[BarrySt]

Intereresting video comparing Michelin summer and winter tyres in 10 C temp on wet low friction track: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/w...-video-review/

My usual sumary:
winter: better for cornering
summer: better for stopping

Well worth a few mins to watch video

Rgds, Barry

And snow test: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/d...es-work-video/
- which is really ammusing: 6-series on summers immobile, 1-series on winters keeps moving. Not scientific but makes a strong point

[Subzero2003]

Well, let's start off by saying that the Michelin HP Primacy is not an Ultra High Performance tyre. If they wanted it to be fair, they should have used the best Michelin summer tyre (the Pilot Super Sport) against the best Michelin winter tyre.

Even so - the mediocre Primacy HP still trounced the winter tyre in stopping distances by over 7 metres! And let's face it - stopping distance is all that really matters in the winter - i don't care about how many G's i can pull around a corner.

[TMP]

Originally Posted by Subzero2003

Well, let's start off by saying that the Michelin HP Primacy is not an Ultra High Performance tyre. If they wanted it to be fair, they should have used the best Michelin summer tyre (the Pilot Super Sport) against the best Michelin winter tyre.

Even so - the mediocre Primacy HP still trounced the winter tyre in stopping distances by over 7 metres! And let's face it - stopping distance is all that really matters in the winter - i don't care about how many G's i can pull around a corner.

But this test isn't in winter temps...it's at 10c. They should repeat in a few weeks when it closer to freezing, be a good comparison then.

[Subzero2003]

Not sure if this has already been posted but this is quite interesting:

http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/wint...-tested/259257



Wet testing - The Continental Premium Contact 2 is the closest tyre there to being a proper UHP summer tyre. And in the wet, at 4c it stopped only FOUR METRES more than the BEST winter tyre tested. Now, assuming a proper, UHP tyre was tested such as the Goodyear Assymetric 2's or the Continetal Sport Contact 5P's, i have no doubt this gap would have been none existant.




Wet handling course - Now, in the wet handling course, at 5c, the Continental Premium Contact (which is only a mid range tyre remember) took the top spot. This gap would have been even bigger if a UHP had been used, such as those mentioned previously.




Dry testing at 5.5c - well, i don't think anything needs to be said. The best winter tyre took a staggering 7metres extra to stop over the midrange Continental Premium Contact 2 summer tyre. Remember, this would have been even more if a proper UHP was tested.

Aquaplaning test - they did an aquaplaning test too and guess what? The midrange CPC2 dry tyre got the exact same result as the best winter tyre tested.

I know, before anyone says it - what a sensationalistic article! From the way they've written it i would not be surprised if they received some kind of monetary reward from tyre manufacturers for this article. I mean, lol, did they get someone from the Daily Mail to write it!?:

Originally Posted by WhatCar

At an average of £500 for a set of winter tyres – plus storage costs during the summer if you don’t fancy the tyres eating up space in your garage – we recognise that they’re another hefty cost for Britain’s motorists. If you need them for only three or four months a year, though, you should get several seasons out of them.

Given the safety benefits, it’s a price worth paying. A set of winter tyres could be the difference between life and death this winter.

[magic77]

off topic they filmed this next to surrey rolling road in virgina water

[lovemybmw]

Hey, I do feel there is a bit missing from this test, well a friend of mine does anyway.

My friend who is a road traffic police officer and investigates many accidents, said that whilst the test is done in a controlled environment they cannot replicate conditions on the roads in changing weather conditions. The main one being where he finds that number of RTAs increase is where the temperature has plunged below 0 degrees and then risen to around 3-5 degrees however there is still ice on the roads in patches, it is in these condition a where winter tyres will have better performance and it is these conditions which tend to be the most dangerous. I.e you feel the road is just wet, have summer tyres on and forget that there may be icy patches and lose traction or do not slow down/drive slower.

Whilst the test is done at 5 degrees and the summers had better wet braking performance, 5degrees wet conditions during the winter is different to these controlled tests.

[LexS]

I think to anyone with the means to afford winter tyres its a no brainer. They offer a lot more confidence, and to me that's invaluable, especially if a loved one is even one iota safer and more protected.

[F31-340i]

Originally Posted by lovemybmw

Hey, I do feel there is a bit missing from this test, well a friend of mine does anyway.

My friend who is a road traffic police officer and investigates many accidents, said that whilst the test is done in a controlled environment they cannot replicate conditions on the roads in changing weather conditions. The main one being where he finds that number of RTAs increase is where the temperature has plunged below 0 degrees and then risen to around 3-5 degrees however there is still ice on the roads in patches, it is in these condition a where winter tyres will have better performance and it is these conditions which tend to be the most dangerous. I.e you feel the road is just wet, have summer tyres on and forget that there may be icy patches and lose traction or do not slow down/drive slower.

Whilst the test is done at 5 degrees and the summers had better wet braking performance, 5degrees wet conditions during the winter is different to these controlled tests.

??? The tests show the winters are better in the wet than the summers?

The summers are only better in the dry - where to be honest total grip is not usually a big issue anyway, so not that relevant IMO, but done for completeness.

[lovemybmw]

Well said lexs, also excellent mpg you have there, is that mainly motorway mileage? Have you mapped to increase bhp and mpg?

I struggle to get that.

[lovemybmw]

//ajd.. The video shows better wet stopping for the summers...

[F31-340i]

Originally Posted by lovemybmw

//ajd.. The video shows better wet stopping for the summers...

So it contradicts the graphs for stopping distance at 4c? Confused?

Edit - I see, the video was at 10c, the graphs at 4c.

[lovemybmw]

Sorry my bad there are two different tests within this thread, one wet in temp around 10degrees and another around 4 degrees.

The one with temp at around 10 degrees states summers are better
One with temp around 4 degrees has top spot for a summer and 2nd and 3rd for a winter tyre in wet handling.

The point I was trying to make is that none of these tests factor in changing weather conditions and road conditions.

For example driving from warmer climate to colder climate, let's say Leeds to north scotland today then whilst Leeds is currently over 10 degrees north Scotland may not be, in situations like this it is recommended to be on winters rather than summers, as which carries the increased risk, stopping in the wet in Leeds on winters at 10 degrees or stopping in the wet in north Scotland at below 7degrees on summers?

I know it's an extreme example but in the winter we do often drive even over shorter distances where the weather conditions and road conditions are different and changing.

My journey where I got stuck last year was from Manchester to Leeds on m62, Manchester was wet and warm, approached Leeds it was cold and snow.

[lovemybmw]

Sorry my bad there are two different tests within this thread, one wet in temp around 10degrees and another around 4 degrees.

The one with temp at around 10 degrees states summers are better
One with temp around 4 degrees has top spot for a summer and 2nd and 3rd for a winter tyre in wet handling.

The point I was trying to make is that none of these tests factor in changing weather conditions and road conditions.

For example driving from warmer climate to colder climate, let's say Leeds to north scotland today then whilst Leeds is currently over 10 degrees north Scotland may not be, in situations like this it is recommended to be on winters rather than summers, as which carries the increased risk, stopping in the wet in Leeds on winters at 10 degrees or stopping in the wet in north Scotland at below 7degrees on summers?

I know it's an extreme example but in the winter we do often drive even over shorter distances where the weather conditions and road conditions are different and changing.

My journey where I got stuck last year was from Manchester to Leeds on m62, Manchester was wet and warm, approached Leeds it was cold and snow.

[- Paul -]

Originally Posted by BarrySt

Intereresting video comparing Michelin summer and winter tyres in 10 C temp on wet low friction track: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/w...-video-review/

My usual sumary:
winter: better for cornering
summer: better for stopping

Well worth a few mins to watch video

Rgds, Barry

And snow test: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/d...es-work-video/
- which is really ammusing: 6-series on summers immobile, 1-series on winters keeps moving. Not scientific but makes a strong point

I know that feeling - exactly the same happened to me when trying to leave work on fresh snow - very embarassing

[lovemybmw]

My work car park was like a showroom for bmws last winter, three 5 series, four 3 series and a 1 series were left overnight as they couldnt get out, this year il try n take a pc if they haven't learnt n got winters lol

[creepy coupe]

The strange thing is, I've managed for 34 years without winter tyres.

[kaishang]

Originally Posted by creepy coupe

The strange thing is, I've managed for 34 years without winter tyres.

This cannot have happened. Your neighbour changed your tyres without telling you.

[creepy coupe]

Originally Posted by kaishang

This cannot have happened. Your neighbour changed your tyres without telling you.

My neighbour couldn't find his Garage with both hands and a map.Let alone change tyres.

[hogbmw]

I think the real point of this video is men vs. women drivers

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by creepy coupe

The strange thing is, I've managed for 34 years without winter tyres.

I think you're telling porkies Del, and if your unlikely tale be true you should be nailed to a crucifix adjacent to the altar of the winter tyre God and shot

[creepy coupe]

Originally Posted by Hotcoupe

I think you're telling porkies Del, and if your unlikely tale be true you should be nailed to a crucifix adjacent to the altar of the winter tyre God and shot

So you think I look younger Ian

[ALF_E90]

I have looked into a lot of similar tests. Most show (in temps ranging up to 15degrees or more) that the best winter tyres are pretty much on a par with the best summers in wet braking and handling - but throw deep standing water into the equation and the winters are always behind (except that this is for new tyres - if you only ran your winters down the 4mm recommended, and ran to the legal limit for summers, then this would be closer much of the time. Neanderthals like me on a narrower tyre setup than M-Sport will also aquaplane less as tyre width is critical).

There are big differences though and it makes sense to pick a winter tyre with good wet/dry road performance for UK conditions - if another winter tyre is a bit better than mine in ice driving well below freezing I don't really care! All winters are infinitely better than summers in ice/snow (see below).

In the dry, most people fail to brake hard enough to even activate the ABS in an emergency. In the wet, grip is much more critical, and good winter tyres match summers in the wet at winter temps - and better them the colder it gets. And on ice/snow winters are around three times better - often more - traction, braking, and cornering.

For all the "shocking 7m longer to stop" commenters above, see the Evo test. Braking from 25mph on snow the winters all stopped in around 20m. Premium summer sports tyres took over 70.

That's 50m more, not 7 - from a crazy low speed, not a "real" one.