Porsche 997.2 Turbo S experience?

[Daxos]

My M4 which is modified with bolt ons has developed a strange behavior in what appears to be a slipping clutch. My shop is investigating the issue, but it may be a reoccurring issue. A clutch pack would most likely address it, but I'm unsure about putting more money into the car at this point.

Then I saw a pretty good deal on a used 2011 Porsche 997.2 Turbo S.
Does anyone on here have any first hand experience with this car? How does it compare to a tuned ~500whp M4 in cornering, straight line, every day etc situations? I use my M4 as weekend toy as well as occasional everyday driver and am not concerned at all about backseats.

I'm just keeping my options open at this point so no serious plans yet or I'd check out Rennlist but I figured someone on here might have some experience and can chime in on how the two cars compare.

[FC]

I had a 997.1 TT for 3 years and if you don't need the rear seats, that car was in a different universe. I loved it, but I need a sedan, so once they boys outgrew the back seats I sold it. I''ll be getting an F80.

[FC4]

You're asking how an M4 compares to a 997 Turbo S? They're both German, have two doors, six cylinders, two turbos, and four wheels. I'd say they're damn near the same.

[saeyedoc]

Originally Posted by FC4

You're asking how an M4 compares to a 997 Turbo S? They're both German, have two doors, six cylinders, two turbos, and four wheels. I'd say they're damn near the same.

Yeah right

[Daxos]

Originally Posted by FC4

You're asking how an M4 compares to a 997 Turbo S? They're both German, have two doors, six cylinders, two turbos, and four wheels. I'd say they're damn near the same.

That is exactly the information I was looking for.

[qspring]

I drove a stock 991 Turbo S around the track, and it didn't pull as hard as my modded M4.

If I had the same amount of mods on the Turbo S, it would be quite the opposite. If you plan on modding the 997 - I would go for it. Sounds better too.

[A418t81]

A stock Turbo S is a 10 second car, at 126-ish mph. That's faster than an average piggyback/flashed F8x on drag radials.

The 997.2s are great cars. The engines are the new 9A1 direct injection motors. MUCH more reliable and less expensive to maintain than the older Mezger, but a bit less character as well. They respond very well to a tune and exhaust, and will make 560-570 hp and well over 600 ft/lbs at the wheels on pure 93. The high pressure fuel pump is the weak link and can't support really any kind of ethanol blend. People who are looking to make more power than that run meth injection.

They are a lot of fun and would be an easy daily driver. With the 997.1 on one end feeling old school, and the F8x on the other end feeling totally modern, the 997.2 is about half way and a good blend of both.

[Daxos]

Originally Posted by qspring

I drove a stock 991 Turbo S around the track, and it didn't pull as hard as my modded M4.

If I had the same amount of mods on the Turbo S, it would be quite the opposite. If you plan on modding the 997 - I would go for it. Sounds better too.

Sounds like we have similar mods on our car. I'm surprised the 991 Turbo S didn't feel as strong considering it's a car running in the 10's at ~130mph.

Since the car I'm looking at is a 2011 which would be out of warranty anyway I'd probably look at getting some basic mods done, too.

[Daxos]

Originally Posted by A418t81

A stock Turbo S is a 10 second car, at 126-ish mph. That's faster than an average piggyback/flashed F8x on drag radials.

The 997.2s are great cars. The engines are the new 9A1 direct injection motors. MUCH more reliable and less expensive to maintain than the older Mezger, but a bit less character as well. They respond very well to a tune and exhaust, and will make 560-570 hp and well over 600 ft/lbs at the wheels on pure 93. The high pressure fuel pump is the weak link and can't support really any kind of ethanol blend. People who are looking to make more power than that run meth injection.

They are a lot of fun and would be an easy daily driver. With the 997.1 on one end feeling old school, and the F8x on the other end feeling totally modern, the 997.2 is about half way and a good blend of both.

Thank you. This is the kind of information I am looking for.
The HPFP being the weak link, is it anything like in the e9x 335's that had massive issues, or is just limiting the car to 93 octane?

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by qspring

I drove a stock 991 Turbo S around the track, and it didn't pull as hard as my modded M4.

If I had the same amount of mods on the Turbo S, it would be quite the opposite. If you plan on modding the 997 - I would go for it. Sounds better too.

Hm...sounds way off given a stock 991 turbo S runs high 10s at 130 mph. The new 2017 turbo S is a mid 10 car with a 132 mph trap. It take a 700 WHP M3/4 with Pure turbos upgrade to run/trap what a 580 crank hp turbo S runs.

Originally Posted by A418t81

A stock Turbo S is a 10 second car, at 126-ish mph. That's faster than an average piggyback/flashed F8x on drag radials.

The 997.2s are great cars. The engines are the new 9A1 direct injection motors. MUCH more reliable and less expensive to maintain than the older Mezger, but a bit less character as well. They respond very well to a tune and exhaust, and will make 560-570 hp and well over 600 ft/lbs at the wheels on pure 93. The high pressure fuel pump is the weak link and can't support really any kind of ethanol blend. People who are looking to make more power than that run meth injection.

They are a lot of fun and would be an easy daily driver. With the 997.1 on one end feeling old school, and the F8x on the other end feeling totally modern, the 997.2 is about half way and a good blend of both.

The 997.2 turbo S were a ~129 speed. As I said above the 991.1 was ~130 and now the .2 turbo S ~132. If you want to mod for big hp, a 997.1 would be the way to go.

[nicknaz]

+1 on Mezger engine for modding. There's also the nostalgia factor since it's an old school Le Mans winner engine

I think 997 TT with mods will compare favorably to modded f80. Having a lot of fun in my modded 996TT after an f80

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by qspring

I drove a stock 991 Turbo S around the track, and it didn't pull as hard as my modded M4.

If I had the same amount of mods on the Turbo S, it would be quite the opposite. If you plan on modding the 997 - I would go for it. Sounds better too.

Math doesn't add up here. There are very few cars sub exotics or super cars that can touch a 991 turbo S. And even if your modded M4 pulled remotely close in terms of power, nothing else was even close.

[A418t81]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

Hm...sounds off given a stock 991 turbo S runs high 10s at 130 mph. The new 2017 turbo S is a mid 10 car with a 132 mph trap. It take a 700 WHP M3/4 with Pure turbos upgrade to run/trap what a 580 crank hp turbo S runs.



The 997.2 turbo S were a ~129 speed. As I said above the 991.1 was ~130 and now the .2 turbo S ~132. If you want to mod for big hp, a 997.1 would be the way to go.

I have friends with 997.2TTs and the average stock one is nowhere near 129. At our actual local drag strip, stock they were running 122-126 depending on weather and car prep. The best I ever saw from a stock one was 127.xx, and that was in cold weather, since our strip is open in the winter, with excellent cool down, and lowered tire pressures.

Longboarder, who is arguably the individual most pushing the envelope of the 997.2TT performance market and who can drive the hell out of his car, trapped 130 with a tune.

Note, I'm talking real world drag strip traps, not C&D-style instrumented tests that don't average the speed at the end of the simulated 1'4 mile.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by A418t81

I have friends with 997.2TTs and the average stock one is nowhere near 129. At our actual local drag strip, stock they were running 122-126 depending on weather and car prep. The best I ever saw from a stock one was 127.xx, and that was in cold weather, since our strip is open in the winter, with excellent cool down, and lowered tire pressures.

Longboarder, who is arguably the individual most pushing the envelope of the 997.2TT performance market and who can drive the hell out of his car, trapped 130 with a tune.

Note, I'm talking real world drag strip traps, not C&D-style instrumented tests that don't average the speed at the end of the simulated 1'4 mile.

I was referring to this one, 10.6@129.8 bone stock.

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...-1-4-mile.html

There's also several other in that thread with runs they say were 10.9@127 on winter tires, and another who says he ran 10.7@129 and a 10.75@129. Definitely capable of it. Atco and Englishtown are definitely fast tracks.

The 991s are much faster though, which says a lot.

[qspring]

Originally Posted by ASAP

Math doesn't add up here. There are very few cars sub exotics or super cars that can touch a 991 turbo S. And even if your modded M4 pulled remotely close in terms of power, nothing else was even close.

Sorry to burst your bubble - I'm just sharing my hands on driving experience. I was expecting to feel the car was faster considering the 991 turbo S is a dream car of mine! Also, should have noted, the car I drove was 991.1 S which on paper has 552 bhp/ 553 ft/lb tq.

Comparing a modded/tuned car to a stock car isn't a fair comparison. I'm not sure why it seems so far off. My experience was on a track course, not straight line. My M4 makes 510 whp/540 ft lb of tq at the wheels.

Take it for what it's worth. At the end of day, if I was going to modify a turbo S (997, 991.1, or 991.2) I would take it over my M4. My point to the OP is that if he was going to keep the 997 in OEM form, he would might feel underwhelmed as I did.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by qspring

the car I drove was 991.1 S which on paper has 552 bhp/ 553 ft/lb tq.

. My M4 makes 510 whp/540 ft lb of tq at the wheels.

.

That's similar weight and similar power, no surprise you weren't overwhelmed.

[Cameronc08]

Originally Posted by qspring

I drove a stock 991 Turbo S around the track, and it didn't pull as hard as my modded M4.

If I had the same amount of mods on the Turbo S, it would be quite the opposite. If you plan on modding the 997 - I would go for it. Sounds better too.

I'm not calling you a liar, but I find that VERY hard to believe..

[CPWINCH]

P car is a better car in all regards

[RIP1981]

Hi,

Problems here are: even a comparable powered M4 should still be considerably slower.

A 510 whp or 560+ bhp rwd car, especially with that much torque, will spin the wheels hard below 60 mph and even above.
Depending on the track, you even get traction problems with a stock M3/M4 right now which always has to decrease the power, is either blinking wild in MDM mode or with ESP completely off will constantly trying to put down the power in huge drifts sideways ...

The 911 Turbo S, no matter if 997 or even 991, will always put down every single hp and move forward with it.

In higher speeds I guess it should have less drag because it has a smaller front surface.

____________

Both but especially the 991, should be considerable faster on the track with corners. The more corners, the quicker they should be. The more low speed corners the gap should even get wider.

But yes, you may not feel THAT much of a difference compared to a tuned M4, because the M4 may still be a bit lighter und loses less power with rwd compared to awd as soon it gets rolling. So from the roll there should be near to none difference.
But on a track there are more factors. With similar tyres the Porsche should always be quicker around the track. I guess even the 997.2 Turbo S is ...

[996ttelise]

Originally Posted by qspring

Sorry to burst your bubble - I'm just sharing my hands on driving experience. I was expecting to feel the car was faster considering the 991 turbo S is a dream car of mine! Also, should have noted, the car I drove was 991.1 S which on paper has 552 bhp/ 553 ft/lb tq.

Comparing a modded/tuned car to a stock car isn't a fair comparison. I'm not sure why it seems so far off. My experience was on a track course, not straight line. My M4 makes 510 whp/540 ft lb of tq at the wheels.

Take it for what it's worth. At the end of day, if I was going to modify a turbo S (997, 991.1, or 991.2) I would take it over my M4. My point to the OP is that if he was going to keep the 997 in OEM form, he would might feel underwhelmed as I did.

Underwhelming on a road course and the focus is on hp??? Apparently not driving anywhere near the limits. I race[d] open wheel FA and CA and GT3 cup as my track car frame of reference. I have run many hot laps in the PSDS 991 turbos around Barber and never walked away underwhelmed . . . then again, I could overwhelm you as passenger in my little 220hp 1,680 lb modified Elise with a passenger seat. I have had many a head instructor for various car clubs walk away saying that was the wildest ride they ever had and it is slloooowwww in the straights. Learn car control and get back out there, see what the 991 will really do and forget about straight line acceleration. Once you get below 3 its all the same.

[gmd2003]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

I was referring to this one, 10.6@129.8 bone stock.

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...-1-4-mile.html

There's also several other in that thread with runs they say were 10.9@127 on winter tires, and another who says he ran 10.7@129 and a 10.75@129. Definitely capable of it. Atco and Englishtown are definitely fast tracks.

The 991s are much faster though, which says a lot.

+1 This is what my 991.2 Turbo S does with just exhaust , otherwise 100% stock on 93 octane. Bring on a JB4 m4 at any speed lol.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by gmd2003

+1 This is what my 991.2 Turbo S does with just exhaust , otherwise 100% stock on 93 octane. Bring on a JB4 m4 at any speed lol.

Yes, no way a 510 WHP M3 is keeping up with a 997.2 turbo S let alone a 991.1 or 991.2 turbo S.

It takes an M3/4 with nearly 200 more hp just to keep pace with a stock 991.1/.2 turbo S.

And to say that on track, where a turbo S has incredibly devastating pace, it was underwhelming just sounds like someone either wasn't driving it hard or just not really assessing what the car really does.

And up top or from a roll, a 911 turbo pulls much harder than an M3/4. The AWD system will put down 100% of the power to the rear in dry conditions.

Here is a 590 HP M4 vs a stock 991.1 turbo S. So in reality, he is probably making 530 WHP or so and gets left in the dust.