Hey 6MT guys - Anyone have experience with STi?

[Captain45]

My current fun summer car is an 06 STi. Obviously I'm looking into moving into an M3 or I wouldn't be here but I'm trying to get some opinions before purchasing. I really don't want this to turn into a DCT vs 6MT debate but I've heard some reviews on the M3's 6MT and it's spongy notchy feel. Anyone have any comparison to the Subaru STi's 6MT?

I've only been able to test drive DCT 335IS's as there aren't a lot of M3's in my area. In short I love it but i'd like to experience an M3 MT for comparison, but until I can find one to test drive, I'm just getting some 3rd party opinions.

Thanks.

[tibra1]

I only do MTs..

[Captain45]

Originally Posted by tibra1

I only do MTs..

Cool...How do you feel it compares to past cars you have owned or driven? Better, Worse, Just Different?

[davedave]

i drove 04 STI few times few years ago, not sure how 04 compare to 06. To be honest, i don't like the throw of STI 6 speeds because it is too long. i had my 08 6MT e92 for 3 years and i like it a lot.

i had the following stick shift before
s2000, RSX-s, Evo 8, E92 M3

[Lorde]

I moved up from a 400whp STI (2007MY). Do it. Shifter is far better than an STI. I do miss the car for winter driving, which there wasn't much of in the DC Metro area this year.

[zblake]

Wow, where are you? 335IS's are far more rare in Norcal (at least in my travel's) than e9X M3's. The 6MT is good in my opinion except 1-2 shift. 2-3 is fine, 3-4 is bitchen especially when you're really getting on it. 4-5 is a little awkward, 5-6 is good. All down shifts are great, even a 6-3 move, can't recall doing a bigger drop than that.

Never driven an STi so can't really help there.

Good luck for what its worth!
Z

[tibra1]

Originally Posted by Captain45

Cool...How do you feel it compares to past cars you have owned or driven? Better, Worse, Just Different?

Honestly I just prefer the engagement and rowing of an MT..by no means is it "quicker" than a DCT.. thats for sure..it boils down to a human vs a computer shifting the gears..the MT is more visceral and makes you more in touch with the car imo..even more so in the M3..the gearbox feels a bit notchy but i dont mind that

[Captain45]

Originally Posted by Snig

I moved up from a 350whp STI (2007MY). Do it. Shifter is far better than an STI. I do miss the car for winter driving, which there wasn't much of in the DC Metro area this year.

Good to know. I have come to love the 6MT of my STi, if the M3 is better then that is comforting. Out of curiousity, how did you like the performance change from STi to M3? IE going from a 300hp/300lb 4 turbo to a high reving V8 Monster? Did the M3 feel significantly faster with harder pulls? How about cornering? Sometimes I get a bit bored in the corners with my STi......it just feels TOO safe sometimes, as if I am never on the limits of grip.


To the other Poster: I live up in Michigan. The Dealer owner picked up 2 new 355is's and a used corporate owned one. I took that Corporate owned one out for a spin and man did it have some pull on the low end. I guess I'm used to the STi's 3.5k RPM Turbo spool up time.

[Singletrack]

Originally Posted by Captain45

My current fun summer car is an 06 STi. Obviously I'm looking into moving into an M3 or I wouldn't be here but I'm trying to get some opinions before purchasing. I really don't want this to turn into a DCT vs 6MT debate but I've heard some reviews on the M3's 6MT and it's spongy notchy feel. Anyone have any comparison to the Subaru STi's 6MT?

I've only been able to test drive DCT 335IS's as there aren't a lot of M3's in my area. In short I love it but i'd like to experience an M3 MT for comparison, but until I can find one to test drive, I'm just getting some 3rd party opinions.

Thanks.

I had an 04 STi; late 03 build.

STi 6 speed is far superior and more accurate IMHO. Although I like the stock knob better in the M3.

At first it will bother you because the throws are very long in comparison, but the stock shifter will become very smooth, even though it is not precise. 2nd is a bit notchy at times and the throw to 5th can be a little odd.

I'm currently using the UUC SSK and am happy with it. Shorter throws, and more precise, but not really a much quicker engagement IMO. More notchy than stock. There are some other options out there that change the whole carrier, like the rogue unit. Supposedly there is some increase in noise transmitted into the cabin as a result of the solid setup. No appreciable change on the UUC that I have noticed.

Other option is to extend the threads on the stocker, and cut it to make it shorter and/or add a shorter knob.

[mdosu]

for what it's worth, I moved from a stock Evo 8 to a E90 M3 6MT. The shifter is a bit notchy and vague. At times, I miss 3rd or 5th. I've also complained that the stick is also a bit too short, my elbow hits the arm rest compartment. Though, it could be the armrest is a bit too big.

Also, some has swapped to the ZHP knob, which is a shorty, and I dont' know how they do it, it's evern a shorter stick. As with the clutch, it's lighter than the Evo's and an overall easier MT to drive than the Evo. Your feel and legs will thank you when you're stuck in traffic.

[urBan_dK]

The clutch and shift knob are the one mar on an otherwise wonderful driver's platform on the M3. I have driven STIs, owned an Evo, and still own an S2000. While the STI is the worst of those three (far worse than the S2000 - best shifter feel I've ever experienced) they are all better than the M3.

M3 is rubbery, vague, notchy, and too long. Clutch pedal travel is too long, too light, and hard to find the engagement point. You can mitigate this all somewhat with a few common mods.

Every performance car has a weakness. The Evo was the lame interior. The S2000 is the bad steering feel. The M3 - sadly - is the clutch.

[Singletrack]

I think the clutch in the M3 is actually better once you get the hang of it...easier to modulate when necessary. But I'm sure a lot of it is personal preference. I thought it was too light initially too, but now love it.

[hieu1004]

I owned a newer WRX and a 2011 STi - both manual transmissions. I had short shifter for the STi but it's stock with the M3, so the comparison for length of throw isn't fair. However, the STi shifter feels a bit more notchy than the M3. The M3 is much more smooth in comparison.

As far as power goes, the M3's V8 power is very linear (w/a very flat usable torque curve) so it does not "feel" as fast as the sudden spool of turbo, but it is definitely fast(er). I admit, having 18psi of boost on call is definitely great, but having a 400+ hp V8 is crazy fun - especially one that revs to 8300! With the STi, I had some suspension upgrades (RCE Yellows & Sways) and it still doesn't come near to the M3's handling characteristics and confidence. The STi is a bit more "raw" while the M3 is a lot more refined. One thing I miss is how easy it is to make power with a turbo, but it's not enough to make me go back.

The cars are very different and you'll just have to test drive one to see for yourself - it is a very different driving dynamic. Be warned, once you test drive one, you might have to buy it.

[bentone]

Originally Posted by zblake

Wow, where are you? 335IS's are far more rare in Norcal (at least in my travel's) than e9X M3's. The 6MT is good in my opinion except 1-2 shift. 2-3 is fine, 3-4 is bitchen especially when you're really getting on it. 4-5 is a little awkward, 5-6 is good. All down shifts are great, even a 6-3 move, can't recall doing a bigger drop than that.

Never driven an STi so can't really help there.

Good luck for what its worth!
Z

+1, all is good except 1/2. 2nd gear engagement has a strange feel that is tough to describe and difficult to do well. 2/3 and 3/4 make up for it. But in general the entire experience is that your right hand is definitely attached to a V8, as in a recent Vette or GTO. Really interesting experience in a German car, and somehow more pronounced than in an E39 540 or M5. I'm a fan of Subarus and recall that the STI was immediately familiar, although it required less effort (clutch and throw) than most comparable performance cars which can sometimes translate to a lack of feel. Hands down the best shifting car I've driven was my 1M. Buttery perfection with a punch in the chest payoff. No comparison to the E90 soundtrack, but that's for another thread...

[hieu1004]

^Yes, I agree with the others about the 1-2 shift - I noticed it was a bit strange at first too. It is a bit more notchy and takes a little more effort than the other gears - but it's not too bad.

[AlteredBe4st]

6spd, but you will have to change the shifter knob, it's hollow and feels rubbery, I did the ZHP shift knob and it made a difference. I came from a 6spd G35 and liked the knotchy feel of the G35 shorter throws, the M3 throw are smoother but the shift knob is shitty. Nice upgrade from the STI good luck, I am currently looking into an 02/03 WRX as a daily with a few mods any input on pros and cons?

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...6#post11626256

[OwenyOlgao]

i don't like the throw of STI 6 speeds because it is too long

[Sharkdriver]

So, here is my list of cars I have owned:

S2000 6MT
Porsche 928 5MT
Porsche 968 6MT
E92 M3 6MT

and I have spent significant time in a 2008 STI 6MT with an SPT short shifter. By far my favorite is the S2000 as has been mentioned before and the Porsche 968 is close behind that. Very very different feel between those two. The S2000 is short and direct while the 968 is much longer but just as direct and precise. I mention this to point out that a shift can be relatively long but still have great precision and no slop like the 968 and be a great driving experience.

On the flip side of that, I don't have a huge problem with the M3 stick shift. Could it be better? Definitely. It is a bit vague and have some problems with the 1-2 shift but it is not this horrific shifter than absolutely ruins the driving experience. Far from it. I still think it is better than the STI with the SPT shifter. Nice short shifts with the STI but very notchy. I actually like the STI shifter stock better without the SPT short shifter better.

Just my opinions.

[DARK_M3]

I don't know how similar the STi is to an Evo but I had an Evo IX with the 5 speed manual. It was a stock shifter with aftermarket weighted shift knob. I found that to be easy to operate and really easy to heal/toe shift.

Then I went to a 370z with the 6MT. I had a B&M short shifter put in with the stock knob which was weighted. Best OEM knob I've ever encountered. With SRM every shift up or down was perfect and I really got used to that. I never encountered any problems/difficulty with vibrations or shifting although I know some have. Excellent gear box.

Now I have the M3 6MT. First of all, I had to get used to not having SRM. I was spoiled rotten with it and every manual car should come with this option IMO. It's a no brainer. I don't find the M3 as easy as the Evo IX to heel/toe with and part of that is the engine being so different and on a smaller scale, the pedals are slightly different obviously. The other thing that was throwing me off was going from a short shifter to a long throw with a lightweight knob to boot. Yowzaa! I missed third today while lead footing it up a hill. (how embarrasing) Of course the big grind didn't sit too well with me either.

On a whole, I like the shifting in the M3 as it is seemingly butter smooth while just cruising around (better than both previous cars especially the 370z). Spirited driving however is taking a bit of getting used to. Especially with the oh-so-touchy "power" and the dreaded-super-touchy "power plus" modes. But I am getting the hang of it. Need to figure out a different knob however that has some weight to it as the stocker is no good IMO.

I don't know if that helps at all.

[THE TECH]

PM user ILSMKU. He's owned 5 or 6 of them.

[///Montreal3]

Having a 2004 STi 6speed at my disposal killed getting an M3 in manual. I still drove a 6MT M3 to be sure, but did not like it at all compared to the STi 6speed with Kartboy SSK and Kartboy bushings.

Obviously I haven't had extended seat time in a 6MT M3, and I wouldn't know what one feels like with a SSK and/or bushings, so hopefully others will continue to chime in.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by DARK_M3

On a whole, I like the shifting in the M3 as it is seemingly butter smooth while just cruising around (better than both previous cars especially the 370z). Spirited driving however is taking a bit of getting used to. Especially with the oh-so-touchy "power" and the dreaded-super-touchy "power plus" modes. But I am getting the hang of it. Need to figure out a different knob however that has some weight to it as the stocker is no good IMO.

I don't know if that helps at all.

I just leave the "power" button off. It changes all the engagement points and makes your life miserable as you're used to using normal all the time anyway.

Having owned all Japanese cars (Civic Si, 240SX, Evo 8, Evo X) with manual transmissions, the M3's 6MT is by far the worst manual I have ever driven. As others have mentioned, it is fine in every day driving but hard when driving fast.