How BMW tested and built our engine.

[MaximusB]

Found this video today, not sure if it's old but It's pretty neat to watch.

http://jalopnik.com/this-is-how-bmw-...-m3-1791112839

...and no one there caught the rod bearing issue..

[Solo_M_Tech]

The rod bearing issue doesn't constitute a 100% failure rate across all S65's buit. If you built 100 engines (let alone thousands) using the same methods you would have a certain percentage of failures. Its very possible the engineers never noticed an issue because there never found one on the engines they tested. Food for thought.

[GRUESOM3]

Originally Posted by Uber///M

The rod bearing issue doesn't constitute a 100% failure rate across all S65's buit. If you built 100 engines (let alone thousands) using the same methods you would have a certain percentage of failures. Its very possible the engineers never noticed an issue because there never found one on the engines they tested. Food for thought.

Ones that failed were built the day after Octoberfest.

[Sephiroth]

It failed on the S85 and the S65. I bet they knew but the cost/benefit didn't make sense for them to fix. Warranty failures would be covered but after that they don't care.

[Rajmun340]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

It failed on the S85 and the S65. I bet they knew but the cost/benefit didn't make sense for them to fix. Warranty failures would be covered but after that they don't care.

That's only your speculation. They most likely found nothing wrong at all.

It looks like this engine testroom cannot test at different ambient temperatures. They ran the engine red hot in the video but that means the oil reached warm temperatures first to protect the engine. What they didn't do is freeze that room overnight then cold start, run normaly for couple minutes then floor it. Also the pitch from the video does not sound like redline.

[Bimmed Out]

Oh great, another rod bearings thread.

[eyanez1230]

Originally Posted by kepler

Oh great, another rod bearings thread.

My thoughts exactly

[Ink09]

Originally Posted by GRUESOM3

Ones that failed were built the day after Octoberfest.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by JoeM3SSII

That's only your speculation. They most likely found nothing wrong at all.

It looks like this engine testroom cannot test at different ambient temperatures. They ran the engine red hot in the video but that means the oil reached warm temperatures first to protect the engine. What they didn't do is freeze that room overnight then cold start, run normaly for couple minutes then floor it. Also the pitch from the video does not sound like redline.

Are you serious ?

The S85 is produced from 2005=>2010 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
The S65 is produced from 2007=>2013 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
///M BMW made not once but twice the same mistake !
And they replaced worldwide S65-S85 engines from 2005 => 2017. And in the years ahead .....

About your freeze temps in the testroom...
Do you know that 70% of the S65-S85 worldwide bearing failures happened in countries where it never freezes ?

This are facts and not speculation . One thing was/is speculation , it's BMWs financial speculation.

[6ixSpd]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Are you serious ?

The S85 is produced from 2005=>2010 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
The S65 is produced from 2007=>2013 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
///M BMW made not once but twice the same mistake !

*4 times The S54 and S62 also suffered from bearing failures, as did some of the S50B32... Hell I know personally know of one S63 X5M with bearing failure just a few months into ownership from new.

[Munichm3]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Are you serious ?

The S85 is produced from 2005=>2010 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
The S65 is produced from 2007=>2013 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
///M BMW made not once but twice the same mistake !
And they replaced worldwide S65-S85 engines from 2005 => 2017. And in the years ahead .....

About your freeze temps in the testroom...
Do you know that 70% of the S65-S85 worldwide bearing failures happened in countries where it never freezes ?

This are facts and not speculation . One thing was/is speculation , it's BMWs financial speculation.

Just curious, but where are you getting these exact facts from?

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Munichm3

Just curious, but where are you getting these exact facts from?

1- From this forum
2- I stored in the last 4 years the worldwide bearing failures in my database
3- Private information
4- And from here => http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=786615

[Solo_M_Tech]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

1- From this forum
2- I stored in the last 4 years the worldwide bearing failures in my database
3- Private information
4- And from here => http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=786615

I love how people question you like you are not the definitive source for rod bearing and weird noises these cars make lol.

[roastbeef]

didn't jalopnik come out with something a few months back saying all bmw engines were garbage?

[MaximusB]

Originally Posted by roastbeef

didn't jalopnik come out with something a few months back saying all bmw engines were garbage?

Yep but it was from a different author, and he got most of his information from BMW forums. Here is that article.

http://thegarage.jalopnik.com/bmw-en...hit-1784684330

[Rajmun340]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Are you serious ?

The S85 is produced from 2005=>2010 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
The S65 is produced from 2007=>2013 ,and BMW saw bearing failures..
///M BMW made not once but twice the same mistake !
And they replaced worldwide S65-S85 engines from 2005 => 2017. And in the years ahead .....

You have to understand how engineering companies work. The design team that develops and tests new engine products -call it the A team- and the technical support team that supports an existing engine product -call it the B team- are disconnected from each other, never the same people, not the same caliber and 20:1, size ratio. The A team is made from industry world class grade top design engineers, B team is made from low grade application engineers usually people not smart enough to be in design. Issues with existing engines are addressed by B team and have to be very significant to disturb the A team precious time off from working on the next generation engine. Actually the A team works on an engine 3-4 years before production date and the design is frozen at least a year before production. The S65 was released in 2007, the A team stopped (re)design on it in 2006. The S85 engine started production in 2005, that left only 1 overlapping year for RB issue to emerge be taken seriously by B team and relayed over to A team. It did not happen. 1 overlapping year window was not enough for S85 RB failure to catch attention and concern. After that, there is no return unless the problem is serious enough to cause legal concern or negative return. It didn't. I have no doubt test engineers who worked in that engine room were not aware of any RB issue about the S85 when this was filmed. [/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

About your freeze temps in the testroom...
Do you know that 70% of the S65-S85 worldwide bearing failures happened in countries where it never freezes ?

Off course i knew Phil, you know me better than that. What i meant is no test over ambient temperature was done as it would be for a military product. I should have given an example of oven like ambient temp instead of the only source of heat being the engine itself.

Those are industry standards and will be closer to corporate reality than outsiders speculating that bmw ignored the issue.

What is certain is the issue was known by bmw when they started design on the F8x gen. The evolution to more stringent emissions regulation was convenient to justify the shift away from NA to FI. But even without that , they were probably coerced to get away from semi-exotic engine issues that didn't fit their commercial high volume goals by their financial team.

[Flying Ace]

My rod bearings smell like hofbrau Weißbier

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

1- From this forum
2- I stored in the last 4 years the worldwide bearing failures in my database
3- Private information
4- And from here => http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=786615

On your list/database, What is your total number of failures?

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Patrón

On your list/database, What is your total number of failures?

You received a PM ..

[Agent-GHQ]

Can you pls pm me too that info, thx

[nholmes]

.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Agent-GHQ

Can you pls pm me too that info, thx

You have a PM...