[Greg7462]

Hey guys,

Been doing a bunch of research into this. Looking into getting a 320d or 325/330d. Prop around 40k-60k. The sensible me is thinking a 320d since its great on mileage. Doesn't seem all that thrilling to drive tho from what I've read. The fun me is pulling more towards the 330d since I've read nothing but good things (also possibly the 325d?). Official mpg does not seem to differ a whole lot but I'm still on on the fence. I've seen both good and bad forum discussions about the 330d mpg. Opinions? Suggestions? Btw, I mainly do city driving as I live in London. I guess you can also say I have a heavier foot haha

Also, how about reliability for the in-line 4 vs 6? Any tips on what to watch out for when purchasing a e90 diesel with up to 60k on the odometer?

[dxb335d]

320d is a great car, a 330d is a fantastic car. Personally there is no contest.

[The_Bear_Yid]

Dxb - Then would you say the 35d is about performance an not economy?

[dxb335d]

Originally Posted by The_Bear_Yid

Dxb - Then would you say the 35d is about performance an not economy?

The 335d is definitely a performance car. When used as such will not be very frugal. It is still capable of great MPG for sure.

[makkan00]

Here we go, another comparison thread.

[dxb335d]

It will happen to the end of time Makkan mate.

Two very different BMW power plants for different needs. Not really sure how they can be compared.

Compare 318d - 320d. Or 330d - 335d

[335tim]

6 pot vs 4 pot.....no contest is there, surely?

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by Greg7462

Hey guys,

Been doing a bunch of research into this. Looking into getting a 320d or 325/330d. Prop around 40k-60k. The sensible me is thinking a 320d since its great on mileage. Doesn't seem all that thrilling to drive tho from what I've read. The fun me is pulling more towards the 330d since I've read nothing but good things (also possibly the 325d?). Official mpg does not seem to differ a whole lot but I'm still on on the fence. I've seen both good and bad forum discussions about the 330d mpg. Opinions? Suggestions? Btw, I mainly do city driving as I live in London. I guess you can also say I have a heavier foot haha

Also, how about reliability for the in-line 4 vs 6? Any tips on what to watch out for when purchasing a e90 diesel with up to 60k on the odometer?

I suggest you do some more research on problems with a DPF on diesel cars.

With your main driving being in London,a diesel car is not really what you want,as there not best suited in that environment.

If you must buy a diesel,a 330D would be wasted,you'll never get to use the performance the car offers.

[parapaul]

Completely agree - if you're doing mostly city driving, not only will your MPG be rock bottom anyway, but the DPF will never get a chance to regenerate properly leaving you with a premature hefty bill.

I'd definitely be looking at the petrol equivalents.

[mobilejo]

Agree with whats above. Every engine has a purpose and something it is better at than the other cars and thus will bring compromises in other areas.

From a general POV its hard for anyone to tell you whats best for YOU as it depends on whats important to you at the time of buying, however as said, the DPF and London don't go well together. Neither do diesels and short journeys...

[BanziBarn]

Obviously it's got to be a 330d, assuming you're willing to spend a little more on fuel.

Regarding town driving - yes, it's true about the DPF. However, mine is used most of the time around town, and it's been fine (although it's not stop start all the time).

Also, Diesels can be more fun in town because you don't need to rev them to get the performance. For example, when you want to nip round a bus that's pulled over to pick up passengers the diesel will pick up fast and launch you round - which is fun

The problem, IMO with going down the petrol route is that you may feel that the only option will be the 335i if you really want a feeling of performance.

This was the issue I had - the 330i would feel too slow, but the 335i was too expensive, with higher insurance and Road tax. That's why I went for the 330d, it wasn't really that much to do with MPG.

[Dave_3]

Originally Posted by parapaul

..... but the DPF will never get a chance to regenerate properly leaving you with a premature hefty bill.

Not having a pop at you, I know this is often quoted ... but do you think BMW never consider the possibilty that a Diesel car will be bought and run solely in a city environment ? From a logical viewpoint.

I'd find it very odd that their engineering boffins and QA people have overlooked or ignored this completely.

I also use my car almost exclusively in a suburban environment and for short journeys, never had a problem with my DPF.

D.

[BanziBarn]

Even on my last car, Leon FR TDI (which had an awful rep for DPF blockages) I never had any issues.

Perhaps the problem appears worse because a DPF isn't something that you would mention on a forum if it wasn't blocked, so any time you see info on it, it's to do with a problem!

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by dxb335d

It will happen to the end of time Makkan mate.

Two very different BMW power plants for different needs. Not really sure how they can be compared.

Compare 318d - 320d. Or 330d - 335d

v true. I guess fair comparison would be as you mentioned Carlos.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by Hotcoupe

I suggest you do some more research on problems with a DPF on diesel cars.

With your main driving being in London,a diesel car is not really what you want,as there not best suited in that environment.

If you must buy a diesel,a 330D would be wasted,you'll never get to use the performance the car offers.

+ 1
I changed my car as I changed my job. With new job I was intended to do only 12 miles.
Diesel car was not giving me enough economy and hence went for petrol.

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by Dave_3

Not having a pop at you, I know this is often quoted ... but do you think BMW never consider the possibilty that a Diesel car will be bought and run solely in a city environment ? From a logical viewpoint.

I'd find it very odd that their engineering boffins and QA people have overlooked or ignored this completely.

I also use my car almost exclusively in a suburban environment and for short journeys, never had a problem with my DPF.

D.

Dave, the problem with City/short journey driving and DPF's is not a problem exclusive to BMW's,other marques do experience exactly the same problem (I'm sure you know this).

I've read countless stories of people who's main priority when purchasing a car (not all BMW's) is MPG (not generally those buying a performance car), and most Salespeople will recommend a diesel without asking what type of journeys the purchaser will generally be doing in the car they are looking to buy.

I'm quite sure that the boffins at BMW HQ ( and at other manufacturers HQ's) have not overlooked/ignored what could be a problem with a DPF and city/short journey driving,and that information is probably passed down to the dealer networks.

The problem is that salespeople don't ask the right questions,as they are only interested in a sale.
Diesels are generally more expensive than petrols,generate more commision (cynical hat on),and I don't think I need to go on..........

I'm more than happy to be corrected on this,but I wouldn't buy a diesel if my journeys were going to be exclusively city/short journeys.

[Dave_3]

I am aware of when my regeneration cycle kicks in, and just drive to let it finish - and use good Diesel so hopefully less likely to experience any problems. But I am sure BMW has set the ECU to really force regenerations when needed - I have felt my regen cycle kick in very early into a journey at speeds less than 30mph, contrary to what I see a lot of people quote for conditions for regeneration.

I know you can't cover all the ways people drive, and are limited by the length of drive but the manufacturers must be improving this.

I agree, a little, small-engined petrol Fiesta with small radiator would probably be better suited to my driving 95% of the time.

D.

Originally Posted by Hotcoupe

Dave, the problem with City/short journey driving and DPF's is not a problem exclusive to BMW's,other marques do experience exactly the same problem (I'm sure you know this).

I've read countless stories of people who's main priority when purchasing a car (not all BMW's) is MPG (not generally those buying a performance car), and most Salespeople will recommend a diesel without asking what type of journeys the purchaser will generally be doing in the car they are looking to buy.

I'm quite sure that the boffins at BMW HQ ( and at other manufacturers HQ's) have not overlooked/ignored what could be a problem with a DPF and city/short journey driving,and that information is probably passed down to the dealer networks.

The problem is that salespeople don't ask the right questions,as they are only interested in a sale.
Diesels are generally more expensive than petrols,generate more commision (cynical hat on),and I don't think I need to go on..........

I'm more than happy to be corrected on this,but I wouldn't buy a diesel if my journeys were going to be exclusively city/short journeys.

[rich1068]

If it was my money and a diesel was required I'd go for a 325d auto.

As far as economy is concerned I only average about 34mpg with by far the majority of my driving done in town. About 400 miles to a tank and average 15/16 mph. They're figures from the onboard computer and I don't think it's been reset since I got the car 10k miles ago. I'd say about one in five fill ups is for a proper long run and then obviously these figures improve considerably.

No DPF problems to report. But depending on where abouts in that London I guess traffic is lighter Oop North.

[ELD70]

I have been running a 2010 E91 325dse for last two months and am very impressed with the engine. Seems to shift well and 50mpg on the motorways, makes a nice noise as well. Worth bearing in mind if one comes along in the right spec/price.

[mobilejo]

Originally Posted by Dave_3

I'd find it very odd that their engineering boffins and QA people have overlooked or ignored this completely.

The same boffins that let any monkey with a laptop and equipment for sale on ebay drive away with our cars in under 3 minutes?

The same boffins who deny that the recent thefts is even an issue as the cars "meet EU regulations"?

The same boffins who designed the cracking (literally) alloys for the e9x?

The same boffins who made the early e46 subframes which were cracking left, right and centre?

Also - swirl flaps, anyone?

I don't think that as informed consumers, we should just 'leave it BMW to make sure its okay', as they have proved time and time again that are not susceptible to fail (like all car makers) and then covering up the extent of that failure.

We need to use the info that has been gained from other users' experience and just be aware of potential pitfalls I think.

I don't know 100% whether a DPF used exclusively in stop start traffic will give any problems - alot of you guys haven't had any, but it's good that there are forums where people have discovered that the same circumstances have caused problems for some people and it might just be something to look out for when buying.

[Dave_3]

Originally Posted by mobilejo

I don't think that as informed consumers, we should just 'leave it BMW to make sure its okay', as they have proved time and time again that are not susceptible to fail (like all car makers) and then covering up the extent of that failure.

I never for one minute suggested "leaving it BMW to make sure its okay'.

As the greater percentage of BMW cars sold are now Diesels, seen purely from a cost viewpoint (warranty claims, let's be realistic) I am sure that BMW are aware and have, or are, designing/improving their cars with the capability of running them in purely city environments.

Forget any other reason, it doesn't make good fiscal sense to produce the majority of your product that is not suited to town driving, which will cost you on warranty claims. BMW want to make money.

And to put that into perspective, I don't recall reading about many DPF issues during my 6 year stay here. I should have heard of many stories by now.

As you say "we need to use the info that has been gained from other users' experience ". There are many of us who have been running a Diesel in a city environment without any issue whatsoever for years now. It won't be the topic of a thread, or be the topic of banter down the pub when it all works as it should.

[having said that, reaches for desk : knock, knock]

D.

[rich1068]

I think there are DPFs and DPFs or ECUs and ECUs. From my time on the Audi forums a few years ago I remember many complaints about the 140 and 170 TDIs going into limp mode with a DPF being the cause. I guess other VAG cars with the same units experienced the same thing. I remember one vocal ex-Audi owning member pointing out that other manufacturers (BMW was mentioned) used similar technology but didn't seem to suffer anywhere near the same rates of failure.