[Rag9000]

When you’re in manual mode- say 5th gear- and you come to a stop, do you cycle through each gear on the way down to 1 as you slowdown? Or do you let the car manually downshift for you? I would imagine that in a manual car (which I don’t know how to drive) you would disengage the clutch until you come to a stop, and then go from 5th right to 1st, but paddle shifting is sequential only. Sorry for the dumb question, I’ve never owned a car like this before.

[Invisiblename]

In a fully manual car, you don’t push the clutch in and coast, you progressively downshift so that you are in the correct gear at any speed. In this car, it’s totally up to you because if you don’t downshift, the car will.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Rag9000

When you’re in manual mode- say 5th gear- and you come to a stop, do you cycle through each gear on the way down to 1 as you slowdown? Or do you let the car manually downshift for you? I would imagine that in a manual car (which I don’t know how to drive) you would disengage the clutch until you come to a stop, and then go from 5th right to 1st, but paddle shifting is sequential only. Sorry for the dumb question, I’ve never owned a car like this before.

While you can cycle down through each gear as you approach a stop -- either driving a manual or an automatic -- I don't do that with my manual or auto equipped cars.

With a manual car just lifting off the gas pedal the engine braking slows the car considerably. I allow the coasting to continue -- traffic and other conditions permitting -- until engine RPMs get to around 1K then shift into neutral and then use the brakes to bring the car to a stop.

This really prolongs brake life and doesn't subject the transmission and clutch to unnecessary wear and tear. And the saying is brakes is cheaper than clutch and synchros...

With an automatic transmission while I may have been using the paddles or using the shift lever in manual shift mode as I roll up to a stop I let the transmission downshift. Now it does go down through every gear. But it does so at a pretty low engine RPMs so any wear and tear on the transmission is as low as it can be.

But with some automatics there is some rev matching taking place so the rotational speeds of the driving and driven clutch discs are close before the clutch is engaged. And I've not driven a BMW with a manual but I seem to recall my 2018 MINI JCW its 6-speed had rev matching on down shifts and in sport mode even had rev matching on up shifts.

The downside unless one allows for this reduced engine braking by beginning the coast down phase of approaching a stop earlier is the vehicle slows less and ultimately the braking will come from the use of of the brakes.

Now while we are in an BMW forum my new 2023 MINI Cooper S came with a 7-speed Sport Dual Clutch transmission. I have no previous experience with these dual clutch transmissions. This transmission has no torque converter. I have not yet spent enough time in the car to note how this transmission may be different from an auto fitted with a torque converter and may be more like a manual transmission.

But with my 230i and its auto with a torque converter engine braking is quite a bit less, all other things being equal. As a result the brakes get used more.

Have not put but around 6K miles on my 230i but the brakes do not show signs of much wear.

About the only time I will use the -paddle is to downshift for a pass rather than slam the pedal to the floor to get the automatic to kick down. I used the traditional method once in the Hellcat and even at some speed the rear tires broke loose. So I had to remember to cool my jets.

Or I'll use the -paddle in real mountainous terrain to slow the car. However, I note on my drive to and from CA in my M-B van with cruise control active if the van picked up speed going down a hill the cruise control system would apply the brakes.

While I have driven my 230i in some mountainous terrain -- to and from Colorado Springs -- I don't recall encountering as steep downgrades that had the car gaining speed.

All that being said you can of course drive the car however you want.

[HotsauzF82]

If you ever drive the vehicle in Eco-Pro Individual mode, you can check the COASTING option, and it will indeed when you let off the throttle "coast" until there's an uphill portion where it may end up downshifting, if that even makes sense, since the car is "technically coasting" from my own experience at least.

I do use it quite often during my work commute since living in the somewhat country there's a lot of up and down hills. It also helps with keeping the MPG's up, even if it is just small bit.

[XC3LLR8]

I will usually downshift until I get to 2nd and let the car put me in 1st when it comes to a stop. I like the feel and the sound of the downshifts.

[Rag9000]

Thanks guys- seems like it’s however you want to do it. I’ve noticed that the last shift down to first is the jerkiest if you don’t wait until the bitter end. I’ve also been letting the car do that one. I can’t stop using the paddles though… it’s way more fun

[emcee1011]

The old rule of never downshift into first still goes strong

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by Rag9000

Thanks guys- seems like it's however you want to do it. I've noticed that the last shift down to first is the jerkiest if you don't wait until the bitter end. I've also been letting the car do that one. I can't stop using the paddles though… it's way more fun

Install the MadTrace magnetic shifters - it's like playing a video game.

[ryo-]

I didn't know it auto downshifts in manual mode when coming to a stop... I've been doing it every time myself lol. learned something new.

[Rag9000]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

Install the MadTrace magnetic shifters - it's like playing a video game.

They're cool but they seem really expensive for what I assume is a minor change in feel? I do see they extend higher and lower which is probably nice when turning the wheel. I like to punch it out of corners and I hit a lot of roundabouts where it's a bit annoying trying to reach the paddle with the wheel turned.

[Coconut]

The JQ Werks/Madtrace Magnetic paddles shifters are a huge upgrade from stock. It is pricey but remember you're getting a full paddle shifter assembly and not just the paddles themselves.

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by Rag9000

They're cool but they seem really expensive for what I assume is a minor change in feel? I do see they extend higher and lower which is probably nice when turning the wheel. I like to punch it out of corners and I hit a lot of roundabouts where it's a bit annoying trying to reach the paddle with the wheel turned.

I can see your point, but I promise it's not a "minor" change in feel.

[PP3121]

For less experienced manual drivers, such as myself, doesn't the car indicate when to shift? Have not tried manual mode, yet.

My only experience driving a manual is with a Ram3500 extended cab 4x4 while working a summer with the Forest Service in Northern Cali. I think the 240i is a bit different.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by emcee1011

The old rule of never downshift into first still goes strong

Not while moving. As the car slows enough then I shift into neutral.
Then I bring the car to a stop. When the light is about to turn green I'll then shift into 1st gear.

[RockCrusher]

Curious I "tested" my 230i yesterday and while manually downshifting (or upshifting) is smooth -- it is clear there is rev matching going on -- the engine braking just doesn't feel all that much. 'course, my previous car with a 6.4l engine, engine braking was like dropping anchor. Well, pretty near the same.

Later likewise in my MINI with its 7-speed Sport dual clutch transmission manual shifts in either direction and at various engine speeds were smooth but the engine braking was nothing to write home about.

I believe at least with the MINI and the dual clutches the drive train pretty much matches that of a car equipped with a manual transmission. So I'm at a loss to understand the seemingly low level of engine braking.

[Rag9000]

Originally Posted by PP3121

For less experienced manual drivers, such as myself, doesn't the car indicate when to shift? Have not tried manual mode, yet.

My only experience driving a manual is with a Ram3500 extended cab 4x4 while working a summer with the Forest Service in Northern Cali. I think the 240i is a bit different.

I have no experience driving a manual but you can just look at the RPMs or do so based on the sound of the engine. If you just start doing it you’ll figure it out quickly like i did. The automatic in sport mode keeps RPMs around 2k… I hang around there generally when cruising- maybe less if I’m driving more conservatively and higher if I’m doing pulls/screwing around. If you jam down on the accelerator the car does display a green light in the dash which turns to a red light when RPMs near the redline.

[XC3LLR8]

The car will not let you do a mechanical over-rev like you can do in a manual (going from 3rd to 2nd instead of 4th).

You can also hold the left paddle down for a couple seconds and it will automatically assign the lowest gear possible.

[danallxt]

Originally Posted by emcee1011

The old rule of never downshift into first still goes strong

not a bad idea but i would question "never" if you know what you are doing.
It also depends upon the transmission and the ratio separation from first to second.
Most modern trannys now do have a synchromesh first (many older ones didn't hence the "never"). The synchromesh purpose is to bridge this gap between 2nd and 1st, problem is many trannys have a large gap or rather gear ratio gap between the 1st and 2nd (usually much larger the the ratio split of the other gears). This makes the job of the synchro much harder. Problem is most people do not rev-match enough (high enough rpm) to enable a closer match of the input shaft and output shaft to help "bridge" that gap. Other gear downshifts don't usually require too much throttle blipping, 2nd to 1st requires more rpms to rev match.

I could downshift to first on the move easily with my manual GTI as long as i rev-matched sufficiently. Ain't gonna hurt nothin if you do it right.

[Rag9000]

Interesting- am I correct in assuming that these automatic transmissions with paddle shifters are basically programmed to not let you damage them? Like if you’re at 6500 rpm in 2nd it’s not going to let you downshift to 1st. Or if you redline for too long it will upshift automatically?

[emcee1011]

Originally Posted by danallxt

not a bad idea but i would question "never" if you know what you are doing.
It also depends upon the transmission and the ratio separation from first to second.
Most modern trannys now do have a synchromesh first (many older ones didn't hence the "never"). The synchromesh purpose is to bridge this gap between 2nd and 1st, problem is many trannys have a large gap or rather gear ratio gap between the 1st and 2nd (usually much larger the the ratio split of the other gears). This makes the job of the synchro much harder. Problem is most people do not rev-match enough (high enough rpm) to enable a closer match of the input shaft and output shaft to help "bridge" that gap. Other gear downshifts don't usually require too much throttle blipping, 2nd to 1st requires more rpms to rev match.

I could downshift to first on the move easily with my manual GTI as long as i rev-matched sufficiently. Ain't gonna hurt nothin if you do it right.

I was mostly joking since you can definitely downshift into first in an auto. You can also do whatever you want with a manual as long as the shifter lets you I personally avoided it in my manuals since it was never really necessary. Also the MT82 6 speed in both of my mustangs were kinda crap.

[danallxt]

yes, i was addressing manuals only, it can be difficult with some manuals, but proper rev matching is essential.

[rad_thundercat]

This 230i is my first automatic and the constant jostling between gears at lower speeds is really annoying. But I recently discovered if you push the shifter to the left it engages a mode that will automatically shift when coming to a stop so it doesn’t stall but will otherwise hold the gear without slipping back into D mode while driving.

This really helps it feel like a manual keeping it around M3 through city streets shifting between M2 and M4 as needed. When coming to a stop I just let the software handle the shifting, it’s kinda nice

Still getting used to it but it’s definitely a plus not dealing with a clutch in traffic during the grind