump failed to start right after coolant flush. The car likely was another E90 but I doubt it was 2010. They told me something about speed deviation but I'm not really sure I absorbed it right.

chromisdesigns · 07-29-2014, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoksel

Did a number of maintenance services recently on my 2010 328xi that just hit 60K. One of the services on the list was coolant flush. A very reputable indy in Seattle area recommended against it. Their opinion is that changing coolant at this time/mileage may provoke water pump failure. They're saying I should expect water pump to break around 80K and at that time I'll be able to replace it along with thermostat and coolant. What do you guys think? I certainly don't want to provoke a water pump failure but at the same time I think the 80K on average for the last production year of e90 seems very low estimate. I was expecting around 150K. Should I still go ahead and replace coolant?

A lot of them have failed already by 80K. so much that many mechanics think you should replace it then proactively. The pump in our '08 335i just bit it at 68K...not at all unusual.

However, I can't imagine why coolant flush/fill would affect the pump at all.

Miller335 · 07-29-2014, 11:10 PM

Sounds like the good old "dont replace the ATF in an old AT with old fluid".

There could be some wisdom in all of this but it wouldnt stop me from replacing the fluid in any case. If it was on its last leg it was on its last leg either way.

I'm going to continue to move forward with the maintenance with my car myths be damned.

Yoksel · 07-29-2014, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miller335

Sounds like the good old "dont replace the ATF in an old AT with old fluid".

We did ATF, differentials, transfer case - none of them caused their concern besides coolant. So it's not just the "don't fix if ain't broken" approach.

M335Xi · 07-29-2014, 11:37 PM

Stupid theory, even at 95k my pump never failed. Only reason I replaced it was my thermostat stayed stuck open and I figured since I was in that area I would replace the pump also.

Efthreeoh · 07-30-2014, 02:18 AM

Coolant age has nothing to do with pump failure. Pumps primarily fail due to aged electronics.

VTECaddict · 07-30-2014, 03:54 AM

My water pump failed at around 85k. Coolant flush wont cause it to fail as the failure is due to electronics like Efthreeoh said. But with impending failure, might as well hold out until the pump fails to change out the coolant. Or proactively change the pump along with the new fluid.

The Cleaner · 07-30-2014, 10:30 AM

Find another shop.

Saintor · 07-30-2014, 10:35 AM

How long do you intend to keep the car?

His argumentation is not bad. I would wait 2 more years at least and then possibly do the job.

In the mean time check BMW codes regularly, looking for anything related to the coolant pump speed. Some people here reported that codes were raised many months in advance.

Avenged328i · 07-30-2014, 10:37 AM

My pump went out at 90k.
But I think no matter what you do, it's still going to go out anyway.
I think you should just wait for your pump to go out.

BMW cannot seem to get it right, since they are on their 3rd revision on this already, I think.

E90Graphite07 · 07-30-2014, 10:46 AM

That's BS... I haven't replaced my TS/WP just yet... at 117K miles on the clock right now. Still going strong. It's gone through two coolant flushes for its lifespan thus far. 07 E90 N54.

Delta0311 · 07-30-2014, 10:50 AM

That's misinformation, I replaced my coolant on my old N52 at 75k miles and drove the car to 94k before training it in. Car had no issues with the water pump after the flush and fill. Water pump failures are electrical and have nothing to do with the coolant; unless of course the coolant is seriously dirty and has contaminants in it. But then again this is exactly why you are doing a coolant flush in the first place.

kiel_dafo_kenyg_as · 07-30-2014, 11:16 AM

On my bimmers the waterpump issues always happened at pretty exactly 148.000 km which would equal 90k miles.
In my opinion it's worth to think about it what the service man suggests.

ctuna · 07-30-2014, 01:19 PM

The main reason to change it is to prevent corrosion and get the contaminants
out. Which would hasten cooling system failure.
My INdy is saying 4 years or mileage.

Fortyb · 07-30-2014, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E90Graphite07

That's BS... I haven't replaced my TS/WP just yet... at 117K miles on the clock right now. Still going strong. It's gone through two coolant flushes for its lifespan thus far. 07 E90 N54.

+1 BS

XM_Rocks · 07-30-2014, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Cleaner

Find another shop.

^ this

hassmaschine · 07-30-2014, 03:58 PM

I don't get the hoopla over a waterpump that lasts 100k miles. yeah, they're expensive. but water pumps are wear items, they don't last forever - most cars these days probably last around 100k on a pump. on older BMWs it was more like 50k.

also, if you beat on your car the pump will run more and therefore wear faster. it's not surprising that the turbo cars might go through pumps a bit faster than N/A cars.

Don N. · 07-30-2014, 05:08 PM

I can understand the theory behind people not changing trans fluid, but this one doesn't make sense.

I'd change it out. Coolant + distilled water isn't much money. That is of course if you're not doing the coolant flush yourself, then I suppose it could be more costly.

-Don

rick100 · 07-30-2014, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoksel

Did a number of maintenance services recently on my 2010 328xi that just hit 60K. One of the services on the list was coolant flush. A very reputable indy in Seattle area recommended against it. Their opinion is that changing coolant at this time/mileage may provoke water pump failure. They're saying I should expect water pump to break around 80K and at that time I'll be able to replace it along with thermostat and coolant. What do you guys think? I certainly don't want to provoke a water pump failure but at the same time I think the 80K on average for the last production year of e90 seems very low estimate. I was expecting around 150K. Should I still go ahead and replace coolant?

As far as I know coolant replacement is mostly to prevent corrosion and it has nothing to do with pump failure.

I think it was probably a coincidence the shop had a water pump failure after replacing the fluid or they somehow messed it up when flushing the coolant and the pump failed after. I can even go as far as saying one of their mechanics did not tight something right and it was leaking which may have let to a pump failure , he probably blame the water pump.

I can understand the shop recommending not to changing the fluid if the car was new and low mileage

07-29-2014, 09:34 PM	#1
Yoksel Enlisted Member 13 Rep 41 Posts Drives: 2010 328i xDrive, 2021 X3 Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Sarasota, FL iTrader: (0)	Indy recommends against coolant flush Did a number of maintenance services recently on my 2010 328xi that just hit 60K. One of the services on the list was coolant flush. A very reputable indy in Seattle area recommended against it. Their opinion is that changing coolant at this time/mileage may provoke water pump failure. They're saying I should expect water pump to break around 80K and at that time I'll be able to replace it along with thermostat and coolant. What do you guys think? I certainly don't want to provoke a water pump failure but at the same time I think the 80K on average for the last production year of e90 seems very low estimate. I was expecting around 150K. Should I still go ahead and replace coolant?
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07-29-2014, 09:44 PM	#2
cdaniel525 Private 11 Rep 78 Posts Drives: 2011 335i xDrive Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Toms River, NJ iTrader: (0)	Subscribing*
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07-29-2014, 09:45 PM	#3
e92_enthusiast_1 Lieutenant Colonel 35 Rep 1,652 Posts Drives: '10 AW/CR e92 6mt 335i Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Chandler, AZ iTrader: (1) Garage List 2010 BMW 335i [0.00]	Interesting theory. 80k does seem low. Depends how much you drive on average though. __________________ COBB AP Stg 2+ FMIC Aggressive \| VRSF 3" Catless DP \| COBB FMIC \| BMS DCI \| CP-e Metal Charge Pipe \| 370+ whp/435+ lb.ft torque
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07-29-2014, 09:47 PM	#4
Yoksel Enlisted Member 13 Rep 41 Posts Drives: 2010 328i xDrive, 2021 X3 Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Sarasota, FL iTrader: (0)	I think they had previous experience like this including one car where the pump failed to start right after coolant flush. The car likely was another E90 but I doubt it was 2010. They told me something about speed deviation but I'm not really sure I absorbed it right.
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07-29-2014, 11:10 PM	#6
Miller335 Colonel 291 Rep 2,189 Posts Drives: 2007 E92 Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Portland, OR iTrader: (0)	Sounds like the good old "dont replace the ATF in an old AT with old fluid". There could be some wisdom in all of this but it wouldnt stop me from replacing the fluid in any case. If it was on its last leg it was on its last leg either way. I'm going to continue to move forward with the maintenance with my car myths be damned.
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07-29-2014, 11:37 PM	#8
M335Xi Private First Class 19 Rep 128 Posts Drives: 2007 335i e92 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Vestal, NY iTrader: (0)	Stupid theory, even at 95k my pump never failed. Only reason I replaced it was my thermostat stayed stuck open and I figured since I was in that area I would replace the pump also.
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07-30-2014, 02:18 AM	#9
Efthreeoh General 17428 Rep 18,801 Posts Drives: The E90 + Z4 Coupe & Z3 R'ster Join Date: May 2012 Location: Virginia iTrader: (0)	Coolant age has nothing to do with pump failure. Pumps primarily fail due to aged electronics.
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07-30-2014, 03:54 AM	#10
VTECaddict Where'd my VTEC go? 481 Rep 6,067 Posts Drives: 06 330i 6MT Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Seattle, WA iTrader: (4)	My water pump failed at around 85k. Coolant flush wont cause it to fail as the failure is due to electronics like Efthreeoh said. But with impending failure, might as well hold out until the pump fails to change out the coolant. Or proactively change the pump along with the new fluid. __________________ AW/Terra \| ZSP \| ZPP \| ZCW \| iDrive \| CA Mods: BC BR coilovers \| Blacklines \| M-tech rear \| dual exhaust \| M3 steering wheel \| BMW SSK \| ZHP shift knob \| High-kick CF spoiler \| NBT Retrofit M3 front control arms \| M3 rear guide rods \| Manzo rear toe and camber links \| Monroe rear shock mounts \| Varrstoen ES1 19x9.5+20 Front, 19x11+25 rear
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07-30-2014, 10:30 AM	#11
The Cleaner Thats all you need to know. 43 Rep 1,188 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 , 2016 X5 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Nor Cal iTrader: (2)	Find another shop. __________________ - M2 2018 LBB / Black - X5 F15 2016 Mineral White / Black 1981 Delorean number 6489
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07-30-2014, 10:35 AM	#12
Saintor Banned 82 Rep 2,446 Posts Drives: E90 Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: MTL, Canada iTrader: (1)	How long do you intend to keep the car? His argumentation is not bad. I would wait 2 more years at least and then possibly do the job. In the mean time check BMW codes regularly, looking for anything related to the coolant pump speed. Some people here reported that codes were raised many months in advance. Last edited by Saintor; 07-30-2014 at 10:41 AM..
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07-30-2014, 10:37 AM	#13
Avenged328i First Lieutenant 27 Rep 313 Posts Drives: 14 328i Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: CA iTrader: (0)	My pump went out at 90k. But I think no matter what you do, it's still going to go out anyway. I think you should just wait for your pump to go out. BMW cannot seem to get it right, since they are on their 3rd revision on this already, I think.
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07-30-2014, 10:46 AM	#14
E90Graphite07 Lieutenant 104 Rep 596 Posts Drives: 07 E90 335i Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Texas iTrader: (0)	That's BS... I haven't replaced my TS/WP just yet... at 117K miles on the clock right now. Still going strong. It's gone through two coolant flushes for its lifespan thus far. 07 E90 N54. __________________ 2007 BMW 335i, 2014 Audi A4, 2016 Acura MDX Join us on Facebook: E90Post - Houston Houston BMW DIY Services
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07-30-2014, 10:50 AM	#15
Delta0311 Banned 7478 Rep 10,120 Posts Drives: 2011 BMW 335xi E92 2016 228xi Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: NJ iTrader: (1)	That's misinformation, I replaced my coolant on my old N52 at 75k miles and drove the car to 94k before training it in. Car had no issues with the water pump after the flush and fill. Water pump failures are electrical and have nothing to do with the coolant; unless of course the coolant is seriously dirty and has contaminants in it. But then again this is exactly why you are doing a coolant flush in the first place.
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07-30-2014, 11:16 AM	#16
kiel_dafo_kenyg_as DIE ANTWOORD 68 Rep 640 Posts Drives: 335d E92 Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Bimmer's home - Bavaria iTrader: (0)	On my bimmers the waterpump issues always happened at pretty exactly 148.000 km which would equal 90k miles. In my opinion it's worth to think about it what the service man suggests.
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07-30-2014, 01:19 PM	#17
ctuna Lieutenant General 1921 Rep 13,122 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	The main reason to change it is to prevent corrosion. The main reason to change it is to prevent corrosion and get the contaminants out. Which would hasten cooling system failure. My INdy is saying 4 years or mileage. Last edited by ctuna; 07-30-2014 at 08:09 PM..
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07-30-2014, 03:58 PM	#20
hassmaschine Major General 3975 Rep 7,215 Posts Drives: "NBO" 330i Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: earth iTrader: (0)	I don't get the hoopla over a waterpump that lasts 100k miles. yeah, they're expensive. but water pumps are wear items, they don't last forever - most cars these days probably last around 100k on a pump. on older BMWs it was more like 50k. also, if you beat on your car the pump will run more and therefore wear faster. it's not surprising that the turbo cars might go through pumps a bit faster than N/A cars. Last edited by hassmaschine; 07-30-2014 at 04:12 PM..
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07-30-2014, 05:08 PM	#21
Don N. Brigadier General 183 Rep 3,393 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: May 2014 Location: Irvine, CA iTrader: (1)	I can understand the theory behind people not changing trans fluid, but this one doesn't make sense. I'd change it out. Coolant + distilled water isn't much money. That is of course if you're not doing the coolant flush yourself, then I suppose it could be more costly. -Don
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