[slipinslidin]

I can’t believe the internet hasn’t been able to uncover where this extra 20hp on the 25’ model comes from. You guys are seriously letting me down. Maybe it’s the exact same mapping l, just with more accurate published numbers?

[chris719]

How would anyone know? Not a single production 2025 car has been built yet.

[Tag]

Same power output as the base G80/82 which is nothing more than engine tuning.

[BroDoze]

No big freakin’ secret, lol. Engine tuning.

[Ravenseal]

Engine tuning. The hardware is identical.

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by slipinslidin

I can’t believe the internet hasn’t been able to uncover where this extra 20hp on the 25’ model comes from. You guys are seriously letting me down. Maybe it’s the exact same mapping l, just with more accurate published numbers?

They have just extended the torque plateau revs at the top end from 5,870 to 6,130RPM (same as the base G80/82). With 550Nm at 5,870RPM, the engine is producing 338kW (453bjp) from those revs to 6,250RPM. With 550Nm at 6,130RPM, the engine is producing 353kW (473bhp) from those revs to 6,250RPM.

Really just a change in the boost maintaining the torque plateau for 260 more RPM.

[KC87ZB]

It's free from the universe

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by aerobod

They have just extended the torque plateau revs at the top end from 5,870 to 6,130RPM (same as the base G80/82). With 550Nm at 5,870RPM, the engine is producing 338kW (453bjp) from those revs to 6,250RPM. With 550Nm at 6,130RPM, the engine is producing 353kW (473bhp) from those revs to 6,250RPM.

Really just a change in the boost maintaining the torque plateau for 260 more RPM.

Do you have any idea of what BMW means when they say "improved throttle mapping for more responsiveness in the 2025 model"? When I read the release last week the improved engine performance was focused on two things: (1) 20 HP bump, and (2) more responsiveness from throttle mapping. Is that just marketing words?

[ToneM2]

Originally Posted by JMcLellan

Do you have any idea of what BMW means when they say "improved throttle mapping for more responsiveness in the 2025 model"? When I read the release last week the improved engine performance was focused on two things: (1) 20 HP bump, and (2) more responsiveness from throttle mapping. Is that just marketing words?

They mean your ancient G87's are worthless now, you might as well take them to the junkyard. The 25's are so much better and faster it has effectively rendered the old ones obsolete.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by ToneM2

They mean your ancient G87's are worthless now, you might as well take them to the junkyard. The 25's are so much better and faster it has effectively rendered the old ones obsolete.

I know, it's a pile of crap now with only 453 horses.......consumerism at it's finest I guess. I didn't think Germany was like the US in that way where they want us to just keep buying the next thing to keep the machine alive.

[Tag]

Originally Posted by JMcLellan

Do you have any idea of what BMW means when they say "improved throttle mapping for more responsiveness in the 2025 model"? When I read the release last week the improved engine performance was focused on two things: (1) 20 HP bump, and (2) more responsiveness from throttle mapping. Is that just marketing words?

It's just software tuning of the throttle response. I guess the best way to understand it is if you're in a BMW and have it in Comfort mode the throttle isn't as responsive as when it's in Sport+. That's all handled by tuning parameters. They have tuned the throttle for MY25 to be more responsive than it was on MY23-24 cars. Part of me wonders if they did that because of the Throttle House review.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by Tag

It's just software tuning of the throttle response. I guess the best way to understand it is if you're in a BMW and have it in Comfort mode the throttle isn't as responsive as when it's in Sport+. That's all handled by tuning parameters. They have retuned the throttle to be more responsive than it is on MY23-24 cars. Part of me wonders if they did that because of the Throttle House review.

Makes sense at a high level. My 6mt has some dead spots where it isn't very responsive so curious if that gets cleaned up. Plus, I think a lot of folks are coming from the B58 platform where the low end response & torque was more pronounced than the S58 in the G87 and maybe that feedback got to BMW. Can't have people liking the B58 more than the S58, right?

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by JMcLellan

Do you have any idea of what BMW means when they say "improved throttle mapping for more responsiveness in the 2025 model"? When I read the release last week the improved engine performance was focused on two things: (1) 20 HP bump, and (2) more responsiveness from throttle mapping. Is that just marketing words?

Most likely the throttle percentage opening for a given pedal movement in the first part of it's travel has been increased. The same can be achieved by just moving the pedal more, as 100% pedal movement still maps to the same maximum throttle opening and 0% to the same minimum.

[BroDoze]

M TwinPower Turbo inline 6-cylinder engine with extra output and torque.

As well as the power itself, the inimitable way in which the 6-cylinder engine delivers that power also plays a key role in the performance experience offered by the new BMW M2. The upgraded version of the engine preserves the linear power delivery, sustained into the upper reaches of the rev range, that is such a hallmark feature of M models. Its maximum torque is on tap across a wide rev band. With the standard 6-speed manual gearbox, peak torque remains 406 lb-ft between 2,650 and 6,130 rpm. When power is channelled via the 8-speed M Steptronic transmission with Drivelogic, a no-cost option, the figure rises to 443 lb-ft between 2,700 and 5,620 rpm. The engine produces its increased maximum output of 473 hp at 6,250 rpm, with revs topping out at 7,200 rpm.

To support the driver in getting the most out of the newfound power, advances have been made with the accelerator mapping and response in all the drive modes selectable via the M Setup menu. As a result, the new BMW M2 offers noticeably more rapid reactions to the driver’s requests for acceleration – both when specified with either the 8-speed M Steptronic transmission or the 6-speed manual gearbox.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by M2siast

You can't change low end response & torque with throttle mapping.

We don't know what the new throttle mapping is, but it is important to call out any changes in software tuning, and they are doing it in the marketing release. Not the end of the world, really. Every new car will have "improvements" over the previous one.

Ok. I'm not as in tune with year to year improvements on newer cars like this. I assumed that changes in engine power would happen with different model variants like going from a base to a competition model, or when there is a new generation of a model.

[Montaver]

They are probably just changing the throttle tip in on comfort, in reality there will be very little difference as your foot calibrates to it quickly anyway.

[ZPD]

They are just lying/understating less

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by M2siast

That's why they called it an LCI. They made changes to the car to give it more power and other things that made it different enough to say it's a "new" model. We normally associate those changes to be cosmetic in nature, and they will come as a 2nd LCI, when the looks get tired.

It happens frequently.
The M3/M4 got the same power change.

The 1-series got a new engine (N55 vs N54) with the same 300hp rating, but 1 turbo instead of 2, and different fuel injectors. A DCT that replaced an automatic slushbox.

The 340i had a B58 with 330hp, then they upped it to 378hp (same with the Supra and Z4 I believe). Perhaps with the M240i as well, in the previous generation. So on and so forth.

As I always say: the new iPhone has better cameras and processors than the old iPhone. Imagine if folks who get pissed or try to "retrofit" things tried to do the same with phones and computers.

We enjoy what we have until something compels us to replace it with the newer thing.
The F87 was skipped entirely for me, and the G87 was the one for me. Let's say there's an "H87", that may not be enough still for me, but maybe the "I87" will be the one to tickle my fancy...

It's business.

Got it. Coming from an F series M240i I am very familiar with the B58 going from 335HP up to 382HP with the g series M240i (I believe the that B58 is considered a 2nd gen version of that motor), but again that was a generation change not just year over year changes. Anyways, I'm out of steam on this topic. My only hope is that my dealer doesn't give me any crap when I put a piggyback tune on the car and get another 60 or so HP over stock while there are factory cars with the S58 pushing out more power.

[sikotic]

Originally Posted by slipinslidin

Maybe it’s the exact same mapping l, just with more accurate published numbers?

lol.. The new 2025 M2 makes more power. It's that simple. The only people who are struggling to understand this, are the ones that already bought their M2.

[BroDoze]

Originally Posted by sikotic

lol.. The new 2025 M2 makes more power. It's that simple. The only people who are struggling to understand this, are the ones that already bought their M2.

Exactly! Let the butthurt flow. Holy cow - it's embarrassing!

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by sikotic

lol.. The new 2025 M2 makes more power. It's that simple. The only people who are struggling to understand this, are the ones that already bought their M2.

I got my 2024 M2 this January. No struggling from me but I have been asking lots of questions on here because I am curious what is changing. That's really it and the car will be getting a piggyback tune this summer or next summer so it doesn't really matter. Perhaps it might matter for future resale purposes as I could see buyers likely to pay more the refreshed M2 vs the first 2 model years.

[apez]

I am not even using all the power that is already there as well as I could, so I don't really care. However, I am super excited to see some 25s get delivered in awesome new colors and maybe even get dynoed so we can put this to rest.

I mostly care that this current model and engine continues to sell well and the aftermarket industry flourishes.